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RF Video Shoot Interview with Koko B. Ware

This was filmed in 2005

The interview was conducted by Rob Feinstein

It runs at two hours long





The video starts with Koko, dressed in a pinstriped white suit coat wearing a cross, asked if he was a fan of wrestling growing up. He said he was about 16 or 17 growing up in Tennessee when he saw a group of guys working out and wanted to get into that so they made his parents sign a waiver that they would not be responsible for any injuries that may occur then he began to work out in this building, which also had wrestling on Thursday nights. He talks about the local guys like Jackie Fargo and Herb Welch that he used to idolize.



He broke into the business after the guys he worked out with noticed him as he was improving. Koko credits Plowboy Frazier (Uncle Elmer) with getting him started as he booked him in a small town in Arkansas. Frazier told Jerry Lawler about him and after watching him wrestle, Lawler asked Koko if he could make the Memphis TV taping the next morning.



When asked about the hardest part of training, Koko said it took two weeks to get used to the mat as he was having difficulty getting out of bed in the morning before drifting off topic about he was training to become an auto mechanic and how he switched careers to wrestling as he was adapting well to the business.



Koko talks about how hot the Memphis territory was at that time. He said that his first opponent on TV was against Jos LeDuc. Koko said that he was a good "bump man" and knew how to bump for the power guys. LeDuc put him over after the match, as did the promoters and guys backstage as Koko said that put a smile on his face as he never had all of this admiration before.



About Nick Gulas, Koko calls him one of the most lovable promoters to work with but if you did not know him he could rub you the wrong way. He also said Gulas was odd with payouts and how he would tell you its not how much you make but rather how much you save. Koko talks about how he loved the territory as you were home every night.



On the "Sweet Brown Sugar" name, Koko said that he was a special guest referee in a match and helped the heel beat Lawler. Koko then said that the fans called him "Sweet Brown Shit" after that.



He said that the veterans in the locker room at that time never gave him a hard time on purpose.



Feinstein asks Koko about Lawler. He says that when you went to Memphis, you have to go in with the mindset that he is the king. He then talks about guys bitching about not getting the main event spot over Lawler as Koko said he earned the right for that spot as he built up that territory.



Koko credits Jerry Jarrett for helping him on his interviews by making Jarrett cut a promo against guys in his backyard. Jarrett would also told him to play off of Martin Luther King's "I Had a Dream" speech but that his dream was to be a professional wrestler and then speak about that. He said there were no scripts back then either.



When asked, Koko said that he did not feel that his earlier gimmicks or stuff was racist. He then talks about how you cannot go into a wrestling promotion and tell what you are and are not willing to do as that reflects a bad attitude and as a result, you will be sitting on the sidelines.



He puts over Jimmy Valiant as a talent and a person. Koko says that Valiant was a big fan of his as well. Koko said that he teamed with Bobby Eaton once when his opponent no-showed so Bill Dundee, the booker at the time, decided to pair them up together. He said that they had a great match and even did an "Ebony and Ivory" gimmick briefly that got over.



Koko says that Steve Keirn started out as a really good guy then tells a story about his gimmick as Stagger Lee, which is what he used when he lost a "Loser Leave Town" match. At that time, Keirn was given the Fabulous Ones gimmick, who wore suits. Koko said that Lawler gave him the Lee gimmick and told him to shake all of the fan's hands. After a show in the locker room, Koko was backstage with the Fabulous Ones, Ricky Morton, and Bill Dundee. He said that everyone but him knew what was going on as Keirn wanted to speak to him. Koko said they went to the showers as Koko leaned on the rail as Keirn asked who gave him permission to dance and shake the hands of the fans. Koko said that Lawler gave it to him, assuring Keirn that he would not steal his idea. Keirn then said okay but as eh went ot walk away, he turned around and sucker-punched Koko, who thought they were friends as they used to ride together. Koko got up and landed a few shots then he got pulled away as Koko says that Keirn was the one who should have gotten pulled away as he started the whole thing. Koko then said he ran down Keirn, saying that the territory did everything they could have to get him over as Koko says this was his first big break and he was not about to lose it over this. He then talks about how Eddie Marlin told him it was enough after he thought about going back after Keirn, prompting Koko to tell him that if he was the one who started the fight, he would get fired. Koko said that he has ever spoken to Keirn since and says he longer holds a grudge against him as he (Koko) has turned his life around now.



He then skips ahead and talks about another locker room fight that he had with Paul Roma in the WWF. Koko said that Roma had a chip on his shoulder at the time then called Koko "Buckwheat" one night then Koko confronted him. Roma said he called him that because that is who he is as Koko said he fought with him but after that happened, they got along and are friends now. (For the record, Roma had a completely different recollection about what happened in his shoot interview that I reviewed).



Feinstein asks him about some other workers in Memphis. He said Robert Gibson was a great guy and Koko live with him and his girlfriend as he puts over the girlfriend's cooking. He calls Norvell Austin a good wrestler but was older at the time. Koko says that the PYT's gimmick helped him out at that time. He puts over Eddie Gilbert, saying he was born to be a wrestler, then says he thinks the world of the whole Gilbert family. He says that Tommy Rich was a great guy as well then tells a story of how Rich wrote him a check to get new tires for his car when he was short on money. Koko says he never forgot that.



When asked about Bill Dundee as a booker, Koko says that he is just "alright" but needed someone to work off of before talking about how a booker needs to also work with someone who is not actively wrestling at the time for it to work.



He then went to Texas to work for Fritz Von Erich after a brief stay in Leroy McGuirk's territory in Oklahoma. Koko said that he and Norvell were the first black tag team in Texas. He said they replaced the Freebirds as the heel team then tells a story of how Andre the Giant got the Freebirds fired in the WWF as they constantly came in drunk.



Koko said that he never saw the drug problems with the guys in World Class but that the ones who did use would come into the locker room about ten minutes before their match, usually already dressed.



After World Class, Koko went back to Memphis and worked a series of gimmick matches, including the first scaffold match. Koko said he volunteered to face Dundee because no one else wanted to and he was young and hungry. He then talks about how spending five years in Memphis taught him how to wrestle and how angles work.



He then talks about how the "Koko" name was given to him by his high school football coach due to what Koko says is his smooth, silky skin. He denies that there was any racism with this name. When he needed a name to wrestle, Plowboy Frazier asked him so he suggested Koko then in Mid South, Jim Ross added the "B. Ware" part and it took off from there.



Koko said that Bill Watts did not want guys who couldnt take care of themselves in the ring and if you couldnt stretch him or make it look real, he would fire you. On whether or not Watts was racist, Koko said he didnt see that as he pushed JYD, Butch Reed, Ernie Ladd, along with himself. Koko said that Watts knew talent.



He was then asked if he was upset about losing in the First Round of the UWF Unification Tournament as Koko said no as this is an entertainment business and not a shoot and if it was, he would not be in this business along with a majority of the other guys he was working with.



Howard Finkel was the one who contacted Koko about joining the WWF. Finkel told him to pick a date that would not interfere with his schedule for Watts so he could fly up for a meeting with Vince. Koko said he told Watts about the meeting and how he respected him but that he wanted to see what the WWF could offer, as he had a family to provide for and wanted to give them the best.



When he first met Vince, Koko said he was overwhelmed as New York City was huge and he had no idea where he was going then realized that on the same flight was Kamala, who was also flying to meet with Vince and jokes how they initially kayfabed each other as to why they were there then came clean with each other. Koko said that he felt comfortable when Vince spoke with him during their meeting. When it ended, Vince told Koko to go home and think about the offer but not before asking if there was something he would like to add to his gimmick. Koko then took a picture out of his pocket of him at a pet store in Baton Rouge that had a macaw in the background as Koko said that he wanted the bird with him, adding that he also had the bird tights made. Vince said that it was not a bad idea but made sure that he was okay traveling with the bird as Koko said it would not be a problem. So, Vince bought the bird and had Koko pay him back as he was working for him. Koko then said that his wife, who had a background in dancing, came up with the bird dance as it was easy enough for everyone from young and old to do in the crowd. Koko said that for someone his size (5'7), the gimmick got him over as much as possible in the WWF.



On the drug scene in the WWF at that time, Koko said that it was not a big problem until the incident in which Iron Sheik and Jim Duggan got caught with drugs together. He claimed that guys only did some things to "get by" but not more than that.



Koko said that he helped Hulk Hogan out while he was in Memphis as he trained him there, along with Brutus Beefcake, then did not see him again until entering the WWF and said how Hogan never forgot about that.



He puts over Greg Valentine, saying he always had good matches together. Koko said that the Honky Tonk Man broke in with him and that they used to train all day and night together and how they remain good friends today. He said that Randy Savage was nice to him and booked him for the IWC promotion. When asked about how Savage treated Elizabeth, Koko said he was protective and cannot blame him as if his wife was in the business, he would be the same way as some guys in wrestling do not respect the women. He also said Savage would fight you in an instant and tells a story of how Honky was doing a wiggle at Elizabeth during matches as Savage was pissed and confronted him backstage.



When asked about WrestleMania III, Koko said whenever someone asks him about his career he always thinks back to that show as it feels so good to have 93,000 cheer you on and it is the culmination of all your hard work in the business. He said he was so thankful to make this show has he said he was just a country boy that made it to this huge show.



Koko said that everybody cracks due to the travel at some point as he talks about struggling with the language barrier during International travel. He then says that everyone (not just wrestlers) should stay out of the country for one week to experience that.



He gets asked about several of the guys he worked with. Koko loved working with Jake Roberts and recalls one fan called the Humane Society after Jake cut a promo about Damien eating Frankie and they actually came into the building and told them to keep Damien away from the bird. Koko said that the Dynamite Kid was a funny guy as he laughs recalling a time when he hid Outback Jack's knife. He also said that they shaved the head of one of the midget's at a bar when they were passed out, saying it was sad. Koko talks about another rib when  Steve Keirn took a dump into Jerry Lawler's crown the night Lawler made his debut as payback from when he was in Memphis.



When asked about the Dynamite Kid/Jacques Rougeau incident, Koko said that he was not there but said he knew something would happen. Koko said that Jacques was a nice guy but that if he landed a punch, you were in trouble. He tells a story of when Jacques went to Terry Taylor's house once, apparently after Taylor did something with his girlfriend, and dropped him when he opened the door.



Koko said Curt Hennig was a good friend and an outstanding talent. He says that his death hurt everyone. He calls Rick Martel a "classy guy"  and was very family oriented and would try to learn how to speak French with him. He did not get the chance to work with Bret Hart or Shawn Michaels much but credits Shawn for finding god. On the Ultimate Warrior, Koko said he had a lot of animosity inside of him as the company made him wait for a longtime until he got a chance as when he first entered the company he would barely get booked. Koko said that Chief Jay Strongbow went to Vince and said they should use this guy before someone else snatched him up. Koko said he was a good gimmick guy.




On the Undertaker, Koko said that he was not doing anything under his real name then credits Vince for giving him the gimmick as that can go on and on forever because you can cool him off for six months then bring him back. Koko said he can do some nice moves but not much else other than that.



He was not disappointed that he only got a dark match at WrestleMania VII because he never got his hopes up and appreciated things as it happened.



Koko was not shocked when Lawler joined the WWF because despite the animosity, Lawler was talented and Vince recognized talent.



When asked about how he formed the High Energy Team, Koko said that something happened with Jim Neidhart and if left Owen without a partner so Bobby Heenan was the one who suggested Koko as his replacement. Koko said that Owen was a great guy then says the whole Hart Family are great people. He said he had great matches with the Headshrinkers but hated the top rope splashes they took from them as they always knocked the wind out of them, even joking that if you had to "take a crap" when you were laying down for the move, you would shit your pants. He loved working with the Nasty Boys and the Beverly Brothers.



Feinstein backtracks and asks Koko about the "Wrestling Album." He said that they shot the video during a cold morning in San Francisco. He was happy to be the lead singer of the album then briefly mentions how he is the lead vocalist in his church choir today.



Koko now talks about how he got fired. They were overseas at a bar when Shawn Micheals and Jim Troy, one of Vince's executives, got in each others faces and started to spit at each other as they were both tanked. Koko said he went over to break it up then Troy started to egg Koko on about being a "phony tough guy" and how Vince pays him a lot of money to take care of "fake tough guys" as he pushed both Koko and Shawn out of the way. Koko then asked Troy why he tried to fight him and got slapped. Koko said he immediately snapped and beat on Troy like "Ali beat on Frazier." He then said that Troy got up and ran out the door afterwards and when Koko looked at his own hand, it was sliced open from a beer bottle as he puts that same hand in front of the camera to show the scar from that incident as he said a doctor came to the hotel to sew it up. After that, Koko told Marty Jannetty about what happened.  Marty was pissed so he ran down to the front desk, demanding the clerk give him Troy's room number. Mrty then decided to hop over the desk because he was taking too long and decked the poor clerk, demanding the keys. Jannetty and Koko went into the room as Jannetty kicked down the door and destroyed the room as Troy was not there. They headed back down to the lobby when they saw Troy getting out of a taxi as Koko told Troy it was not over yet and hit him again. Koko said that the lobby of the hotel connected to a diner and Koko left Troy hanging over a table. The next day, Pat Patterson came over to him ask what happened. Koko said that he saw Troy's wife, who couldnt believe what happened then said he was Troy's face and that he had two black eyes that he described as being "blacker than he is" before telling Patterson about the incident. Terry Garvin then told Koko before a show in Paris that Vince wanted him to go home. Vince then called up Koko pissed off about how he beat up his executive then after hearing the story, Vince got pissed that one of his executives tried to beat up a wrestler and how he cant have this in his company. Vince put over the severity of the beating he gave to Troy and said he had to get rid of both but he got rehired shortly thereafter. Koko then says that Vince holds that against him today but that he holds nothing against Vince or the WWF and would give anything for a chance to wave his hand to the crowd at Madison Square Garden today.



He said that WCW offered him a deal to be "under their roof" but that there was no money involved so he declined the offer.



When asked, Koko said that he had no problem going back to a smaller territory in Memphis after the WWF because he was not "too good to come down" from a bigger place on the National scene. He said that Brian Christopher has a whole lot to learn and was not ready for the WWF when he started as he started "doing things" when he got into the spotlight and said he paid his dues for a while before making it to the WWF and knew how to maintain himself when he got there. He said that Reggie B. Fine was a funny guy but does not know how to wrestle and is a gimmick man.



He still watches the WWE today and likes when guys he worked with make special appearances. He says that he does not sit around crying about not getting invited to the shows or the Hall of Fame as the whole business is a work. Koko said why get upset when you are told to lay down for someone and does not take it as serious as others do because it is all entertainment.



His favorite matches were against Jerry Lawler in Memphis because he learned a lot in the ring with him.



When asked, Koko said he was surprised when the Jarrett's never reached out to him about working for NWA-TNA. Koko said he doesnt expect a long run with the company but thought he could help them out for a short run as he does own the Koko B. Ware gimmick. He says they are great guys, regardless.



Koko said he is older now and would not work full-time for Vince today as a result if he was asked.



On the high-flyers in wrestling today, Koko said that he has seen moves that he thought humans were unable to do and takes their hats off to those guys but separates those guys from the wrestlers who use psychology and how they will not draw main event money working that style as you need to sell and tell a story.



Today, Koko says that he has his own painting business as he wrestles occasionally. He also said that he had to wake up in the real world eventually and learned this trade. The camera then zooms in on his face as he says wrestling took himself, a country boy, around the world four times and has no regrets as he got to see the world.




In closing, Koko thanks the fans as he gets really emotional as he thanks everyone and how he does not hold grudges any longer because of his belief in god and says he will go around and apologized to anyone that he has mistreated before thanking the interviewers for allowing him to tell his story. He then thanks Vince McMahon for his opportunity to make his name in this business as he is now recognized around the world as he starts to tear up a bit as he looks up and thanks everyone.



Final Thoughts: I thought this was a good interview. Koko came across as a good guy and seemed very thankful for the opportunities he got in life due to wrestling. Koko was not bitter at all regarding his time in the business or his position on the card in the WWF. He did skirt over any mentions of drugs and was vague on his own usage (One of Roma's claim in his shoot was that Koko was fucked up on drugs during their fight) but regardless, the interview was solid.

His story on how he got fired was pretty crazy and definitely worth a listen. Koko also seems to be at peace with himself as he mentioned himself being involved with the church. At the end when he broke down, it seemed like he did so due to a combination of being upset about his past behaviors and just being thankful to get to share his love for professional wrestling. At the end of the interview, I became a fan of Koko as a person.

Overall, I recommend this interview as it had a mix of crazy stories and genuine heartfelt moments from a wrestler thankful for all the chances he received in that business. I thought Koko came across as being sincere as well.



You can purchase the video by clicking on the link below

http://www.rfvideo.com/shootwithkokobware.aspx

Comments

  1. " but I think the majority of Joe Average fans would've bought it"



    Fighting words EMailer. Fighting words.

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  2. I'm so intrgued by what comes after Wrestlemania, I'm guessing its going to be a midling and undewhelming year but seeing how far the WWE falls or if at all will be interesting. Its interesting to watch from a far and just see what happens.

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  3. The company fucked up getting completely away from anti heroes and cool heels. No one is interested in chicken shit heels and cheesy babyfaces. I knew how this was going the second Reigns spiked Stephanie's coffee.

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  4. Yeah, and the way they did Fast Lane is how the ending of the RR should've played out. I would've had Bryan and Reigns trading eliminations and have Bryan eliminated by Rusev then have Reigns toss him to win it. Then you have Bryan endorse him. Sure people will probably boo but not nearly as much.

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  5. it seems weird in retrospect but to me (and I guess I wasn't the only one) Batista seemed like A LOT bigger deal than Cena when he won the title.

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  6. Yeah but it's particularly bad when you have 3 potential main event talents in the mix.

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  7. Charismatic eNegro Jef VinsonFebruary 26, 2015 at 10:11 AM

    They should have never had DBry and Reigns interact.

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  8. Bryan is a cheesy babyface but he's real, he's organic. It works for him. This doesn't work for Reigns. It doesn't seem natural.

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  9. it's like they didn't learn anything from that (and also the other big comparison, the Diesel push) and repeat the same mistakes over and over again.

    (which brings up the question: did Vince and goons even "get" why babyface Randy Orton didn't work in 2004 and Batista in 2005 did? or do they think it was all a big fluke with no reason whatsoever?)

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  10. Maybe I should replace cheesy with 80s.

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  11. But wouldn't saying an Anti-hero and a cool heel... is a tweener?

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  12. I wish Just Joe had stuck around, that guy sure liked to stir up trouble!

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  13. "Koko said that the Dynamite Kid was a funny guy..." First time I've heard anyone say anything positive about Dynamite outside the ring.

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  14. I remember that to me, it felt like he was the champion for the first time. I didn't see the title change in 1991 (only read about it) and Taker hadn't even challenged for the belt that often since then.

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  15. I wouldn't worry about Cabana. Even if Punk doesn't pay for his buddy's legal fees (and he probably shouldn't - ethics rules are such that an arrangement like that could be a conflict of interest since they're both parties in the same litigation) there are plenty of First Amendment lawyers that would probably take this case on pro bono since it'll be a high profile matter.

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  16. He fits the classic 80s babyface too. I mean yeah his look is different but he's every bit the same as a Ricky Steamboat from the old days. I don't know what the hell Reigns is. Sure Hogan and the Warrior said crazy ass shit but it was all crazy ass shit that made them look larger than life. I don't know how sufferin succotash makes Reigns seem bad ass.

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  17. Vince: "Get out of here! You ruined it, you ruined it! You ruined it, dammit!"

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  18. Ambrose can always fall back on his Mustard Skills.

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  19. I've been trying all morning and I cannot think of a single legitimate issue they could sue Cabanna on and not have it thrown out. Punk's team will likely move to combine the suits and the WWE likely won't object. Then again, the WWE's legal team has a history of failures, so it wouldn't surprise me to see Cabana end up owning the WWE.

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  20. sounds more like WWE's take on a "gay character" to me.

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  21. My guess? Steen in ROH. When he came back, he would insult the fans endlessly and do heelish things, but he was fighting Cornette and the authority and was hilarious, so he became a cool heel. Then, he became a face but still broke all the rules, so he was an anti-hero. I guess...I dunno...it's pretty much the same thing.

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  22. Bad News Brown did in his shoot too but that is about all I have heard.

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  23. Reigns was the only one they were banking on.


    You can tell that Rollins got over (with mgmt) from all the highspots during the Shield/Evolution feud (which should have lasted longer IMO)


    Ambrose was not going to be a guy they were gonna have long term investment in, look at the way he has been jobbing.

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  24. This guy gets it.


    Its the same fucking thing.

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  25. It was insulting to fans intelligence to get away from shades of gray.

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  26. I kinda get what he's saying. Anti heros don't mess with other people so long as you leave them alone. Cool heels are bullies that mess with other people and aren't afraid to back up their claims. Like late 2003 Brock.

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  27. there were several alternatives that would have been better. Ziggler was coming off what might have been the biggest win of his career. he could have easily been put against Lesnar (Ziggler bumps like a madman and, if it works out only the slightest, comes out looking he has "more guts than brains" because he keeps fighting despite Brock murdering him). if they hadn't killed Ambrose, he too would have been a great candidate. monster vs. lunatic? sounds like a fun brawl to me.

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  28. Insulting to you, but after four years of hot-shotting, you have to scale it back and go back to what works.


    Babyfaces and heels work.


    When everyone is in shades of gray on top, you can not properly get behind anyone because their motivations are too spastic.

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  29. Its the same thing.


    Anti-heroes cheat to win and get boos

    Cool heels stand up to authority and face pop reactions.


    Both are tweeners.

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  30. Charismatic eNegro Jef VinsonFebruary 26, 2015 at 10:31 AM

    "He said they replaced the Freebirds as the heel team then tells a story of how Andre the Giant got the Freebirds fired in the WWF as they constantly came in drunk."

    If Andre calls someone drunk they must have been smashed.

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  31. Good on you if you're riding the Reigns train. Being a bad ass and not a Disney character may have done him some good.

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  32. I agree with you that having clear boundaries is a good thing. The bigger problem is probably that the terms of boundaries from the old days don't work anymore. People shouldn't be bouncing from face to heel every week or lacking clear motivation, but their *actions* should be what makes them faces or heels, not their "characters". Rock, HHH, Austin were all essentially the same dudes as faces or heels, but they tended to suck up more or align with authority figures when heel, and do the right thing in the end when faces. They just weren't bland stereotypes like Cena.

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  33. Anti heroes don't have to cheat, just have no problem turning the tables on other cheaters. Cool heels do it just because they can because they're assholes.

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  34. He is a bad ass.

    But you want your badasses to have some vulnerability... otherwise, you dont develop an emotional connection and therefore you dont pay to see him.

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  35. I feel honored being called out by Fuji.

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  36. lol... you aren't being called out.


    I just wanted to understand how you view faces/heels

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  37. I think BNB was somewhat friendly with Dynamite because of their time in Japan, but at the same time Bad News said that with Dynamite tried to pull a prank on him that he'd fuck him up.

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  38. Well I know THEY only saw money in Reigns but they were all still potential main event talents even if WWE didn't see it.

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  39. I imagine everyone was nice to BNB...haha.

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  40. THAT Angle promo was before that Elimination Chamber Match you mentioned, though!

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  41. I agree.


    But when it comes to Rocky/Austin/HHH, they had clear definitive points of "heeldom"


    Rock flipped and stayed a heel for almost 3 years.
    Austin came in 96 and was a heel for 2.5 years


    They had clear motivation, desires and their personalities were allowed to develop. and when they started moving towards the other side, you knew why, you saw the action and everything.



    Plus Vince was getting his ass kicked by Turner.


    Now?


    Reigns... Batista... they never talked (until getting the shove) so what are their motivations, why should i care about them?



    More importantly, why should I pay to see you, or buy your shirts?


    And thats my biggest complaint is with the booking, not the talent.


    Why should I care?

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  42. Bryan should have gotten the title shot at the Royal Rumble against Brock. Kills two birds with one stone - keeps Bryan out of the Rumble where he threw shade on Reigns and gave the smart fans what we've always wanted, Lesnar versus Bryan. Kayfabe-wise it would make sense, too. Bryan never lost the title and wants it back, the Authority hates Bryan and would gladly feed him to Lesnar to end for good. Plus you could have ended the Rumble w/ Reigns vs Cena and I'm pretty sure the Philly crowd would pop for Reigns over Cena.

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  43. But they wouldn't be "Anti"


    They would just be a "hero"


    And what does "turning the tables" on a heel mean, in wrestling?


    To me, that would be stooping to the heels level to do what it takes to win.

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  44. definitely.


    I thought Moxley was one of the BITW when he got signed.

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  45. "He says that he does not sit around crying about not getting invited to
    the shows or the Hall of Fame as the whole business is a work."

    Well damn, this makes his spot in the HoF even more of a waste.

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  46. Yeah. I agree on this. I just think this desire to control responses and the stereotypes they try to fit the wrestlers into is connected with the bad booking (not sure what the causal relationship is...). I think, moreso than a concept like "shades of gray," having characters that can maintain core consistency on either side of the heel/face divide is key. Sadly, the way faces are treated at the moment demands that they all act the same and transform to fit the desired mold. It just isn't effective.

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  47. Moxley in the indies just screamed charisma the same way Punk did back in the day. I thought for sure he'd end up huge based on just that.

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  48. I just remember with Steen, he was doing the same act as a face, but how he was fighting guys booked as heels. It was literally the exact same act except he stopped insulting the fans as much.

    That being said, I like tweeter characters like that. I think it makes it more interesting to have heels that are over with the crowd or faces taking the law into their own hands.

    But yeah, they're the same thing just booked against different peiole.

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  49. Also, as someone coming at this from another angle (I works in television) I can't feel too much sympathy for Colt - though I do like the guy. We are culpable for what we transmit. We constantly have to jump through hoops and ensure everything is above board and responsible. Even if we know it's true, we can't just say it. Radio would be exactly the same. Slightly different area, but with copyrights I've been on productions where we've even had to clear pictures/photographs that were on the walls of contributors before the footage can be shown. There are people employed to ensure we do things right and now can kick up shit about it.



    I think what we're actually seeing and will probably see more of, is the issues that come with amateur media becoming mainstream. As productions go, Colt is not much more than a boy in his bedroom. This was a pre-recorded interview that made serious allegations about a doctor that has major professional ramifications. There's no way we could have put that out without Punk being able to prove it. We'd have probably needed to include that proof in the broadcast too or at least verbally confirm we had it.


    So yeah, Punk said it, Colt published it and that seems pretty fair to me.

    ReplyDelete
  50. It's like when Austin would trash Vince's car or do other things to harass him because Vince wouldn't leave him alone. He broke the law and a lot of rules to get revenge. Brock picked on one legged guys because he could. No reason given he's just a bully. The nWo picked on Cruiserweights because they could. It's the motivations. Like in comics Superman would be a typical hero because he's selfless and does what he does to help and won't bend the rules, in this case killing someone to achieve his goals. The Punisher kills people that have wronged him and does whatever it takes to put things to rights. Thanos killed everyone just because he fucking could.

    ReplyDelete
  51. Also, as someone coming at this from another angle (I works in
    television) I can't feel too much sympathy for Colt - though I do like
    the guy. We are culpable for what we transmit. We constantly have to
    jump through hoops and ensure everything is above board and responsible.
    Even if we know it's true, we can't just say it. Radio would be exactly
    the same. Slightly different area, but with copyrights I've been on
    productions where we've even had to clear pictures/photographs that were
    on the walls of contributors before the footage can be shown. There are
    people employed to ensure we do things right and not kick up shit about
    it.

    I think what we're actually seeing and will probably see more
    of, is the issues that come with amateur media becoming mainstream. As
    productions go, Colt is not much more than a boy in his bedroom. This
    was a pre-recorded interview that made serious allegations about a
    doctor that has major professional ramifications. There's no way we
    could have put that out without Punk being able to prove it. We'd have
    probably needed to include that proof in the broadcast too or at least
    verbally confirm we had it.

    So yeah, Punk said it, Colt published it and that seems pretty fair to me.

    ReplyDelete
  52. Two stray thoughts on this issue:


    1) There is a reason why Diesel didn't face and beat Yokozuna at WM10, and Cena over Guerrero at WM20. THEY WEREN'T READY. Same goes for Reigns here.



    2) Whoever mentioned Undertaker at WM13 nailed it. It's like they drew Undertaker out of a hat as a challenger, he was just one out of a few guys who could have got the shot.

    ReplyDelete
  53. I think it was the timing of the drunkenness, as opposed to the drunkenness itself.

    ReplyDelete
  54. Yeah. I don't know how much libel laws differ in the States but under UK legislation Colt would be culpable as the publisher of the alleged defamatory comments. The onus would then be on him and Punk to prove those claims, should a libel action take place.

    ReplyDelete
  55. First of all, there's nothing to combine. So far, it's just one lawsuit that's been filed against Punk and Cabana. If Punk countersues Amman, it could be for malpractice, but that would be his cause of action alone. Then you could combine those two suits and proceed. As for Cabana, an element of defamation is publication and Cabana's podcast is how the statements in question were published. There's a commentor below who explains it better, but he was rightfully sued. The question is whether he's liable, and his lawyer can argue that he should be dismissed from the suit.

    ReplyDelete
  56. I never really heard of him until he came in as Ambrose. But I definitely thought he had the most potential of the three.

    ReplyDelete
  57. The early nwo defined Cool Heel.

    ReplyDelete
  58. Sort of like when they had the Undertaker basically legally murder Jimmy Snuka at Wrestlemania 7. It wasn't that they were burying, pun intended, Snuka, it's that they were saying that Taker was a killer who would crush guys.

    ReplyDelete
  59. Except he didn't say they were the same thing. He said he transitioned from cool heel to anti-hero, which means they are two different things, even if they share 99% of the same dna.

    ReplyDelete
  60. Not all tweeners are the same type of tweener.

    ReplyDelete
  61. Punk bought Mercury a house when he didn't have the money to pay for it and he's extremely hard-headed when it comes to what is right in his mind. I can definitely see Punk paying for Cabana's defense in this case.


    I really don't think WWE understands that although they got Brock, Austin, Ventura and Warrior to come back that Punk may be a completely different animal. Maybe he's the same, but it really doesn't seem like it -- he's not just in it for money like Austin (to an extent) and Brock, doesn't just have a monetary grievance like Ventura, and didn't look at Vince as a father figure like Warrior.


    Unless he somehow blows all of his money, and so far he's found ways to continue to make more money even after quitting WWE so that is unlikely for many years at least, I don't see Punk caving in to WWE anytime soon, if ever. Even if the UFC fighter thing fails, which is extremely likely, he can easily slide into the broadcast side of things especially with UFC expanding broadcasts. Just getting into the octagon gives Punk a level of authority and he's already proven to be a very good talker and broadcaster in pro wrestling.


    I just have a feeling that this one of those cases where WWE should have left well enough alone because it really can open them up to more lawsuits and it's all just because WWE has to feel like they "won." Even if it doesn't, why go through with this suit? You pissed the guy off on his wedding day. It probably didn't ruin the day, but it almost certainly irks him even to this day. Short of pissing him off on the day his child is born there really aren't many other times you can anger someone more. So they got their revenge, let it go and walk away.

    ReplyDelete
  62. Question: because Amman appears on WWE's broadcasts as part of its angles (he was cited by name and interviewed as part of Zayn's injury angle for example), would he be considered a public figure, rather than a private figure, for determining the standard that would have to be met for a lawsuit to succeed against Cabana?

    ReplyDelete
  63. That definitely would've been the way to go!

    ReplyDelete
  64. That's a really interesting question/wrinkle. Unfortunately I'm just not knowledgeable on the subject matter to even hazard a guess.

    But that's definitely the kind of research rabbit hole I can see myself falling into the next time I have free time. Great thought.

    ReplyDelete
  65. YankeesHoganTripleHFanFebruary 26, 2015 at 11:36 AM

    I saw the shield break up one night

    Seth took a chair and nailed ambrose and Roman

    Reigns went on his own to fight

    But he went on the shelf his groin was hurtin.

    Bryan returned along the way

    But he was kept down by the authority.

    Vince turned to Reigns to say, hurry boy Brocks waiting
    there for you.

    It’s gonna take a lot to take your push away from you

    There’s nothing that a hundred smarks or more could ever do.

    I bless the Reigns at Wrestlemania

    I bless the Reigns at Wrestlemania

    (I bless the Reigns)

    ReplyDelete
  66. Not roddy piper
    Not the freebirds.

    ReplyDelete
  67. I understand he said they arent the same thing

    But if they share 99% of the same dna (your words) then wouldnt be the same thing?

    Essentially?

    ReplyDelete
  68. Stick to writing in comment sections like the rest of us.

    ReplyDelete
  69. Brock was perfect for the PPV era -- his first few PPVs were HUGE (Extreme Rules 2012, SummerSlam 2012).

    With no PPV, paying Brock to wrestler on "Network Specials" once a quarter doesn't make financial sense.

    ReplyDelete
  70. You do relaize vandalism and holding a gun to someones head holding them hostage is a crime, right?

    Traditional faces dont do things like that.


    ReplyDelete
  71. And he wasn't a traditional face. There aren't just three buckets for character types.

    ReplyDelete
  72. But 99% of the dna is the same.

    Your words

    So what is it about that 1% that differentiates tweeners wgen tweeners face both heels and faces?

    Plz explain that

    ReplyDelete
  73. Opponents and motivations.

    ReplyDelete
  74. Very impressive. This is probably the first one you've done that I actually want to go buy.

    ReplyDelete
  75. "But then again, what other company, besides the dying version of WCW,
    would have one of its stars as a key participant in the World Series
    parade, and never even mention it on their television show?" - Dave Meltzer

    This. It's so insane how much WWE purposely tried to cool off Bryan's heat.

    I mean, you have Vince doing everything he possibly can to capitalize on the Jon Stewart/Seth Rollins thing, and Bryan being a World Series parade guy doesn't get a mention on TV

    ReplyDelete
  76. Its face heel twenner

    If there is something else, let me know

    ReplyDelete
  77. they all face the same people.
    they all want the title.

    So how does that change anything? They are all wrestlers.

    ReplyDelete
  78. We seem to have a fundamental difference in terms of how granularly one should define wrestling characters. That is ok but I don't think we're going to get anywhere other than me responding to you by being specific and you responding to me by being general.

    ReplyDelete
  79. It was in Bret's book too.

    ReplyDelete
  80. There are two types of baby faces that draw at the top -- the Cena/Hogan types and the sympathetic guy who fights against all odds (this was Austin, then Rock in 2000). To me, they don't know how to do the creative booking that gets Reigns sympathy and after 10 years of SuperCena, I don't think the crowd is ready for the Samoan version.

    ReplyDelete
  81. We have a difference and thats because you attribute character traits to the terms faces heels and tweeners, instead attributeing the traits to the characters themselves.

    I feel that you are wrong or misinformed or maybe i am... but i dont think so

    ReplyDelete
  82. I don't think that being in the press has anything to do with (law school and the bar were ten years ago, though). I think you can be nailed for defamation if you stand in a public square shouting lies about people that damage their reputation. That counts as a "publication."

    The key is remember that "publish" doesn't equal "press" or "media," it just equals "making public." You can defame someone with a Facebook post, for instance.

    Anyway, I'd have to re-listen to the podcast to listen to exactly what Colt said (as opposed to what Punk said), but he generally presented himself as endorsing Punk's perspective, if memory serves. I don't know how easily he'll be dropped from this case.

    ReplyDelete
  83. Okay, hold on a second....my bullsh*t meter is going off:
    "My wife came up with the bird dance."

    Oh really???????????? (see link below)
    http://www.myvideo.de/watch/6116123/Morris_Day_The_Time_The_Bird

    Anybody who's seen Purple Rain: I don't think Koko was doing The Bird prior to 1985 (when Purple Rain came out)....he was in the PYT Express....come to think of it, he used the Morris Day theme in Memphis and Mid-South....

    Solid review/interview, and Koko seems like a cool guy, who's found God....but I call BS on this one point.

    ReplyDelete
  84. I got this on audio but never listened.

    I did however watch the "got heat" RFV and koko talked abt the keirn fight

    Them florida guys are dicks

    ReplyDelete
  85. You wonder if Cena's split responses (as long as he was facing anyone besides JBL) began even earlier, yet we just couldn't tell since Smackdown was a taped show.

    ReplyDelete
  86. He's a "Scotsman"...?

    ReplyDelete
  87. I think the thing that hurt Reigns the most is them putting him on this schedule to win the WWE Championship a year ago that they refuse to stray from. The guy's not ready, the fans aren't excited for it, but they're sticking to it. If they just let him do his bad ass thing in the midcard he'd organically get over to the point the fans would want to see him get in Brock's face or whoever. But that might take some time, and apparently if he doesn't become the top guy in six weeks the world as we know it will end.

    ReplyDelete
  88. Baseball's barbaric! Someone could die.

    ReplyDelete
  89. Austin was an anti-hero. He wasn't out to be a good guy, he wasn't trying to be a hero, he was just fighting his enemy and if you happened to hate his enemy to, even better. Rock was the cool heel - he's the bad guy in the story but he's entertaining so you like him, you're just not cheering for him in the story.

    ReplyDelete
  90. Charismatic eNegro Jef VinsonFebruary 26, 2015 at 1:02 PM

    I agree. I just tolled my eyes at this point, but granted McMahon had probably never seen Purple Reign until this year so Koko got away with one.

    ReplyDelete
  91. The Cena split crowds thing started at Summerslam 2005, 5 months after he won the title. To say it started a couple of years into his reign is actually revisionist history.

    ReplyDelete
  92. Roddy piper wasnt cool?

    Ymmv, but piper was cool as shit.

    ReplyDelete
  93. My feeling abt why ambrose isnt as high as I feel he should be is because,

    1. Vince

    ReplyDelete
  94. I only saw his heel stuff in the 80's after I knew him as the obnoxious old fool of the 90's so that probably ruined it for me.

    ReplyDelete
  95. Even Del Rio was doing *pretty* well before Big Show (although I have to admit there were a couple of pretty cool moments in that feud like when Big Show destroyed the ring.)

    ReplyDelete
  96. That's not even remotely true.

    ReplyDelete
  97. On this we agree, that dude was fucking cool. Putting up posters on the steel cage? C'mon.

    ReplyDelete
  98. A "Craptology" if you will.

    ReplyDelete
  99. Charismatic eNegro Jef VinsonFebruary 26, 2015 at 1:13 PM

    What's with the execs over at Titan Towers getting out of pocket with the wrestlers?

    ReplyDelete
  100. Test was way more ready for the title in 99 than Roman is now. Test was over like rover after the Shane feud and I'm actually kind of disappointed that he wasn't the mystery man at Survivor Series 99. They could have MADE Test that night and the fans wanted it.

    ReplyDelete
  101. Actually, the past month I reviewed Ernie Ladd, D-Lo Brown, and Koko who all came of as good people.

    ReplyDelete
  102. What I don't understand is how Big Show and Kane are being used. Both guys are at their best when they are playing comedic face characters, so instead they have them stomping around as boring corporate heels. A Big Show/Kane comedy tandem in the style of Team Hell No would probably be a lot of fun.

    ReplyDelete
  103. Disqus isnt loading right for me right now, so all my replies are gonna go here.

    Re: face/heel

    Im not saying that the cool heel doesnt exist. Thats not my debate.

    My stance is that if you are steamboat in the 80s, then you are more than likely a tweener
    Same goes for iron sheik, you are a tweener.

    Cool heel/aanti hero = tweener.

    Now if you are programmed with sheik and you are austin ofc he will be the face in the match.
    but if you program the rock against austin, who gets booed and cheered?

    Both do, cuz they are tweeners.

    What they do outside the ring is up for you to like/ddislike bbut in the ring (aand thats wwhat ccounts) is too much gray. you cant clearly define those two as a face or a heel and I feel that hurt the business cuz after you have such personalities for so long, when it ame time to scale back, everybody clearly on either side of the face heel line was seen as archaic.

    ReplyDelete
  104. Christian is the original Daniel Bryan. His heat in 2005 was off the charts, and they buried him.

    ReplyDelete
  105. Which brings me back to the hyperbolic baby boys point. Pump up the praise to those other shows for the purposes of dumping on WWE. No where am I saying those shows aren't good & that WWE isn't bad right now. I'm just addressing what lame zilch baby boy faggots this blog is infested with. And to paraphrase Louis C.K., I'm not calling you homosexuals when I refer to you as faggots, I'm calling you faggots because you're being fucking faggots. It's gross. Take it down a notch is all I'm saying. Think about getting a life.

    ReplyDelete
  106. Yeah i'm pretty hopeless but got to start somewhere!!!

    ReplyDelete
  107. Thanks Scott!!!!

    ReplyDelete
  108. Google "the scummy"

    ReplyDelete
  109. Disregard, I should have checked it myself.

    Basically the scummy is a list of wrestlings road stories.
    mostly rumors, but if you are taking a shit, its a cool read

    ReplyDelete
  110. From Vince's POV, if a true story... Andre was one of the McMahon Family's biggest Gravy Train throughout the 1970's and 80's, bringing in money even when being leant out to other territories. The Freebirds were outsiders known for their questionable behavior and were probably brought in with a short leash.

    ReplyDelete
  111. As much as I rank on Koko and the WWE Hall of Fame, he was one of my favorite undercard guys growing up. Maybe it was the bird. Even though he lost, he was always full of energy and the crowds loved him.

    ReplyDelete
  112. Again with the "get a life" nonsense - it's you assuming that those who post here do so exclusively at the expense of any other activity. Posting here takes up a small amount of my time. Like it does yours. And at least I derive some pleasure from it whereas you seem to be annoyed by what you see here. I'd be tempted to throw the "get a life" comment back at the guy who visits sites full of people he dislikes so he can try to post angrily and at them. So indeed I will.

    ReplyDelete
  113. The Amazing GamecockFebruary 26, 2015 at 2:19 PM

    PowerPoint!!!!

    ReplyDelete
  114. There aren't really any regulations on podcasts? Really? So I can say whatever I want without any consequences just because I put it on a podcast instead of in print? Come on.

    ReplyDelete
  115. Anything to justify pathologically carrying on about the wrestling show. I've been on this blog for years & I point this out once. I refer to the people that are here day in & day out-week in & week out to bitch & complain & pile on. I find it fascinating more than anything. There are people here that take issue with every segment/moment of a Raw. It's truly bizarre to see the complete lack of self-awareness. And watch the severe case of the oh noes when somebody isn't likeminded. The lonely boy squad is going to "chase them off".

    Look out, they might have to pull out the hot pokers rating system! Get a bunch of good ones over on the wrestling show. lol I enjoy, but for different reasons.

    ReplyDelete
  116. He used the Morris Day & The Time music in Memphis and UWF as well

    ReplyDelete
  117. I would say the only wrestling gimmicks that were never ever in danger of being shit in/on would've been Savage and Haku's crown. How many people have shit in JBL's hat?

    ReplyDelete
  118. Yeah total BS like Luger saying something to the effect that the first time a video was made for a wrestler was the one WWF made on his bus tour. At least Luger said, "I think" and honestly Luger doesn't seem to know much about pop culture, but jeez that was a dumb comment.

    ReplyDelete
  119. Counter argument: Goldberg

    He developed an emotional connection and people paid to see him...when he was invulnerable.

    The minute he showed weakness...that aura of invincibility gone...he was done.

    Now, Goldberg the Unstoppable Monster is, like The Ultimate Warrior was, ultimately limited to one storyline one time.

    But, it was still better than what they've got right now with Reigns.

    ReplyDelete
  120. A "babyface/hero" is a character who always tries to do what's right.

    A "heel/villain" is a character who commits misdeeds.

    An "anti-hero" is a babyface character with a villainous personality who ultimately acts in a heroic manner.

    A "cool heel" is a villain who speaks & acts in a manner specifically designed to garner popularity, but ultimately commits misdeeds. They may pretend to be an anti-hero to achieve their goals, but their true villainous nature will eventually be revealed.

    A "tweener" is a term WWF/E used to designate a character that vacillated between being a babyface and a heel. No character is ever really a tweener for long because their actions will eventual brand them as either a hero or a villain. No true hero nor villain can be viewed as a tweener except during a period when they are actively switching from one to the other; only an anti-hero or a cool heel can maintain tweener status for any length if time, but eventually they will be viewed as falling on one side or the other. As such "tweener" really doesn't hold the same status as the other terms as it is transitional. One could even argue that "tweener" doesn't really exist, as it refers to a character during that state of transition.

    ReplyDelete
  121. Can't beat classic PP!!!

    ReplyDelete
  122. How many people have made that claim? (Freebirds, Lawler, Luger...)
    On a related note, how many claim to be the first ever to use entrance music? (Sgt. Slaughter, The Freebirds.....again, Gorgeous George.....)

    ReplyDelete
  123. So, would you do Lesnar vs Rusev THIS WrestleMania? Just to do the streak vs streak killer thing?

    If not...the the streak matters less than there being a Strong Face vs Monster Heel pairing...and what the WWE doesn't have right now is a Strong Face.

    Their fault.

    ReplyDelete
  124. Pretty sure this was halted because of the "Christian's too ugly" reason...that's probably part of the thinking towards Bryan too.

    ReplyDelete
  125. I know that WWE Creative doesn't want to do what the fans think they're going to do...so, sometimes they'll ditch a storyline that makes sense in favor of some chaos and some swerve-a-liciousness.

    The Shield:
    1) Should have stayed together longer. They were over as a unit. They had more to learn in the ring, more stories that could have been told over a longer period of time and more money to make for the company.
    2) Should have broken up when Ambrose turned on them, not Rollins. Ambrose, the crazy heel, the master of chaos, the one that always went his own way. You could buy him as the one to leave...and you could definitely buy him as a heel whose intensity and unpredictability make him entertaining.
    3) Should have turned Rollins face. He's got face offense (other than the curb stomp) that make you want to cheer for him. He's flippy-floppy, dive off the stadium arch. He's the most invested in the Shield as a group so he'd be the most hurt by them splitting up. He's got natural sympathy and can quickly get over with the fans.
    4) Should have left Reigns as a silent bad-ass. So, The Shield broke up, Reigns shrugs. He's just going to keep on keeping on. Keep him strong, keep him silent...eventually the fans get behind him and he becomes the mega-face--not by being cheesy, not by being shoved down our throats...but because he's undeniable.

    But, for the simple reason of "Seth Rollins turning on the Shield doesn't make any sense...so, because no one will expect it, let's do that"...this entire generation of wrestlers has been dug into a hole that they're scrambling to get out of. (Because the same thing happened to the Wyatt Family split. Seriously, they thought the guy in the sheep mask would be the break out face?)

    ReplyDelete
  126. It occurs to me that most WWE babyfaces are booked like Bugs Bunny. Just think about it.

    ReplyDelete
  127. Hard to develop a Goldberg with 50/50 booking and when winning a secondary title is the start of a losing streak.

    ReplyDelete
  128. At Fastlane, in full view of the hard camera, there actually was a sign that said "IF REIGNS WIN, WE'LL GO HOME AFTERWARDS"...

    ReplyDelete
  129. Well I'll be sure to take the carefully considered life advice and judgment of the guy who goes around calling people "fucking faggots" on the internet. Anyway, I got no dog in the fight really, I just find the condascending troll gimmick very tired and I'd hope someone who enjoys Louis CK may be able to do something more worthwhile and positive with their time. Nevermind.

    ReplyDelete
  130. But we NEED Big Show and Kane in there. I mean, they're big! And old! Smell the interest!

    ReplyDelete
  131. Bingo, I've been saying the same thing....this rush to make this "the guy" at Wrestlemania when the crowd reactions don't justify it...YET ("yet" being the key word) is baffling.

    ReplyDelete
  132. Is it so hard to limit Reigns' talking to: "Roman angry. Roman SMASH!" He's a big(ish), dumb guy. That's how you book a guy like Goldberg or Ryback or Reigns. It's that simple.

    ReplyDelete
  133. Not in law school yet but shouldn't you put a disclaimer or something on your post? what if colt/punk read this and use your advice? Hell, what if a BODer in a similar type of situation does so?



    NOTE: This is not legal advice.

    ReplyDelete
  134. Well, there could be an aiding and abetting claim against Colt, haven't really gone through enough torts though

    NOTE: This is not legal advice

    ReplyDelete
  135. probably just WITW

    ReplyDelete
  136. That might make it federal, not sure

    NOTE: This is not legal advice

    ReplyDelete
  137. This is something that I've heard a lot....I don't necessarily disagree with it, but even more, I think a lot of his talking is REALLY stupid/cringe worthy. Only the Rock can pull that stuff off and not completely lose his heat. If his dialogue wasn't so stupid, he wouldn't be as bad.

    ReplyDelete
  138. *superstars.

    ReplyDelete
  139. imo Cena seems to be one of the very few guys that has a character.




    the "problem" with this (for the company) also is that if people like the character they don't care about the actions anymore. best example was CM Punk still getting cheered after he poured the ashes out of Undertaker's urn. at that point there was NOTHING that he could have done, he would always get cheered from a certain percentage of fans.


    (same with guys like Flair, Edge, Michaels and even Ziggler)

    ReplyDelete
  140. "Then they killed his cool character."

    It think that was far worse than him being pushed that strong.

    ReplyDelete
  141. although I glady take a rushjob like that over stuff like Miz/Mizdow or the whole Adam Rose/Bunny thing literally being dragged out for months.

    ReplyDelete
  142. Who were the assholes that voted this shit? Fuck you, people. >:(

    ReplyDelete
  143. This week is all recent releases. I will put a bunch on the poll tonight.

    ReplyDelete
  144. Or Piper...or Mick Foley.....or even, God help me, Kevin Nash.



    NONE of whom Reigns is even remotely close to on the mic, or in the ring for that matter.



    Yes, I said Nash was a better worker than Reigns in the ring. At least he did a (bit) more than just lie around and wait for SPEARSPEARSPEAR....people forget that Nash could tell a helluva story in the ring, with the right opponent and the proper motivation.

    ReplyDelete
  145. I mean, there were YES signs all over SF, even newspapers were putting them in there for fans to have (there's one in my office). And while they're tripping over themselves for Michael Sam, the baseball champs are aping one of their big guys, and they don't say Jack shit about it.

    Anyone anti-Bryan can literally eat a dick.

    ReplyDelete
  146. I really don't get that either. Is it REALLY so fucking hard to listen to a crowd, go "They're massively HOT for [insert wrestler's name here], let's push him, and give him the belt!" and make money hand over fist? I mean, the WWE is actively going in the OPPOSITE direction, year after year at this point. Like HartKiller said, Reigns, given the spot Cena is in now with Rusev, and being booked to go over strong for the US title, could be a hot commodity for NEXT year's Mania, while obviously, Daniel Bryan beating Brock Lesnar is the story this year. Let Rollins cash in and be the Corporate champion Bryan is chasing, if you don't want to keep the belt on Bryan. It's NOT fucking rocket science, and yet....and YET....

    ReplyDelete
  147. Gotta love Vince and HHH saying they have no beef with Punk. No wonder Trips has a gigantic fucking nose

    ReplyDelete
  148. TOO LOGICAL GODDAMMIT! LEAVE THE BUSINESS TO THOSE WHO ARE IN IT, PAL!

    ReplyDelete
  149. And like how WWE ignored Bryan's Giants publicity, the mainstream media and Michael Sam himself completely ignored WWE's invite

    ReplyDelete
  150. Yep. HHH got the rocket push, too, but he didn't go from Shawn's bag carrier to world champion in 3 months.

    ReplyDelete
  151. Damn, how many times has the King's crown had someone shit in it?

    ReplyDelete
  152. Me too, I just had so many Fs at one point and needed D help, he was actually the lowest scoring guy I had, and he was finding net.

    ReplyDelete
  153. It's not the changing PPV model that did Brock in, it was 100% the booking. Jobbing in his first match back, jobbing in his first WM back, and drawing the Trips feud out far longer than anyone wanted... those are what turned him from Brock Friggin' Lesnar to Just Another Guy. The recent "Reign of Invisibility" certainly didn't help, either.

    ReplyDelete
  154. I know right? I think on the video end it is the Freebirds or Von Erichs, but for music that would have to be Gorgeous George or someone else from that era. The first to use rock music is harder to pin down -- it could be the Freebirds, but it might be Junkyard Dog or even Dusty Rhodes somewhere along the way. But I'm sure Hogan has taken credit for all three as well as Hayes doing the same.

    ReplyDelete
  155. I guess it was probably due to him being on one year deals and being sort of flakey but it's too bad it took them so long to get serious about pushing him.

    ReplyDelete
  156. Nope, no issue with him except that Punk didn't consider it a giant honor to wrestle Triple H at Wrestlemania and instead wanted to live his life without the constant validation of a senile old man in Connecticut with the biggest chip on his shoulder. WWE has no sympathy when letting people go, but heaven forbid anyone leave when they've fulfilled their contractual obligations. I hope Punk wins his UFC debut just for the simple pleasure of knowing it will piss off Triple H and Vince McMahon. If he were to get KO'd there is no doubt that Cole and/or JBL will be mocking it on Raw for weeks.

    ReplyDelete
  157. Nash knew how to work he was just limited in what he could do, and he knew that.

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  158. why break them up after all? I remember several guys on this blog mentioning the Four Horsemen as a good model: them being a stable didn't keep the members from having their own singles or tag team feuds.

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  159. Reigns did his first singles job to the fucking Big Show. That's all you need to know about this company's inability to create new stars.

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  160. I agree with you there.

    But, I also know that WWE doesn't see things that way. They've cooled on stables, there's hardly any managers or valets and they keep splitting up tag teams. It's a shame that they limit their storytelling to "guys who only have vague reasons for being wrestlers and no particular motivation engaging in single combat with others who are all basically the same."

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  161. Was that jericho/cena or the 3way with christian/hericho?

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  162. I don't remember thinking that was going to happen, but that just underlines how desperate the build was - hype a match that isn't going to fucking happen under any circumstances.

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  163. Then review new jack menace to sobriety!

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  164. Is that the one with Starman?

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  165. I'm just pissed we're not getting Brock/Bryan. That match would be the best David/Goliath match ever. Could you imagine how much of a babyface Bryan would have been? I dont care when it happened....it's a crime against wrestling we won't see it.

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  166. George has always been attached to introducing music

    The birds are attributed to introducing rock music

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  167. The dynamic worked. Orton gets mistreated by the McMahons so he decides to go hard as a motherfucker to destroy the McMahon family and ruin HHH's life.


    The match sucked, but the build up to Wrestlemania was very well done. That's what made the match so disappointing. They built up a blood feud and didn't play it off

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  168. That was pretty funny at times, actually. His 2004 Shoot and Undercover is my favorite from him.

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  169. 04 is the holy grail of shoots.

    But 2012 is dope (the terri/abby one)

    Menace to sobriety is awesome if you partake in any chemicals.

    Live and uncensored is good but more of a greatest hits.

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  170. Have you seen 98 and 99 ecw timelines with jack and rvd respectively?

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  171. 98 was solid. Weird to see Jack so subdued.
    99 started off decent but finished flat.

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  172. His rant on RVD from Live and Uncensored made me laugh. That and the fact he could not correctly pronounce "Ketel One."

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  173. Harlan Leverage IIIFebruary 26, 2015 at 5:46 PM

    It would take a braver man than I am to shit in the Undertaker's urn.

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  174. That wasn't my point. My idea wasn't primarily about Streak vs Streak, that was just an added bonus to the whole thing. It was about putting a strong babyface over Lesnar, and since Goldberg is the epitome of a powerhouse wrestler and one of the most over superstars of all time, I used him as an example. The fact that he had an undefeated streak of his own would just make the build-up sweeter since you could tie it in with Lesnar ending a streak just a year earlier.

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  175. To me, that's a somewhat flimsy excuse. While the injuries aren't the same, Roman Reigns has had serious injuries in which he's had to take time off to recover, how do we know he won't be susceptible? I know a neck injury is a different story, but say you do put him on top......and he gets injured? What's the big deal, you go to the next guy. Vince likes to rewrite things on the spot anyway, just doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me, given what they already do.

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  176. I recognized that wasn't your point. :)

    Discussion, not argument.

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  177. On George I agree with Fuj.....if you consider that to be a music video, the earliest one I can think of is Jerry Lawler "Bad News" in the 70s

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  178. I would agree but add the Von Erichs were the first to use "good" rock music as an entrance. Freebird is so slow for an intro. Stranglehold and Tom Sawyer all day lol.

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  179. Cena vs. Reigns at 'Mania (with Reigns going over, of course) would be awesome. I'm sure Cena could carry Reigns to a four-ish star power match.

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  180. That's what turned me. Angle should've gone over. Losing to Cena over & over drove me nuts. I will never forgive Cena fo that shit

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  181. Charismatic eNegro Jef VinsonFebruary 26, 2015 at 7:13 PM

    He. Used it in WWF as well.

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  182. Charismatic eNegro Jef VinsonFebruary 26, 2015 at 7:15 PM

    Koko will always be famous for doing a 6 man match with the Killer Bees. He wore the mask and did the "mask confusion" switch and it caused Jesse the body to spaz out on the air.

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  183. A hernia is a bit different than nearly breaking your neck and losing the strength in your arms.

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  184. The Piper run in was insane. I'm pretty sure I left my seat.

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  185. If only WWE faces were booked as well as Bugs. Rabbit Rampage was Elmer Fudd's ONLY win over Bugs.

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  186. One of the best examples of extremely limited sports entertainers putting on one hell of a show.

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  187. I always thought that Koko was mentally challenged as a kid.


    He seems like an ok guy from this though.

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  188. At least Bryan does the diving headbutt protected.

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  189. It is more than one dude. One of my missives is in there, but i didn't wrote all of that.

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  190. and kane vs angle in a total clash of styles and a waste of angle's talent being dragged down by that slug kane in a pointless match. rvd/regal was another awkward pairing

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  191. who cares get off your high horse, self-righteous one. you sound like a liberal

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  192. It's self-righteous and liberal to expect a corporation to understand rudimentary math? You crazy, ironmike, but I love ya.

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  193. right because I'm sure no one in the corporation caught on to what you did. you are just smarter then all of them at titan tower, aren't you? you should apply for a job there so they can have someone correct grammar and do all that other self serving bs to make one feel 'smart' and then try to be condescending about it. They decided to call WM 25 what they did for marketing reasons and it makes sense for them to do so.

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  194. Yeah, he actually called you, Dave Meltzer, and as a joke Chris Jericho. Yeah, only you and Dave answered.

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