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Regal on Steamboat/Savage?

Was listening to the SCSA podcast and Austin asked Steve Regal what he thought of Savage/Steamboat from WMIII. Regal got really serious and said he appreciates the match but after talking with Ricky about it, he can't ever appreciate it. Austin said he understood and they quickly moved on.

Do you know what Ricky Steamboat told them to sour them on that match?

I'm sure I can think of a few joke answers, but maybe it's the deal with Hogan basically having Steamboat fired for stealing his spotlight?  I really don't know what other deal it could be, since the match has been covered extensively in tons of detail and really the only things of note are that they rehearsed it for months and Hogan was pissed about it being so great.  

Comments

  1. "Brother, I gotta go out there in front of 4 million people and press slam a 900-pound stinky giant and you have to make me live up to THAT?"

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  2. I've heard rumblings of Hogan not loving the fact that his spotlight was stolen, but I never realized it was to the point where Steamboat's job was affected by it.

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  3. Huh, never heard the "Hogan had him fired" before. Thought the standard line was Ricky asked for time off for a baby, Vince gave him A LOT of time off in return.

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  4. Good email. I listened to this on a plane ride and it struck me as weird. We all know the Hogan rumors, but why would regal NOT be able to appreciate it after talking to steamboat? Because it was practiced so meticulously?

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  5. That's exactly my thought. Regal grew up in an entirely different world than Randy Savage, who choreographed these matches to the T.

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  6. To agree to put him over, Ricky had to agree to let Savage have his way with an underage kimono dragon

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  7. Steamboat gave an interview once where he admitted that he wasn't a huge fan of the WM3 match because it was so rehearsed. Maybe that's what they're talking about.

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  8. Doesn't this tie back to what Flair wrote in his book about how Steamboat thought it was fine, but that he didn't really consider it his best match because it was planned move-for-move? That might factor in.

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  9. Regal grew up in a world of hookers (not prostitutes, shooters). Hookers probably have zero respect for a guy who plans a match from bell-to-bell.

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  10. TJ: Speaking of Austin, just finished the Dutch one. Christ, it's nearly two hours, felt like 10 minutes, could listen to them talk for hours

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  11. Judging by crowd reaction Hogan-Andre did just fine.

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  12. Haaaaa!!! Bobby Heenen was right! Hogan was an ego-maniac! Well, obviously. Look, a lot of guys would do the same thing. Cover their ass and protect their spot any way they can. Anybody could see Savage was money and a future, most likely heel, world heavyweight champion. It was inevitable.
    Steamboat however, that match gave him huge momentum. Won the IC Title at the biggest Mania ever, while still a marquee title, and defeated arguably the Federation's next huge breakout superstar. Steamboat had it all. A true, natural, great baby face, a great look, a great karate gimmick, a superb high flyer, electric in the ring, a cool name, but just lacked the crisp promo skills.
    Hogan had to realize both of these men, who just put on an instant classic, leaving the fans on their feet & exhausted, as an imminent threat to his spot & popularity. Savage & Dragon were both ready if called upon.

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  13. That's what I was thinking. Steamboat himself doesn't think too highly of the match.

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  14. My question....do you think things like this affect Macho Man and DDP (noted choreographers) and their place in wrestling history?

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  15. Scream09_HartKillerFebruary 26, 2014 at 7:01 PM

    I was just going to post this, Steamboat apparently didn't consider it a great match because he prefers call it in the ring.

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  16. I think you mean kimodo dragon, although the idea of a dragon wearing a kimono is oddly humorous

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  17. Good thing we're joking about this now, and not in 1989. We might've accidentally given Jim Herd ideas.

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  18. Foiled again....thanks

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  19. Scream09_HartKillerFebruary 26, 2014 at 7:03 PM

    But why wouldn't Savage get fired to?

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  20. To wrestling fans, not really. But among high level workers who really cherish the craft of wrestling, it's possible. Look at how Bret has shown disdain for flair's lack of psychology or how so many old timers hate foley's stuntman style.

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  21. It certainly has a place in history, but Steamboat really didn't gain any momentum after this. If anything, he lost all momentum within six weeks when he was set to lose the title to Butch Reed (ended up being Honky).

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  22. Why'd JR get fired instead of telling Flair to grow up? Life isn't fair

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  23. Politics, man. Hogan felt far more threatened by Steamboat than Savage.

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  24. Probably the choreographedness of it all.


    If Steamboat doesn't like it, why would anyone he's friends with disagree? Especially a guy like Regal that didn't wrestle that way himself?


    If Hogan was really pissed for any longer than the time between the IC match and his own then he's even more fragile that he's portrayed sometimes. Hogan/Andre was sort of a big deal.

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  25. Isn't Undertaker known to be a choreographer?

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  26. Means squat to me. If you consistently have good matches then I don't care how you get there.

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  27. Scream09_HartKillerFebruary 26, 2014 at 7:13 PM

    Triple H didn't grow up idolizing JR?

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  28. http://armyoffourdigest.blogspot.ca/2007/11/autumn-deck-pictures-and-confusing.html



    Towards the bottom, above the comments.

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  29. I just feel like there's a difference between us (fans) and them (the fraternity), and how those men are viewed.

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  30. Not sure if this has been mentioned it but could it be because of the rumor involving Macho Man and Steph?

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  31. I think that you're right. I can't speak for them.

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  32. So you're saying Regal immediately snaps up in response to the Wrestlemania III match, and is short with Steve Austin because of the situation with Stephanie?


    To quote Regal....Sunshine, I doubt that situation is even on his radar.

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  33. Lol, as long as mirrors exist, Triple H is only going to idolize one person.

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  34. Well, I'm not saying Hogan actually had him fired. The baby thing was the impetus, but Hogan was apparently going around trashing both guys to Vince for a long time after the show and wanted Steamboat gone anyway.

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  35. Steamboat was more forthright about his opinion about that match before he started working for the WWE. After he started working for the WWE he started to give the more "politically correct" WWE party line opinion about that match, whereas he did not consider that match too highly before he started working for them.

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  36. See, there's a difference between choreography in spots (which Taker has done and will probably do with Brock), and choreographing the WHOLE MATCH.

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  37. Yeah, Bret is one of my favorites. Sadly, though, he's also one of the pettiest guys about stuff like that.

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  38. I've read that Taker likes to practice his WM matches for weeks in advance, so I took that to mean he's scripting every move.

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  39. ...Why?

    I mean Steamboats great and all but Savage is...well, Savage

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  40. But I kind of like that about Bret. He's a big defender of the art of wrestling and does give respect to other workers. And he liked both steamboat and savage as workers.

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  41. Yeah, I don't get that. Great match(es) aside there was no way that Steamboat was getting anywhere near the main event.

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  42. Highly unlikely!

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  43. He's also a hypocrite about it.


    Bret acting like he didn't have a 5 moves of doom in his shoot with Shawn was ugly

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  44. Scott, did Hogan perceive Steamboat as the same kind of undersized babyface threat that Bret Hart was in 1993?

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  45. Not in the WWF

    He was perfect in Atlanta

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  46. Could that rumor just die already...

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  47. I don't think its hogan. I've heard this come up in a Dave meltzer call in mailbag. (Not the regal reaction but why steamboat had a problem with comparing this match to the flair ones) Steamboat had a huge problem with the match being so heavily choreographed and there was a lot of stuff about the set up and execution of the match. I wouldn't doubt Hogan was mad about getting upstaged (pro tip; he didn't) and pulled some shit but I don't think that would hurt ricky or Steve's opinion. Steamboat really didn't like setting it all up before hand and was mad about how rigid the execution had to be.

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  48. Savage/Steamboat and bret/bulldog Summerslam are matches I WANT to love. Objectively I know I'm matching classic classic stuff, with great crowd interaction, in am awesome environment. For some reason tho I just have zero emotional attachment to either match.

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  49. No chance. Also Stephanie was only like 10 then which is far worse than the (almost definitely bullshit) urban legend claims

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  50. If its because the match is scripted than that is idiotic.

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  51. Bret vs Bulldog is really really fucking great. I don't necessarily understand the appeal for Steamboat vs. Macho Man.


    Granted, I wasn't born when this match happened and the style of wrestling was vastly different back then but never was I more disappointed when I first checked out that match. I still find their match overrated but there's really something that I'm not understanding about it because the match is in such high regard. To this day, I don't find it great.

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  52. That's the difference between the fan and the discerning eye of the wrestler.

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  53. She was 17 the least

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  54. zero emotional attachment? bullshit.


    that tear in your eye when you'll tell Bret it's the best match you ever watched will say otherwise.

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  55. What's wrong with scripting a match? Savage did than with all of his and he's one of the five biggest stars of all time.

    Barry Windham had matches where the spots were called and no one gives a shit about him.

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  56. I think it's because back then, no match really was as fast-paced or had so many near-falls. Matches in 1987 WWF weren't known for work rate.

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  57. My opinion, Kyle, is that Hogan felt he could control Macho more than he could Steamboat, and that Steamboat was different in a way that could possibly upstage Hogan (much like Bret in 1993). He was a good looking young guy with great grappling knowledge...that flies in the face of everything WWF in the 1980s, brother.

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  58. Like DOC, no one can do it better.

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  59. So march 87 she's 10. Yeah the urban legend I'm familiar with had her as a teenager making it more statutory rape and not out kid touching. Like you said below theres no chance this is what regal was referring to, and I honestly haven't heard anything to back it up ever even happening in the first place.

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  60. I care about Barry Windham, I was a huge US Express mark back in the day...

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  61. I think the whole rumor is full of shit...

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  62. I'm with you on this. To these guys calling the match are playing to the live crowd is where its all at. Pre planning an entire match takes both elements away.

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  63. Nothing but from a guy like steamboat it won't get the same respect as a match done the "right way"

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  64. Because Savage never knew how to stir a crowd. Awful way to think about it.

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  65. Im not even sure HHH is telling the entire truth about idolizing Flair. I could swear he talked plenty of shit about Flair back in the past before Flair came back to WWF after WCW's demise....

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  66. We're in agreement about Regal, but the urban legend links Steph and Randy together in late 1994. She would've been 18, so statch is out the window.

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  67. You're in a minority of wrestling fans.

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  68. Bringing the macho/Steph thing up, I firmly am.in the "urban legend camp" but what's so implausible about a testosterone filled superstar having sex with an underage girl? I don't think it's true but I don't get why people just assume it could never happen

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  69. I don't get how Bret-Bulldog is *****, though. It's got a great setting, but parts of that match I just don't dig.

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  70. Steamboat only has himself to blame. I was always a big Steamboat mark but it was incredibly stupid to ask for time off right after winning the title. If he doesnt take time off, I seriously doubt he jobs the title away that quickly....


    ...I believe Hogan was an ego maniac but I doubt he pushed to get the guy fired....

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  71. I was a 9 year old kid when they were tag champs, they were pretty over to me.....

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  72. Screamkiller09 not here...OK I'll try it

    And then, at the Tampa comic expo, with a tear in his eye, and a tremble in his voice, officerfarva explained that he had rewatched the match with me and Davey from Wembley 13 times now on the wwe network and it was unquestionably the greatest match of all time. As I signed his copy of the hart and soul DVD he told me I should wrestle Orton for the title at wrestlemania 30.

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  73. I take it as the guy was a perfectionist. I wonder if Regal thinks any less of the Egotaker who does the same thing every year for Mania....

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  74. Eh, I don't think Ricky Steamboat would've been WWF champion in the 1980s. Around 1992 with the steroids stuff going on, sure (that's partly why Bret got the belt), but not in the late 1980s.


    Steamboat is an interesting character because like Tito Santana, he never played a heel. I like to joke that Steamboat could've taken a chainsaw to Hulk Hogan in MSG in 1986-1987 when Hulk was still on top of the world and the fans would've been chanting "STEAMBOAT! STEAMBOAT!"

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  75. I think it's far more the scripted stuff than Hogan. I could see a wrestler as old school as Regal looking down on it because of how scripted it was. This very well could be one of those things that we just don't get as people looking in from the outside. While not the same, it could be seen as a classically trained and successful actor looking down on a reality TV stars. The idea of a guy like Regal or Steamboat thinking that it's just not supposed to be done that way wouldn't surprise me.

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  76. You couldn't continue the conversation where it was originally?

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  77. I think it is most definitely true that some wrestlers have had sex with 14 year old girls. Tons of fourteen year old girls have sex.


    I doubt the Savage story though.

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  78. Call me crazy, but I like Hogan-Andre. Yes, it's plodding at times, but I think the story of the match more than makes up for it and the setting of the match in front of tens of thousands of people makes it seem like a big freakin' deal.

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  79. Steamboat said that he always thought his matches with Flair were his best because they were called in the ring. He never seemed to think match was his best and said that the fans tell him that was their favorite match of his.

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  80. It could certainly happen but I dont think that is why Macho is public enemy #1 with Vince....


    I really believe it was because Randy took the Slim Jim money with him. Savage even got an on air goodbye from Vince, I cant recall him ever doing that...

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  81. You never saw Championship Wrestling in 1985 I take it

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  82. 14 years old is too old for Jerry Lawler

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  83. You're assuming a lot here.

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  84. 89 had better matches. 00-01 had the better overall angle.

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  85. Flair turned 65 this week. Do you think he can get Social Security? I mean, his taxes were probably some kind of hot mess and hardly ever filed correctly.... do you think he ever paid properly into the system to be able to take advantage of it?

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  86. Something screwy at the Clash to set up one last Flair/Funk match would still have worked better than the hot mess that's the Iron Man tournament, though.

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  87. I always preferred nwa88

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  88. Flair v. Vader in '93. I loved Flair back then. That Flair/Vader match is one of my all-time favorites.

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  89. It was awesome, I recall it being all controversial when Funk put a plastic bag over Flair's head....

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  90. 00-01 had more better matches. By shear volume, there were 12 ppvs and most of them have multiple ****+ matches.

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  91. I feel like WCW always knew Luger v. Sting was it's best draw in the 90s, and wasn't going to waste that shit until one of them was World Champion.

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  92. Your_Favourite_LoserFebruary 26, 2014 at 9:01 PM

    http://dialectblog.com/2011/01/28/dialect-vs-accent/


    now stop trying to be a knowitall

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  93. They wrestled at that Starrcade ...

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  94. They were also putting PPV caliber matches on TV more often in 2000-2001 than in '89.

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  95. It's cheating but I'd extend that from New Year's Raw 2000-WrestleMania X-7.

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  96. I'm talking in realistic hypotheticals, here. Bryan is wrestling HHH at WM. We know this for a fact.

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  97. I like Scott's idea and the other idea on here to run the I quit match at Starrcade and Luger vs sting, muta vs Arn (or Pillman) and Steiners vs Road warriors. But, even though I'm in the minority, I love Starrcade '89 how it was. I liked the matches, but would've preferred the skyscrapers over the Samoans, too bad for sid's injury. I just watched Capital Combat and Wrestle War 90 in the last few days, on DVD not the network (same issues as everyone else at this point), and wondered what those shows would've been like had Sting not gotten hurt.

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  98. Most people who write about wrestling write way, WAY too many words.

    I think skipping the 500-word, ranting like a 14-year old fanboy asides makes it a lot more readable, personally.

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  99. It's not a criticism, but neither is saying somebody writes longer than you.


    Brevity is the soul of wit.

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  100. But she uses expressions and figures of speech that are Eastern European only.


    And actors do dialects, not accents.

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  101. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryFebruary 26, 2014 at 10:08 PM

    It's legal in certain parts of Nevada (where gambling is also legal, but possession of any amount of weed is a felony), but illegal everywhere else in the U.S. AFAIK.

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  102. Eh, a mild irritation with crusaders, and a belief that focusing on words distracts from the real problem. Nothing too serious.

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  103. Crusaders? So...people who fight for civil rights.


    And language does matter, if you disagree, find a black guy and call them a nigger, or a woman a cunt. Just some random stranger on the street.

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  104. He gets a pass considering how hard he's worked this past year for them, I'd hardly call it coming back and taking someones spot...it's his spot.

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  105. I'm sure thats the plan, but it's all down to Punk and his actual reasons for leaving (whatever they are) I mean i could understand him being so angry, but to not to want to come back to finish his end of the contract, he would have to have a massive MASSIVE chip on his shoulder.

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  106. I was going to make a joke about you liking men in leotards, then remembered why we're all here.

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  107. Caliber_Winfield_TCTFebruary 27, 2014 at 10:09 AM

    You're a fair man, Phred, deal!

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