Wednesday, December 5, 2012

Starrcade 96 Question

Help me with my foggy memory, but why the hell was Hogan Piper non title? I didnt pick up on WCW till early 97 right around their Superbrawl rematch, but could you imagine Wrestlemania having (jsut as an example) Champion CM Punk vs John Cena NON TITLE???? I guess they were so far ahead of WWF at the time that they could fuck over the fans and still not lose much ratings wise that would affect them?

My issue wasn't really the non-title aspect, because they wanted to put Piper over but not change the title and that makes sense.  My issue was that they didn't ADVERTISE it as non-title, and in fact didn't even mention it until after the match was over.  I would have been fine with that as the main event of something like World War III to build up to a title match at Starrcade, but the timing here was really weird.  

And yeah, WCW fucked over the fans constantly but had so much momentum that it never seemed to catch up to them.  The Robin Hood episode of Nitro, for instance?  Endless nWo run-in finishes?  Ending the hummer angle without ever revealing who the hired gun doing Kevin Nash's dirty work was?  Hashtag WCWRuinsEverything.

55 comments:

  1. In 1996, I thought Hogan was jobbing to much to be a credible champion, and now I'm still irked because Hogan only jobbed for his buddies, if you could call Piper a buddy. I think WCW didn't want you to think Hogan was going to job, and knew the fans would know he was jobbing if you clearly told them it was non-title. If you tell them its title, then more likely Piper is losing because he wasn't booked as a "WCW wrestler," or whatever craziness that was. Seriously, they should have put the title on Piper - had Hogan beat the Giant at the nWo ppv - and then done the same angle they did at Superbrawl, where Piper wins the match, but Macho drags Hogan's legs under the ropes and turns heel and Hogan wins the title back. Much better than what they ended up doing, booking-wise.


    Hogan vs. Piper was usually horrible stuff, with matches that got worse and worse. Their Age in the Cage match was supposed to be "competition" to Heck in a Cell. That was a horrible match even before Hogan jobbed. The match was so bad, Hogan went out there and worked a match with DDP on Nitro and used old-school 1985 Hogan style on him - so the match is pretty watchable. (I still find it amazing the night Hogan put over Luger on Nitro, he pulled out his classic 1980's babyface moves and put on a decent match - but when they do the rematch on PPV the next week - where you know Hogan's winning it back - he puts on a horrible - no flow of a match match.)

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  2. What was the Robin Hood episode? I'm not sure I ever even heard of that one.

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  3. Wasn't there a rumour that Carmen Electra was actually considered as being a possible candidate as the mysterious hummer driver?



    Also what was the Robin Hood episode of Nitro all about?

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  4. Around the time of the first Souled Out, they promoted a rematch on free TV between Hogan and the Giant, which was on a taped episode of Nitro. However, the show was promoted as "live", and in order to sponge off WCW's viewership for the crappy crappy crappy Robin Hood TV show following Nitro, they had the match "run out of TV time" just as Robin Hood was starting, after two hours of endless Robin Hood promotional materials during the show, and they promised to follow the match through the commercial breaks. So what we got (well, what America got, not Canada thankfully) was a 5 minute match chopped up into 30 second segments that aired in the various commercial breaks, presented as though all the action was happening live as we were watching over a one-hour period of time.



    Robin Hood didn't last long.

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  5. Ah, so that explains all the potshots at Robin Hood during the 1997 Raws.

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  6. I was actually happy when the announced after the match that it was non-title, because I can't stand Piper and thought that he had absolutely no business being world champion. The match itself was total garbage, but I think we all knew that was going to be the case going in, and sadly it was among the better Hogan/Piper WCW matches.

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  7. Caliber_Winfield_69420BoobiesDecember 5, 2012 at 12:20 PM

    Heck In A Cell? Was this the one that took place between Bert & Ernie or something?

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  8. Caliber_Winfield_69420BoobiesDecember 5, 2012 at 12:21 PM

    Actually, they did follow up on the Hummer angle, like 6 months later. For those following WCW in 2000 [and who isn't?] we recently found out that Eric Bischoff was behind it all.

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  9. Is he poking fun at WCW or is born again?

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  10. Was the wwf December ppv any good in 96? I've seen the bret v.sid with hbk on commentary other places but I forgot if the card sucked.
    One reason wcw was my 2nd fav in the monday night wars was because the main events always sucked for match quality

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  11. A Dusty finish would have been better than the bogus non-mention of the non-title stip. The whole weight of the match was resting on whether WCW would switch the title to Piper while Sting loomed on the horizon, otherwise the result wouldn't have been in doubt. At least a Dusty finish would have given us a satisfying result that night rather than ending the broadcast with everyone confused about why Piper wasn't being handed the belt. Also, it might have helped if they'd re-established Piper first. I didn't remember his finisher being the sleeper, so I thought we were just getting the standard 2 hand drop spot, but instead the match suddenly ended. It's weird how excited I remember being for that match; I should have known it would be a disaster, and then I shouldn't have been surprised when the next year's event went even worse.

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  12. With the WWE being PG I'm surprised they didn't rename it that.

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  13. It's sad because this is the only WCW PPV I ever ordered. Only for the Hot Rod who was one of my favourites as a kid.

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  14. I'm 70% sure that WWE, at one point during the really bad days of the PG-era, actually called it that on television, and I believe I've seen some toys and advertisements labeled "Heck in the Cell" or "He** in the Cell." The most common alternate name, by far, is when they simply call it "The Cell."

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  15. Ah, the "It's Time" PPV, named for a guy who wasn't even at the show, with an terrible UT/Terry Gordy match and Fake Diesel/Razor in a tag title match (though it's not too bad of a match). Not horrible, but certainly not too good and very much a B-show. Starrcade wins just on it's good cruiserweight matches, IMO.

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  16. The was the whole point. That's what made Hogan so hated because nobody bought him as champion. It was Honky's IC title reign turned up to a thousand. It was why the Goldberg pop was so massive when he crushed him. Finally a guy who could plow through the lackeys and still get at Hogan.

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  17. If Giant had won the title, they would have had something.

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  18. Yeah the Russo/Bischoff era did have Bischoff driving the hummer to run over Hogan in a dumpster. Thunder then reported Hogan would be off TV for three weeks. Then Hogan just no sold the injury and showed up at Spring Stampeed, three days later. Even Rocky took two weeks before no selling the truck injury.

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  19. They did hint at Hogan being the driver of the Hummer during the Arn Anderson booking period between Bischoff and Russo, where Sting turned heel (to a face pop) and beaned Hogan with the bat to win the World Championship.

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  20. Two down votes? Must be some Rick Bognar fans on the blog. It's kind of depressing how bad the "executioner" was. I think an all time dream big man match up would be young Terry Gordy vs 2006-2009 undertaker. That would have been a great match.

    I used to always watch Raw live and then watch nitro taped (or on the replay whenever they started doing that) but could never bring myself to (have my parents) buy a ppv because I knew the main event would suck. Hollywood Hogan might have drawn a boat load of money but he put on some awful fucking matches in wcw

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  21. Hollywood Hogan was such a genius character and the chase after him drew real money. Too bad his matches were always bad, but that was such a better drawing and more entertaining heel as the champion run then almost anything that came after it

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  22. The only problem I had with Hollywood Hogan were the promos. No hyperbole, his 20 minute promos were some of the worst in the history of wrestling. They were so bad, it almost overshadows everything he did during that era.

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  23. I was actually re-watching that Nitro a while back and it was pretty hilarious. I wish something like that would happen today and see all of the backlash.

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  24. I watched Nitro live and taped Raw usually.

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  25. I really needed a dvr in 1996

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  26. I'm shocked Hogan's ego could have allowed it.

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  27. I liked the promos back then. What I didn't like at the time was that Hogan was a super-human babyface and when he turned heel - he was a coward?

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  28. Thanks to whoever brought this up. I could've SWORN that they never brought up the fact that it was a non-title match until afterward, and now people are confirming it.


    When Piper won, I thought, "Hmm. Interesting choice. Let's see how this plays out now that Hogan doesn't have the belt and the Outsiders can take charge." And only a couple of moments after the finish, it was revealed that this was a great victory, he is the icon, but not the champion. I think it was one of the worst implied bait and switches there was at the time.


    I wish someone could wipe the memory of that Robin Hood show from my brain. I was one of the few tricked into watching the first episode to see the ending of the match (no internet for me back then, never knew it was taped).

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  29. His moveset didn't change all when he turned heel. He always kind of wrestled like a cowardly heel even during Hulkamania. But the big Hulk up masked that.

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  30. Your shocked that his ego allowed him to hold the title for so long and win all those matches?

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  31. Hogan vs. Piper from Starrcade, SuperBrawl VII and Halloween Havoc is the anti-Flair vs. Steamboat trilogy.

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  32. Piper won his (first) retirement match vs. Adrian Adonis with his sleeper (they both used it) and also won his IC title from the Mountie with it. So I'd say it was his finisher.

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  33. Not only did the Hogan-Giant match suck, but the TV show I was forced to watch to see the end of the match sucked even more.

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  34. No to run away like a coward, and job to people like he did.

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  35. From a strictly kayfabe standpoint, what on earth did Piper do to earn a title shot?


    WCW can be criticized for a lot but I've never, ever understood the outrage over the match "suddenly" being non-title. At no point did I ever believe the title was on the line.

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  36. It was a live Nitro, actually. One thing to keep in mind is that a match being announced on a TV program to take place that night was still a new concept--generally all the matches for both shows were announced in advance. So you had a legitimate match of intrigue--an unannounced match and a rare Hogan wrestling appearance. And then it was all cocked up.

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  37. What's weird is that it was known for months beforehand online that it was non-title -- so I guess I never noticed that they didn't state it on the broadcast, but I do remember Dusty throwing it out there as soon as the match was over.

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  38. Yea i was reading his re rant n it got me thinking

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  39. yea the slerper has always been his signature... Didnt he put bret in one at wm.8?

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  40. Yep and that led to the finish of that match where Bret was in the sleeper but he pushed off the turnbuckles into a pin.

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  41. I'm probably not getting the details correct, but basically Nitro was followed by a show called The New Adventures of Robin Hood. So one episode of Nitro had the main event of Hogan vs the Giant but Nitro ended like a minute into the match, so every time Robin Hood went to commercial they aired a small portion of the match like it they were having an hour long fight during the airing of Robin Hood.
    I'm sure I'm getting some details wrong though.

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  42. I wanna say they did something similar with a Hogan movie and the Sting/Hogan contract signing at the MGM Grand, although I don't think it was on the same night as Nitro.

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  43. Pretty well nailed there. They loved using Nitro to launch their new shows. After Robin Hood failed, they ran a Mortal Kombat series for a few weeks.

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  44. He jobbed only 4 times in 3 years.

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  45. Being WCW 4LIFE in 96, i can tell you it was never billed as a title fight. It was always billed as a battle of the icons or "icon vs icon"

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  46. It was his signature but keep in mind the Hogan match was in 96 and Piper hadn't wrestled regularly in a few years. Plus, how many times did Piper win a match cleanly with his finisher in the WWF? He wrestled a ton of double dq/countout/schmozz finishes or won with roll-ups a lot of the time. Piper was mostly remembered for his promos and crazy behavior, not a sleeper hold. Plus most fans in 1996 weren't buying a sleeper from scrawny Roddy Piper as a finisher.

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  47. It was never billed as a title match but it sure would've been nice to know it was non-title beforehand.

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  48. Heck, it was a dream match for me. I had only remembered Gordy from his UWF/WCW days and reading the Apter mags talking about him ripping up Japan. So when he came to WWF, I was super psyched to see him wrestle Taker, stupid gimmick notwithstanding. I didn't know he was a brain damaged shell of himself at that point b/c I didn't have internet.

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  49. Caliber_Winfield_69420BoobiesDecember 6, 2012 at 5:40 AM

    Haha, a lot of people hate that angle, but I loved it. I thought it was so nWo. Of course Rocky no-sold it. Scott had a pretty good joke about it in his book where he said something like...

    Hogan and The Rock shake hands, and Hogan is all "Sorry about running you over with a truck, brother" and The Rock is all "It's OK, I no sold it anyway"

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  50. Caliber_Winfield_69420BoobiesDecember 6, 2012 at 5:49 AM

    Yup. And Piper even wrote up the contract himself, making him an idiot. I mean, if he had said "I don't care about the title, I just want to hurt Hogan" I could understand it.

    After the match, even the announcers were like "Put the title on him!...is...wait...is this for the title? Did he win the belt?..."


    That being said, I don't care what people say, I like the match. Hogan was so funny. "Get him back! Get him back! I wanna beat him in the middle of the ring!" then after they tie-up to the corner, Hogan says "watch him! Watch him! I don't trust him!" and then he hauls off and slaps Piper. Awesome stuff.

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  51. I remember this annoying me when I was 16 and watching the show because it was so random and useless. I wanted Hogan to lose the belt to Dallas Page after about a year of hell, then have the nWo implode, on to new things. I didn't know enough to know that the thing the people seemed to want (DDP beating Hogan) wouldn't happen.

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  52. Is the Slerper Kelly Kelly's finish?

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