If you could switch two guys in their prime to a different company, who would it be, where would they go and why?
This is purely from a fun what if scenario.
Off my head, I would love to have seen Bret in WCW circa 93-95 and see him feud with Sting, Vader, Cactus Jack, Flair, Arn Anderson, Pillman, a younger Austin, Rude and others.
s I'd said many time, 1986 Nikita Koloff switched over to the WWF for a run against Hogan would have been EPIC. And then maybe send 1987 Savage to the NWA against Sting and Luger.
My dream move would be to take Sean O'Haire out of WCW entirely and have him come up in the OVW system. He could have debuted in 2002 along with Orton, Cena, Batista, etc and never had that stigma of being "a WCW guy". All these years later and I still think that dude should have been a cant miss superstar.
ReplyDeleteI'd move Owen Hart to WCW when his brother left. Can't think of any great matches off the top of my head, but hey, Owen Hart is probably still alive and kicking today.
ReplyDeleteHopefully no more legs out from under legs.
ReplyDeleteMy god, Savage in late 80s NWA would have been glorious. That gets my vote for sure.
ReplyDeleteAnd here I was gonna say Sting in the WWF....pffft
Eddie, Benoit, Jericho, Malenko, Mysterio, Raven, Saturn, Booker, Kidman, DDP, Kanyon, Ultimo Dragon, etc. could have all been awesome.
ReplyDeleteThat's a compelling one for sure. Maybe O'Haire and Batista would have come up as a tag team, in that alternate reality?
ReplyDeleteCurt Hennig in the Horsemen-era NWA, but then we would never have had the awesome Mr. Perfect character and vignettes.
ReplyDeleteVader in ECW, for an outside-the-box one? Working with Taz, Raven, Bigelow, Douglas, Dreamer, Sandman, RVD, et al
Agreed that Nikita Koloff vs. All-American hero Hulk Hogan would've been off the charts - much better than Rocky vs. Drago (but no footage of this fight exists, since no one thinks they made a Rocky IV).
ReplyDeleteJake the Snake as a Horseman instead of Lex Luger leaves me giddy with the possibilities.
For something a little more recent, 1992 Vader instead of Yokozuna.
I would've suggested Austin against the nWo, but he wouldn't have risen to the same level, even if you replace McMahon with Bischoff, who had a smarminess of his own.
Owen to WCW in 1998 would have been good.
ReplyDeleteHBK in the nWo also would have been cool.
The Bulldogs to JCP/Mid-South/wherever the Midnights are at the time, 85-87 or so
ReplyDeleteThe Freebirds sticking around WWF in the 80s
Jake Roberts in AWA, just to see Verne's coronary event
Destruction Crew to WCW to avoid being the Beverlys
Badd Company (w/ DDP) jumping to WWF with the Rockers
...and my #1 - Jerry Lawler to JCP during Flair's heyday
All four members of 1998 Kai En Tai jump to WCW's Cruiserweight division, in exchange for Mortis and Wrath joining the Ministry Of Darkness madness.
ReplyDeleteHBK WAS in the nWo!!!
ReplyDeletehttp://kulasd.tripod.com/pics/hbknwo.jpg
Good lord, Vince would have made MILLIONS off Koloff in '86.
ReplyDeleteI concur with whomever thought O'Haire in the OVW system - he was a star in the making, but Vince just didn't want to go hard with a former WCW guy.
I wonder what Steamboat would have done if he never moved to the WWF in the first place and kept going under the NWA banner.
Oh man, Savage in his prime in the NWA would've been classic. He could've been a Horseman! Flair/Arn/Tully/Savage in a Wargames would've been badass, as would've matches with Funk, Muta, and Pillman in 1989(had he stuck around that long.)
ReplyDeleteYou got it wrong. Rocky IV is awesome, that's where the series ended.
ReplyDeleteamazing avatar
ReplyDeleteHBK in the original nWo would have been cool, but I'll take original DX (HBK, HHH, Chyna, Rude) over it any day. If Shawn went to WCW, the nWo still would have been watered down and would have gotten stale regardless.
ReplyDeleteWould have liked to see what almost happened with Flair coming into WWF in 1988. Flair vs Savage for the strap at some point in time. But gotta keep the megapowers together because their "EXPLOSION" was gold. So:
ReplyDelete-Savage wins strap at Wrestlemania IV, still getting aid from the Hulkster in dealing with Dibiase and Andre
-Flair jumps to the WWE (perhaps get Dibiase's money involved as the reason why), it becomes a 3-2 situation
-Megapowers enlist the help of Brutus Beefcake. Six man tag at Summerslam
-Megapowers have dissension
-Flair gets the belt with all the cheating in the world, perhaps at a "Main Event" or the Rumble '89.
-Flair / Hogan in the dream match at Wrestlemania V. Hogan wins the title, Savage does a Wrestlemania X Owen evil stare from the aisleway.
-Interview segment at the next tv taping where the Mega Powers tease reconcilliaion a la The Rockers a few years later, only for Savage to snap and turn on Hogan
-The Megapowers explode....in the heat of Summerslam '89.
...I think I just fantasy re-booked.
1998 Nash to the WWF so I can get Austin/Nash.
ReplyDeleteI think Rick Rude changing places with Rick Rude would have been pretty cool.
ReplyDeleteThe Bulldogs in JCP would've been outstanding!
ReplyDeleteI love this. Qualityy out of the box ideas
ReplyDeleteI second the Nash to WWF 98/99 idea for two reasons: fresh monster opponent for Austin, Rock, HHH and because it might have mercy killed the nWo in WCW sooner.
ReplyDeleteRoddy Piper in late 80s NWA, if healthy?
BamBam in late 80s NWA?
Rick Martel in early 90s WCW?
BUT WAT IF THEY START CHANTING DIESEL HURR DURR.
ReplyDeleteWhat do you do with Flair once he drops the title? Feud with Warrior at SummerSlam leading to Hogan/Warrior at Mania 6 and everything plays out the same except Flair lingers around jumping from upper card to mid card?
ReplyDeleteMatches would've been better.
ReplyDeleteKoloff vs.Hogan is good on-paper, but I wonder if 100% roided up Hogan would have dwarfed Nikita Koloff. Koloff was a monster heel vs. NWA guys, but he would have looked a lot smaller against Hogan. Are there any Hogan vs. Dino Bravo matches out there to see how they compare sizewise? That might be a good guide.
ReplyDeleteI'm a little fuzzy on mid 80's NWA... would Nikita Koloff really have been as successful in the WWF as everyone thinks? I know he was super over for a while in the NWA and on paper it seems like evil Soviet Koloff vs. All-American Hogan would (should) draw millionbillion dollars, but I'm not sure. First off, how well known would Koloff have been to the WWF fanbase? Even when Flair debuted 5 years later, some people think that part of the reason he wasn't crazy over upon his debut was because despite Flair being Flair, a lot of the casual WWF audience (IE kids and their parents who took them to shows) didn't know why Flair was being billed as someone special. If that's the type of response Flair received 5 years later, I'm not sure how well the fans would have responded to Nikita. Second, I also think I'm skeptical because I'm afraid he would have been lumped in with Boris Zhukov and Nikolai Volkoff as one of their cousins or something and possibly never facing Hogan save for a random SNME.
ReplyDeleteI could be wrong and maybe Koloff would have had a great run. But outside of Andre and Savage, how many heels did the WWF really allow to get majorly over during that time period? It seems like after the Hogan/Piper feud, they were almost afraid to book a heel so strong that he could conceivably defeat Hogan. But if they let Koloff be Koloff, protected him and made him look like a threat, it probably would have ruled. I'm just not 100% that's how it would have turned out if Koloff jumped ship.
Not to get too side tracked but since we're talking about time traveling (sorta), do any of y'all wish you could travel back to different periods of wrestling and see any specific events/runs? I'm about to turn 26 and didn't really become a 'smark' until around 2000/2001 and even then my smarkdom was in its infancy. I always wished I could travel back and watch ECW in their heyday with the wrestling knowledge I have now. I'd kill to have attended Barely Legal as a mid-20's something. Really, same for the whole wrestling boom from the nWo formation through WrestleMania 17. I always fondly look back on that period but I'm sure part of it is because I was still a mark for a lot of it. I've always been curious to see what the IWC was like in the mid-late 90's and how they felt about the stuff that my mark-self loved. Same stuff can be said for the territory days. I'd love to attend a show in each territory during its hottest period just to compare it to the shows I attended.
Rocky Balboa is fantastic.
ReplyDeleteBruiser Brody 1988...anywhere but Puerto Rico
ReplyDeleteI think the theory is, it would've been easier to hot-shot Nikita. You have him Sickle the fuck out of Hogan during a random segment (let's say that SNME match against Bundy) and you've got an insta-threat. More so if Uncle Ivan's along to do the talking.
ReplyDeleteBy comparison, Flair came along later and was promoted at a much slower rate.
Savage again, but a different date: in about 1990, when he needed a change of scenery and was stuck feuding with Dusty for months. Meanwhile, Sting was dying a hot death as NWA champion and no fresh heels ready to challenge him.
ReplyDeleteThe fight's great, but it's almost TOO much of a 70s throwback, if that's even possible for a Rocky movie. Needed to be better paced.
ReplyDeleteFollowing V? Logical thing would've been for him to team with Beefcake, more as a professional challenge than anything else. Or Duggan, since that's what Savage did after the Hogan program finally blew over.
ReplyDeleteOf course, Arn and Tully were around at that time....
Yeah, Nikita had a freaky enough look that he would've been viewed as an instant threat to Hogan, and in a different way than a lot of the 80s big ugly giant heels.
ReplyDeleteBut, crap, didn't Hogan headline a couple of MSG shows against Nikolai? If that got over, Nikita would've for sure.
I second this. Could´ve made all the difference in the world for the Stinger.
ReplyDeleteI'd switch Gorilla Monsoon with Harry Carey and George Steele with Ruth Ginsberg
ReplyDeleteThose would actually be amazing.
ReplyDeleteI do do that, I want my Flair vs Savgr and Flair vs Hogan programs in the 80s because Ric Flair had something off in that 91-93 (re Jim Herd fucking with him), whereas a late 80s Flair would be red hot. Furthermore I want Hogan to extra ham up the children's role model, and Flair to extra emphasize his love of women and partying.
ReplyDeleteWhich got me thinking, it would have been awesome if after Flair dropped the title, they held him off TV for a while and then had him come back and form the WWF version of the Horsemen.
ReplyDeleteMaybe instead of Arn and Tully debuting as members of the Heenan Family, they start off as loners but have similar success and then in the summer, they join a returning Flair and it's Horsemen vs. the WWF. Hell, Hennig was already on TV by 1989 and you could have had him become the fourth member. Even JJ was working in the front office during that period.
Have the Horsemen interfere during the Mega Powers exploding at SummerSlam and just destroy both Hogan and Savage. Maybe force Hogan and Savage to reluctantly rejoin forces because they can't stop the Horsemen alone.
Would have loved to see the '98 Outsiders head to the WWF for a fun feud with DX in their prime.
ReplyDeleteYou mean Rick Rood
ReplyDelete"Jake enters the Showboat ring to congratulate Greg Gagne on another victory. Hands are extended, but instead of being shaken, Jake gives him the short arm clothesline, followed by the DDT."
ReplyDeleteThat would get replayed weekly on ESPN for six months and SuperClash III gets to 12 buys, but Verne goes ballistic on colour.
And the Bulldogs/MX trying to one up each other on the jobber squashes in the same Saturday morning studio would've been awesome for anyone not named Mulkey.
Michaels jumping to WCW in '96 with the nWo, for the insane promos and self-indulgence.
ReplyDeleteBarely-mobile Randy Savage jumping to WWF to finish his career at any time after '98, just because.
It's temporally impossible, but the heck with it: Scott, I've asked this of others as well, and we all agree that switching 2000 Scott Steiner with 1989 Scott Steiner would have improved BOTH of them from a quality standpoint.
ReplyDeleteShawn Michaels would have gotten chewed up and spit out in WCW. There were alot of big fish there. Alot of HBK's shit-pulling was when he was an upper midcarder, and then, after everyone left/was leaving
ReplyDeleteApparently Vader was approached about appearing in ECW, but he was going to put Justin Credible over so he declined.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G_tkMh0wls
ReplyDeleteFunny how the "hulking up" draws basically no reaction at all. And this was in 1990..!
Uh no. Perfect bookend to the series.
ReplyDeleteI think he could've done okay, he wouldn't have been pulling all the HBK shit, but keep in mind that Shawn was jobbing for most of his career. He'd be the nWo workhorse, which they really needed. He's the guy to go out and barely beat Flair after 15 minutes, or get Racked by Luger or batted by Sting.
ReplyDeleteI think it would've been better for WCW to have Shawn carry some of the main-events.
Nikita was just as big as The Road Warriors at their roided up peak in 85/86 and he was more ripped up than Hogan. Hogan might be a little taller but I don't think it was anything super noticeable.
ReplyDeleteYou are probably right. 1986 Hulk vs. Hercules Hernandez doesn't look like a mismatch and Nikita had 10 lbs more muscle mass than Hernandez. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=corVlgLQ5Mk
ReplyDeleteSting to Vince in '90
ReplyDeleteHe was avoiding jobbing for the last couple of years of his first run. I don't think it's as simple as "lay down for Sting."
ReplyDeleteHe was a huge, huge douche and I just don't think it would work, too many powerful guys working there at that time.
For both guys, really.
ReplyDeleteAhem, according to this re-booking, the Flair-Steamboat series never happens. I was actually fully in support of your whole scenario, until I remembered that.
ReplyDeleteSavage's gimmick worked best as a loner, IMO. That 4th spot in the Horsemen works best with a non-nonsense brute in there, i.e. Ole or Windham.
ReplyDeleteI feel the same way about Monty Brown if he had been a WWE original instead of a TNA guy. He should of been the next Rock.
ReplyDeleteWow, just realized that my hatred of post-Crockett WCW has me without a single guy that I wish had jumped there from the WWF. Although I would've loved to see Greg Valentine head back to JCP after Wrestlemania I, rather than getting stuck lugging Beefcake and Valiant around. Hammer was such an under-appreciated talent.
ReplyDeleteLike someone else mentioned, too, the Bulldogs in JCP would've been great, but I wonder if that would've cost Bret Hart (and HBK) later on. The Bulldogs helped Vince realize how smaller, workrate-based guys could get over just as well as his monsters. Not to mention that the Hart Foundation was floundering in the mid-card before Dynamite got hurt and refused to drop the titles to anyone else.
Paul Orndorff to NWA - BEFORE the arm injury.
ReplyDeleteA lot of Hogan's opponents showed up with a very short build time. A few big segments to put over what a monster Koloff was and he's insta-over, especially against Hogan. For a comparison, Earthquake hadn't been around very long before he faced Hogan, nor had Bundy iirc.
ReplyDeleteI cannot imagine that match turning out good though. Austin couldn't do much at that point and Nash wouldn't sell or bump for him in a hardcore style brawl like Austin was doing at that time, so Austin would end up looking like shit.
ReplyDeleteTrue. Savage/Sting/Road Warriors vs the Windham-era Horsemen would be awesome too especially as a war games.
ReplyDeleteWasn't Windham even there briefly as the Widowmaker somewhere around this time, or was that later on?
ReplyDeleteI gotta be the only person who still defends Rocky V.
ReplyDeleteThe thing people always forget about O'Haire is that he's a junkie scumbag and he'd have self-destructed. Plus WWE always made him cut out the high flying stuff because he was too big in their view, so he ended up wrestling like everyone else. And he was no good at power moves, he had the F5 before Brock and was just horribly sloppy with it.
ReplyDeleteThat legendary run started in the late spring/early summer of 89. I remember watching some of his matches on the Prime Time's that recently aired on 24/7. They're currently up to October of November 89 and he's been around for a few months before that.
ReplyDeleteThat's true but I feel like they were able to quickly get over via the "fat guy" formula. While Nikita was nuts and in crazy good shape, I think it would have taken a little more creativity than what they did with Bundy or Quake.
ReplyDeleteI guess I'm assuming that they'd be bringing it Nikita and expecting the fans to know him based on his NWA run, like they did with Flair, as opposed to bringing in Nikita and just building him up themselves as one of their own guys.
A few vignettes of Koloff looking scary and cutting Communist promos would do the trick. Some token squash matches to get him over as a big scary Russian. It was simpler back then
ReplyDeleteVader putting over ANYONE on that roster would have been madness.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I don't see much mileage coming from O'Haire regardless. Seems like the writing was on the wall in terms of his long term prospects
ReplyDeleteIf Goldberg leaves the Power Plant in '97 and joins the WWF, where does he end up?
ReplyDeleteJericho back to ECW in '98/'99, once he had established his heel persona. Would have been top heel without changing a thing, especially fucking with Taz, RVD, Dreamer.
ReplyDeleteWith us in 2013 complaining about him being on top for the last 15 years. ;)
ReplyDeleteI will never understand Heyman's massive hard-on he had for Aldo Montoya. He just wasn't that fucking good Paul, and I don't care HOW loyal he was.
ReplyDeletePlus he likes to beat the shit out of women. Great guy all around.
ReplyDeleteGordon Shumway
ReplyDeleteAJ Styles to E in 05. When HBK stuck feuding Masters & Carlito. Joe to E in late 06. They were looking for new monsters to Cena. Not to mention matches like AJ/Jericho, Joe/Taker would have been classics
ReplyDeleteNah, he's gone within 5 years from burnout. But his run on top would've made him pretty hated I bet. (taking some spotlight off Austin, rising Rock and HHH, etc...)
ReplyDelete... or would that make him loved? (If HHH never gets to the top, maybe no Steph? No HHH "Reign of Terror"?)
2000 Scott Steiner in 1989 JCP? No. Just no.
ReplyDelete2000 Scott Steiner in 1989 WWF? Vince would fire him in 15 seconds. And then have to deal with a pissed off roid-freak.
Hogan drops the leg: "HOLY COW! And a one, a two, a three!"
ReplyDeleteBamBam in late 80s NWA
ReplyDeleteHappened. I do remember a Windham/Bam Bam match for the U.S. title during Windham's Horsemen run.
Only if we don't lose EVIL! INDEED!
ReplyDeleteConsidering late 90's WCW PoliCorr... not happening.
Or Jackson.
ReplyDeleteOwen in 99. Anywhere but....well you know.
ReplyDelete2005 Samoa Joe to WWE. Put him against Jericho, Benoit, Angle, HHH, HBK, Orton.....
ReplyDeleteThat whole list? All of their legs out from under their legs!
ReplyDeleteWas it late 98 when Bam Bam Bigelow went to WCW? I don't remember exactly but i'd trade him in 98 for Vader in early 98. Vader gets to go back to WCW and regain some shine on his career against Goldberg and the nWo, Bam Bam can go to WWF as the same kind of enforcer that Bossman later became and probably tear the house down against Austin.
ReplyDeleteAnd then the big one: Undertaker to WCW in late 99. Let Taker try out the Bikertaker gimmick, with a different name and a new setting where they don't have to reconcile it against his backstory, under Russo and let him inject some star power right when WCW's main events were getting grim. In exchange send Booker T over to build his way up in WWF without having spun his wheels in WCW and becoming GI Bro.
Since Giant Gonzalez was a stopgap opponent in 1993 for the Undertaker, why not send someone over who had talent, could still scare kids, needed a mouthpiece, and would get credibility? Abdullah the Butcher to WWF!
ReplyDeleteEVIL INDEED! didn't happen until 2000... and it'd still be a worthwhile sacrifice to see these four guys added to what was still the most stacked light-heavyweight roster in US wrestling history.
ReplyDeleteAs awesome as this might be, could we really trust 2005 WWE with him? They might just give him Umaga's gimmick.
ReplyDeletePerhaps, but Umaga was pushed and had some great matches. Still could have been pretty awesome
ReplyDeleteYeah, at this point I'm not sure him being put in the Umaga gimmick would have been such an awful thing, compared to how TNA's used him since 2007.
ReplyDeleteCould we get Will Ferrell doing his Carey impression? Like, immediately taking over for the entire three man booth?
ReplyDeleteChris Jericho in TNA in 2005/2006 (when he would have been free anyway)- He could have worked with Joe, Daniels, and Styles when they were at their best, renewed his partnership with Christian to feud with AMW, and had a dream match with Sting at Bound for Glory. Assuming Jeff Jarrett was stuck in a closet the whole time, sure. If nothing else, it would have been nice for him to be the biggest star in a promotion for once, even if it was TNA.
ReplyDeletewell tbf, he was the biggest star of all wrestling Fall 2008.
ReplyDelete