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Yet another Bryant/hhh/ortonville question

"What are the chances that while the corporation v 2.0  angle is off to a good start that this just ends up that Bryant gets beat by orton next ppv, gets beat by orton at survivor series, gets beat by orton at royal rumble which leads to the return of Super Cena!!~! To take down the evil corporation and Bryant is forgotten about and is wrestling sheamus or some upper mid card guy by wrestlemania? I'd like tto think not but I just got a bad feeling about it all..."


OK, look at it like this:  Wrestlemania is gonna be Cena v Undertaker, that's kinda been known for a bit now.  Brock will be against Rock, we know that too.  HHH is gonna need an opponent to be Vince's avatar of justice in their stupid feud, and apparently Punk wants that gig so he can main event WM and die happy.  That leaves someone needing to challenge Randy Orton for the belt, which would seem to fit Daniel Bryan.  So there you go, sleep well.

Comments

  1. I'd be surprised if Orton has an 8-month reign with the belt. Mostly, because I am not convinced he can avoid strke three.

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  2. Cena/Taker? Good.


    Brock/Rock, Trips/Punk, and Orton/Bryan? Bad.

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  3. Kayfabe moment. At this point does Bryan even get his free rematch? He had a challenger's contract. This would leave them free to deny a taste of Orton forever; forever being until Bryan wins the Royal Rumble. I think they're gearing up for Shield/Orton vs Bryan, RVD, Mark Henry and Big Show at Survivor Series.

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  4. They should do Brock vs Bryan for the belt. Doesnt matter who is champ. That would be the most epic David v Goliath story ever told and would make Bryan the most babyfaced face off all time.

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  5. What will Miz be doing?

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  6. Threadjack

    Hey Scott, are you still planning on NXT reviews? I think you may have picked a great week to start. This week we got Sami vs. Cesaro 2/3 falls.

    Also, more towards the whole Board, how crazy is it that within 3 weeks we've had G1 madness, Summerslam, now this match. There are going to be tons of fans voting for MotY based only on this month and there are at least 5 legit arguments.

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  7. Manning the concession stand

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  8. Why does it always have to be a one-on-one main event? How about Cena, Rock and Bryan vs Triple H, Punk and Orton?

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  9. I think it's Brock vs Taker, not Rock. Not sure if Rock will work Wrestlemania next year. I do think the storyline is to setup Bryan winning the belt at Wrestlemania. vs Orton

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  10. Wrestlemania isn't headlined by six man tags. That's what the other PPVs are for.

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  11. Stranger in the AlpsAugust 22, 2013 at 9:07 AM

    Kobe Bryant deserves to be pushed over Orton. Like George Zimmerman desperately needing a bag of Skittles, he's unstoppable!!

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  12. Touting tweets sent from Dougie

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  13. I would enjoy each of those matches.

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  14. Good lord people. I'm a fairly cynical person as well especially when it comes to HHH and to a lesser extent Orton. But the angle/feud just started. It's way too early to be start obsessing over Bryan getting buried, and it's way too early to start calling it the Greatest Angle Ever!

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  15. How did RVD get in this mix? They're gearing up for RVD vs. ADR. If they do go with that sort of match, Ziggler gets that over RVD (at least based on this week's RAW).

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  16. Wrestlemania 1 says hi. Because adding Orton and Snuka wouldn't have hurt much anyway.

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  17. Charismatic e-Negro Jef VinsonAugust 22, 2013 at 9:19 AM

    So what you're saying is, "let's let it play out and see where it goes."

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  18. I don't think it's fear of burial, but fear of how many losses Bryan is about to take on PPV to those guys, just like Punk. Punk wasn't buried, but HHH still went over. History is right there.

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  19. Using one match from 30 years ago doesn't disprove his point. There's no way any sort of tag match would main event WM nowadays.

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  20. But why? There's no good reason why it can't.

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  21. I wouldn't call Zane/Cesaro match of the year, but holy shit it was good. An easy four+ stars.

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  22. I doubt Taker would want to work Brock. He's to worn down to go in a guy who works...snug, to put it lightly.

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  23. Cena/UT and Brock/Rock on the same show? That would be insane. Also with those two matches on the card would Punk/HHH really be the main event? Don't think so

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  24. Yes and look at the long-term damage that did to Punk...

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  25. YankeesHoganTripleHFanAugust 22, 2013 at 9:36 AM

    Is really good be the card? If so please take my money.

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  26. That's why I said he wasn't buried.

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  27. BECAUSE ITS JUST NOT HOW WE DO THINGS OK

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  28. It stymied his surging trajectory as the money making face of the company. I would say it still remains to be seen that ever happens.

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  29. Simple. After Orton flames out as the Corporation 2.0 Heel Lackey, enter the new hired gun of Brock. Of course, they need to continue putting Brock over, which would mean Punk not getting any real revenge.

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  30. I thought CM Punk wanted to win the Rumble then win the WWE title at Mania?

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  31. Or retain any real heel heat over that time. They REALLY need to change his theme music btw. That would help.

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  32. Bryan beats Orton in the fall, Brock/Bryan at Rumble.

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  33. What are the chances? Fucking zero.

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  34. Your_Favourite_AssholeAugust 22, 2013 at 9:47 AM

    bryant?


    the catalyst is in the storyline?

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  35. This time it's the car tire who will do the job?

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  36. No silly, jobs are for Ryder.

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  37. So.........


    HHH/Punk
    Cena/Taker
    Brock/Rock

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  38. Except for the not drawing as much money aspect. You missed that one.

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  39. He had been fighting Shield with Henry and Show, but everything is subject to change in fantasy booking.

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  40. Do you have evidence to support this or are you just making it up

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  41. I guess I could have been more clear. I think you will see some people voting for it, or at least in the top 3-5 matches. Especially Indy wrestling fans who don't want to count wwe out of bias or whatnot.

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  42. Stranger in the AlpsAugust 22, 2013 at 10:26 AM

    There is no mention of booty poppin' in this post. This whole conversation is baseless.

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  43. Wrestlemania has been main evented by one tag team match, one four-way elimination match and a Triple Threat in 29 years. WWE obviously feels that a tag team match can't headline the biggest show of the year. And considering their thoughts on tag teams lately anyway...

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  44. Lol is that what meltzer said lol?

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  45. Is Rock still a lock to be at Wrestlemania this year? I'd be surprised if he came back to work against anyone at this point, because I doubt a Brock-Rock rematch from 12 years ago is as big a draw as Rock-Cena.


    If we get Cena-Undertaker, which I'm also not convinced of, Brock-Bryan sounds great. The McMahons turn on Orton sometime before Royal Rumble, aligning with Heyman to give Lesnar the belt. Bryan wins the Rumble to set up the match, giving Bryan his Wrestlemania moment.

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  46. I think Steven Ferrari has made the point below better than I could, but I'll add an addendum that the four-way and triple-threat matches were used in situations where they felt that the primary participants weren't enough draws on their own and thought they'd be helped by extra people; neither of those were tag-team contests either.

    If tag team contests were a super draw, you can bet they'd have done it a lot more than 1 time in 30 years. In fact, if you look at the number of main events on WWE PPV that were tag team matches vs. singles matches over the last 30 years, that percentage only *slightly* goes up, and only because of the original Summerslams and Survivor Series, both of which you'll notice abandoned tag team matches / 4 on 4s years ago (with SS only recently bringing that back).

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  47. I don't see anyway Orton holds that belt until wrestlemania

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  48. From the observer this week, it looks like Rock is out of Mania 30. Brock and Taker is a possibility, although I would have Lesnar win the Title at the rumble and put Punk over at Mania.


    Either way, I don't see Bryan in the WWE title picture at Mania, I just don't see how they keep him strong without the title until Mania, and if he wins it before then, he'll cool off because his appeal is as the underdog trying to prove he can be the guy in the WWE, and once he gets the WWE Stamp of Approval, he loses that edge.

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  49. Losing the World Heavyweight Championship to Bo Dallas in an epic face vs face match.

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  50. Orton and bryan are headlining night of champions

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  51. I agree with others that it'll be difficult to sustain Bryan's chase until WM without making him look weak. Rock vs McMahon-Helmsley regime in 2000 was blown off after 6 months and Rock won the title after 4. I guess Austin's title chase from Sept-98 to WM15 worked well though.

    The only way to do it though is to have Bryan feud with other ppl apart from Orton (eg HHH, Shield) like Austin did with Taker or Rock did with Big Show. They also need to make sure Bryan looks strong and have him outsmart the McMahons every now and then. Austin didn't have the title in late 98 but he made Vince wet himself, attacked him in hospital etc. HHH in particular will need to let his character be humiliated occasionally.

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  52. I really, really wish Triple H would take a break from wrestling in high profile matches. He seems to have taken to the Undertaker philosophy of wrestling only a few dates a year, but he's picking every hot angle to attach himself to. If Rock is gone, then I'd still run Cena/Undertaker as your main, with Brock Lesnar taking on some young hoss that could benefit from a big-stage "slobberknocker", like Roman Reigns. If Triple H must be involved, have him turn on Orton after he loses the title to CM Punk at the Royal Rumble, triggering Orton vs. Triple H. This leaves you free to run Daniel Bryan (Winning the Rumble) and CM Punk for the WWE Title to provide the requisite workrate boost and give the smarks who WILL be attending something to explode over.

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  53. Stranger in the AlpsAugust 22, 2013 at 11:50 AM

    I'm sorry, is it too soon? Am I on The Onion??

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  54. Stranger in the AlpsAugust 22, 2013 at 11:51 AM

    Jesus saves!

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  55. Stranger in the AlpsAugust 22, 2013 at 12:06 PM

    This is the time for Orton to be built up as the uber-super heel, with every face in upper card chasing him for the title, and he keeps finding ways to hold everyone off (hopefully without screwy count out finishes or taking his title and running). Being backed by The Corporation can see to it that the odds are stacked against the face, until Bryan manages to complete the underdog run on the biggest stage by defeating all the odds placed in front of him, and finally beating the douche heel Orton. The bigger picture could be so much better if played out over several months.

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  56. It can be done. Bryan loses the rematch via screwjob. And they told him he can't never get a title shot ever again, so Orton will beat other people while Bryan feuds with whoever HHH throws at him. Then Bryan goes into Rumble as the #1 entrant, wins the rumble and win the title at Wrestlemania. This will keep Bryan strong.

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  57. I will be reviewing NXT tonight while my wife is at City of Sexy Vampires or whatever the fuck that movie is.

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  58. Just out of curiosity but why does HHH HAVE to be in a match at Wrestlemania? Because of the big pay day? Why does HHH need a big pay day? He is part owner of the fucking company.

    If you think about it that's pretty fucked up that he would take a big pay day away from another employee. It's also pretty fucked up that this is an expected practice. Like no one challenges it.

    I mean I know this is HHH and WWE we're talking about, but still. At what point does someone say, "Trips you don't need to wrestle anymore. For the sake of the company please stop."

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  59. I don't think it's too soon per se. It's a weird story of a fat racist who murdered a child which, as it happens, is legal in Florida. It'd be funny if it weren't so tragic, but I don't take offense to joking about it.

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  60. I really hope Orton doesn't keep the belt all the way til Mania. Bryan should totally get the title earlier, defend against Orton and maybe HHH beforehand, and then head into Mania for a title match against the Rumble winner CM Punk.

    Taker-Cena would be awesome though and would fit nicely, as Cena could just come back around the Rumble with a "I have nothing left to prove except ending teh Streak." Bam, insta money match.

    You know what, while I'm here, how does this fantasy booking sound for everyone...
    Night of Champions:
    - Orton retains against Bryan via shenanagins/HHH
    - Punks beats Axel for IC belt. About to get his hands on Heyman until...new Heyman guy Ryback
    - RVD beats Del Rio for WHC

    Oct PPV:
    - Orton retains against, I dunno, Ziggler
    - Bryan runs a gauntlet against all 3 Shield members, last one being Ambrose. Shield finally just destroys him in a triple team after teh Ambrose match. Now for the FINAL man in the gauntlet, HHH, who pinks Bryan after doing nothing.
    - Punk defends IC title against Ryback. Heyman escapes again.
    - RVD beats Del Rio in rematch.

    Survivor Series:
    - Bryan's last chance. If he loses, he never gets a title shot again. Except...
    - Bryan defeats Orton for the title! Thanks to help from Ziggler/Show/Henry holding off teh bad guys.
    - Team Punk defeats Team Heyman in a 4x4 match. Lesnar returns to murderize Punk afterwards.
    - RVD defends against let's say Mysterio.

    Dec PPV:
    - Bryan retains against Orton in a ladder match
    - Punk taps Lesnar out in a cage match
    - RVD retains against EVIL KANE in a table match. Wyatts destroy RVD afterwards. Sandow cashes in, new WHC

    Royal Rumble
    - Cena and Sheamus both advertised to make their returns at the event
    - Bryan retains against HHH in a total Attitude Era style brawl. Replay of Backlash 2000 with all the odds stacked against Bryan. Just when things look their darkest...Do you smelllll what the Rock is cooking! Rock comes down, wallops everyone with a chair (revenge for let's say HHH and his gang destroying Foley on Raw a few weeks earlier), Bryan hits HHH with the YES knee.
    - Sandow retains against RVD
    - Punk wins the Rumble by last eliminating his #1 rival John Cena after a great 20-min finale
    - Also in the Rumble we get a crazy fight between Brock Lesnar and Sheamus. Double-elimination and brawl to the back.

    Wrestlemania 30:
    Streak Match: John Cena vs The Undertaker
    WWE Title vs IC Title: Daniel Bryan vs CM Punk
    Tag Grudge Match: HHH & Randy Orton vs The Rock & Dolph Ziggler
    Street Fight: Sheamus vs Brock Lesnar
    US Title: Dean Ambrose vs Chris Jericho
    Six-Pack WHC: Damien Sandow defends vs RVD vs Mark Henry vs Cody Rhodes vs Alberto Del Rio vs Ryback

    I think that's a pretty logical path that leads to a Mania that has A) Big money-drawing mainstream matches, like Cena/Taker and the Rock/HHH tag match, and B) An awesome "workrate" card that would get over a load of new stars.

    Also, Cena turns heel and joins HHH/Vince to end the Streak. And there's your main direction for the next year.

    PHEW.

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  61. I think the biggest problem with the Punk-HHH stuff was that HHH didn't turn heel. So all that shit did was split teh audience for Punk RIGHT AFTER he had just turned face himself. In retrospect it's insane that Punk was able to get over so huge as a face after spending his whole face turn feuding with Cena and HHH, both uberfaces, and also losing matches.

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  62. TOTALLY. I was thinking that same thing before he came out Monday night. His current music is way too associated with his face run and gets a sort of reactionary pop.


    He needs a slow, boring entrance to piss fans off. Maybe whatever Lex Luger used as The Narcissist.

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  63. Cena/Taker has been set for like 5 years now.

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  64. Piper was never gonna job.


    Otherwise, it would have been Hogan/Piper

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  65. Not sure who gave 2 downvotes, but I have no problem with any of this.

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  66. In this scenario is HHH trying to build up the secondary titles? Would Punk agree to be the IC champ at this point? Plus Punk/Ryback 3 for the IC title seems a bit odd.
    Realistically, if a belt were to go on Punk, it'd have to be the WHC. Which could allow for a build towards unification. Unless DB was losing at WM.

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  67. I don't get the downvotes either. I'd rather have the discussion.

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  68. I just think that Punk with the IC title would make sense based on where they're going, which is a Punk vs Axel match. And once the title is on Punk it would automatically feel important. Personally I don't get why they never put the IC or US titles on main eventers who wouldn't otherwise be in the WWE/WHC scene at the moment.


    Plus Punk vs Bryan at Mania with title vs title just has an awesome "Mania 6 Ultimate Challenge" feel, which work out perfectly since your Hall of Fame headliner this year will probably be the Warrior himself.


    As for the WHC, I think they should just have that scene revolve around RVD for the rest of the year. Especially if the next few months on Raw are gonna feature Orton as the heel WWE champ, it'd be a nice balance to have RVD as a popular babyface WHC on Smackdown.

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  69. The thing is, it's not really for the sake of the company as you say. You might not like HHH, but him wrestling at 'Mania doesn't hurt the company. In fact, it might help the company since he's a proven big star/draw.

    Now to that you might response, "BUT HE'S TAKING A SPOT FROM THE FULL-TIME WRESTLERS WHO WORK THEIR ASSES OFF FOR 364 DAYS A YEAR." But really, do you think that if Trips stayed off the card they'd bump Ambrose or Ziggler or Cesaro or whoever up to take his spot in the card? No, the guy generally only wrestles big-time matches (to the chagrin of many), they wouldn't just stick any old Internet favourite midcarder to take his place. Also, I highly doubt that at this point HHH gets separately paid for his PPV matches the way non-executives do.

    Lastly, there's no guarantee that he will wrestle at 'Mania, that's an assumption (fuelled by dirtsheet rumours/reports) that Scott's making.

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  70. I won't go as far as saying he's not a draw but is he has big of s draw as he tries to make himself?

    What they should be doing is building up those mid card guys so that they don't have use people like HHH in big event matches.

    Plus I still don't believe it's anyone else in the company saying that HHH should be in these matches. I think they are all HHH's idea. Like he's tried to leach himself on to whatever act is hot in the past. And no one in the company has the balls to tell him he's not needed.

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  71. Not sure what you mean exactly by "he isn't as big a draw as he tries to make himself". People always act like he positions himself on the same level as guys like Austin or Rocky, but reading/listening to interviews he pretty much always speaks of them in bigger terms, Austin especially.


    Bear in mind, that when I said "they", I was referring to all of the WWE higher-ups, Trips included, so I agree that HHH is probably quite happy to be part of whatever hot storyline is going on at the moment, but I also don't doubt that Vince is very happy about his son-in-law's inclusion in these angles as well.

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  72. What I mean is that HHH thinks that when he appears in matches at big events it enhances the buyrate. When in fact any shows that he is on that do a good buyrate, such as say, Wrestlemania do so in spite of him, not because of him.


    Wrestlemania sells itself. It doesn't need HHH. Or how about this year's Extreme Rules, it actually did a worse buyrate than last years. Even Brock couldn't save it. And that is 100% because he was wrestling HHH. You put Brock against almost anyone else on the roster and that show does a better buyrate than it did.



    But there is still this idea that HHH is needed on big events or that he'll pop a buyrate on smaller events. And I'm sure that this idea is created by HHH and Stephanie. I don't think Vince really cares as long as it's not hurting business long term. But he'll go along with it to make Stephanie happy.



    As for the majority of fans, I bet most would agreed with me that they would not be sad if they never saw HHH wrestle again.

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  73. I'm sure someone already said this but Metzler said today that the E is operating under the assumption that The Rock isn't coming back. Alverez also said Taker agreed to wrestle Lesnar, that's why Brock went over at Summerslam. Am I the only one who read that? I mean take it with a grain of salt but...

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  74. "Any shows that he is on that do a good buyrate, such as say, WrestleMania, do so in spite of him"

    Um, yeah no, that's wishful thinking on your part. None of the things you say in your next few paragraphs are proof of that in any way.

    The Extreme Rules buyrate still wasn't bad. Were you expecting it to do as well as Lesnar's return match after 8 years? Also, you're right that the Lesnar/HHH feud wasn't setting the world on fire, but their SummerSlam match drew a good buyrate, and WrestleMania this year did a good buyrate, even though HHH/Lesnar was probably the least anticipated of the three main events. So all in all, that's one good buyrate, one great buyrate that can be more attributed to Rocky/Cena II and probably the Streak match, and one disappointing but not bad buyrate. Hardly the flop (from a financial standpoint) you're treating it as.

    "I don't think Vince really cares as long as it's not hurting business long term."

    Exactly. In your original comment you said you wished someone would ask HHH to stop wrestling in these main events for the sake of the company. But it's not for the sake of the company. It's for the sake of your personal enjoyment (or lack thereof) of the guy.

    "As for the majority of fans, I bet most would agreed with me that they would not be sad if they never saw HHH wrestle again."



    Highly doubt it. If you qualified that and said the majority of Internet fans, I'd agree, but as for the general fanbase? Doubt it, but who knows.

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  75. If you want to make Orton even more of a heel, have him RKO Bryan on a chair or something, and then have him shave the beard. Sympathy heat out the ass for Bryan there.

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  76. Rock not coming back is a lock, I think. He did everything he came back to do. Get one more run, cut some money promos, hand off the torch to Cena, main event WM and he got injured twice doing it. He was also gassed to the goddamned gills the whole time (hence the injuries), which means he knows he can't do the wrestling thing full time again. He's too old and been away too long. More money in Hollywood and safer, too. He'll come back to do some promos and such, but I would be shocked if Cena wasn't his last match.


    Taker/Lesnar makes no sense because you have no doubt who's winning that match and I think at this point, Taker really only has interest in doing matches where the result is at least SOMEWHAT unclear going in. Then again, as an MMA superfan, maybe he shitting his tights in excitement at the idea of wrestling Brock (now equipped with legitimate MMA experience!) again.

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  77. Because the IC has, for too long, been a jobber belt. I like the whole "man makes the title, not made by the title" approach, but you should have the ability to do both.

    Ambrose could and should have "made" the US title again, but that requires not only great work by Ambrose and his opponents, but good booking, too. Ambrose and Christian looked set to have a feud that, if they were given time, would likely have produced great matches. Instead, they shitcanned it because I guess they got bored with the idea of a US title feud and now, Ambrose is just another guy. If you didn't know he was US champ, you'd never guess. That belt's got some seriously permanent stink on it.



    And the IC title is worse! That belt is the "win this and you'll sniff 3 minutes of Raw/Smackdown time a month" belt.


    Rehabbing those belts is not impossible, but it's not an instantaneous thing and it's not a one-man job. Putting the IC belt on Punk at any time in the near future doesn't elevate the belt; it devalues Punk.


    And why would a guy driven by a desire to destroy Paul Heyman and be the "Best in the World" even WANT the IC belt? It's not like Heyman's holding the IC title as the crown jewel of his empire. It makes no sense.

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  78. If Brock works snug with Taker, he may kill him.

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  79. I think the angle works better with (yeah, get ready to go insane with rage) Trips having the belt. But it doesn't have to happen yet.

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  80. While I agree under normal circumstances Taker would want an opponent that you could make a case for going over him, as you yourself pointed out, Brock would be an easy exception to that.


    The flip side to all this? Bryan actually getting the rocket strapped to his ass is NOT the done deal most think it will be. I'm genuinely worried Bryan's going to get screwed for real just like all the smaller guys before him.

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  81. Why are you defending someone who isn't needed? Or even wanted for major shows? Is triple h worthless? No but his days of mattering to a mainstream audience are behind him.

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  82. Hey, I agree with your last point about HHH not being needed (although I think the current storyline they're doing would be a lot worse without him since he's playing a character Orton wouldn't be able to play). I just found snapple070's original comment about how HHH should stop wrestling "for the company's sake" hyperbolic, and his follow-up statement that shows he was on that did well doing so "in spite of him" ridiculous.

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  83. Well put. It's also nice to see someone explain their opinion, without resorting to cursing or insulting. I do think triple h over does it at times. I will admit there is way to much hate for the guy.

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  84. I hadn't seen a Smackdown spoiler when I posted this and to be fair it was more fantasy booking anyway.

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