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Clash Countdown: #25

The SmarK Rant for Clash of the Champions XXV (November 1993)

I’ve never seen this show before, actually. Although I have seen Austin v. Pillman a few times, so I suspect it was on the All-Nighter because I used to watch the shit out of that.

Live from Leningrad, FL

Your hosts are Tony Schiavone & Jesse Ventura. This is also the debut for Mean Gene, which is weird because he became so entrenched as a part of the WCW product from here on, so it’s hard to remember it without him.

WCW International Board of Directors’ World Heavyweight Big Gold Belt: Rick Rude v. Hawk

Michael Buffer introduces Hawk as having a “lifetime partner” in Animal. Probably not what he was going for. Hawk wants a test of strength after a bunch of stalling, and that turns into more stalling while Jesse and Tony have a discussion about going to Walmart and buying “posing oil”. I guess bodybuilders have to get it from somewhere. Rude attacks, but Hawk runs him into the turnbuckles and slams him. Hawk in a singles match without Flair is just asking for trouble. Suplex gets two. Hawk slowly throws Rude around, but gets caught with a backbreaker. Rude goes up and gets nothing, and they fight to the floor for a double countout at 5:38. Barely even a match. DUD

The Equalizer v. The Shockmaster

Yes, this is a thing that happened. Equalizer chokes him out to start, and chokes some more, and some more. Suplex gets two. Shockmaster no-sells and then finishes with a bearhug slam at 2:28. I have shit out more appealing matches while suffering from stomach flu. -***

World TV title: Lord Steven Regal v. Johnny B. Badd

Badd gets some quick pinfall attempts and controls with a headscissors on the mat before evading Regal’s matwork and getting a headlock. Badd gets cocky and clotheslines himself on the top rope while trying a dive, however, allowing Regal to take over on the mat. He pounds Badd with forearms, but Badd puts him down with the KO punch. That gets two, as Sir William puts the foot on the ropes, and Regal rolls him up with the tights to retain at 6:25. Short but fine. **

Steve Austin v. Brian Pillman

Breaks my heart every time. Jesse’s too. Pillman attacks and they brawl outside, where Austin catches him with a clothesline, but Pillman wallops him in the ring and throws chops in the corner. Austin wants a truce and Pillman chases him to the ramp for more brawling. Pillman comes off the top and lands on Austin’s foot, setting up his trademark bump on the railing. Back in, Pillman catches him with a crossbody for two, but Austin drops him on the top rope for two. Pillman keeps fighting with chops, but Austin takes him down and holds a half-crab. Funny bit as Austin cheats while getting nagged by the referee. Pillman fights back again with a back elbow out of the corner and blocks the stungun for two. Austin tries a piledriver, which Pillman turns into a rana for two. Pillman slingshots in but gets caught in a powerslam for two. Austin misses a charge and Pillman gets a DDT for two. Crucifix attempt is blocked with a samoan drop and Austin goes up and misses a splash. Pillman rolls him up for two off that. Stungun misses again and Air Pillman looks to finish, but Col. Parker trips him up and Austin gets the pin at 9:11. Mad energy in this one, but who really wanted to see it? ***1/2

US title: Dustin Rhodes v. Paul Orndorff

Dustin gets a series of slams on Orndorff, but Paul takes over with a lengthy armbar. Like, minutes long. Then Dustin gets his own. And then he goes to the chinlock. Orndorff takes over with a backdrop suplex and then goes to his own chinlock. Weird that Dustin would be having such a boring match because he was on a really good roll for most of 93/94. Dustin with a backslide for two, but Orndorff sends him into the corner and goes back to the chinlock. Dustin comes back and tries the bulldog, but Orndorff blocks it, so Dustin gets a sunset flip for two. Orndorff clotheslines him, but Dustin escapes the piledriver. Paul to the top and he misses that, and Dustin finishes with a small package at 12:08. Dusty and the Assassin brawl afterwards and that has better energy and heat than anything in the match! *1/2

WCW World tag title: The Nasty Boys v. Sting & The British Bulldog

Since our last Clash, the Nasties won the tag titles from the Horsemen and then lost and regained them around Halloween Havoc via Marcus Bagwell & 2 Cold Scorpio. Missy is just spilling out all over the place. The teams brawl on the ramp right away, and Rick Rude sneaks out and puts Bulldog down with a Rude Awakening, leaving Sting to fight alone. So the match just kind of stops as Sting tends to Bulldog. Back to the ring as the match starts for real and Sting fights off the Nasties and tosses Sags. He’s still tending to Bulldog, who is selling a damn neckbreaker like he was shot in the gut and is bleeding out. This allows the Nasties to take over and double-team him. Knobbs with a suplex for two and he goes to the bearhug and that goes on forever before Sting fights out and makes the hot tag to Bulldog. Double clothesline and double DDT for the Nasties and it’s BONZO GONZO. Powerslam for Knobbs, no ref, and Sags drops the Shitty Elbow on him for the pin at 8:23. Sting was fighting an uphill battle with this one. *1/2

WCW World title: Vader v. Ric Flair

We take a break after the introductions and return with Flair beating on poor old Harley Race, but that allows Vader the chance to splash him. Vader beats on him in the corner and adds a press slam, and the Vaderbomb in the corner. Flair fires back with chops in the corner, but runs into Vader’s forearms. Vader continues boxing him and tosses him, but he misses a dive and lands on the railing. LUCHA VADER! Flair hits own dive and now he’s ready for FISTICUFFS. Back in, he throws chops on Vader, but runs into a boot. Flair goes after the knee and gets the figure-four, but Race breaks it up and Vader gets a suplex and big splash for two. Vader goes up, but Flair manages to powerslam him for two. Flair goes up with a flying axehandle , does a Flair Flip, and then hits a second one. Ref is bumped in DRAMATIC fashion and they fight to the top, where Vader gets a superplex, but he blows the Vadersault, and Flair GETS THE PIN at 9:00? No, in fact Vader was DQ’d for bumping the ref and Randy Anderson was merely crawling over and hitting the mat as he went. Oh, Dusty Rhodes. This was supposed to be Flair’s last hurrah before Sid took over as the big main event star, but we all know how that worked out. ***1/4

The Pulse

Austin-Pillman is well worth seeking out, but Flair-Vader was totally eclipsed by their Starrcade match and this one is a pale version of it. The rest is total garbage on a stick. Recommendation to avoid.

Comments

  1. Was Sid still in the company? I know the stabbing happened in late October

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  2. Shitty breakup and a shitty blow off match. Thanks WCW. And it would have made way more sense for Vader to destroy Flair instead of the Dusty finish.

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  3. As a kid, well middle schooler I guess, I loved this show. But now, ugh. Flair vs Vader is good as is the Hollywood Blondes Explode! But the rest, not so much. And yes, WCW should've kept the blondes together longer. Maybe until mid-late 1994. Blondes vs Hogan/Sting would've been good, ditto with them vs The Mega Powers or have them team up against Hogan/Flair on one of Hogan's first shows and have Flair turn on Hogan.

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  4. Didn't they wait a little bit before firing him?

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  5. Stabbing incident took place in late October but Sid didn't leave till several wrestlers threatened to walk out if he wasn't fired. Don't know the time frame for the firing though but was the main here set up before the incident?

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  6. Sid was suspended at this point, and WCW actually had the chutzpah to hype that he may show up at the Clash (CALL THE HOTLINE FOR MORE INFO). This seems like Starrcade was already set up as Flair vs. Vader.
    He did have a few TV appearances in the can that made air. He and Flair were supposed to wrestle against Vader and Austin on WCWSN, but he was attacked before the match by the Colossal Kongs and splashed on the floor, forcing Arn Anderson to sub for him (IRONY!). That ended up being how he was written out--they simply went with the old Crockett "We're outta time!" ending and took the show off the air before the finish, which involved Sid running in.

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  7. They protected Flair? But I thought they buried and humiliated him every chance they got?

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  8. I imagine an entire wing of Hell is dedicated to showing Shockmaster vs. Equalizer on an endless loop.

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  9. Just for fun, the ad for the original main event at Starrcade (these went out in Late November 93, not sure why WCW hadn't changed it yet):

    http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p32/RobRob1_2006/Starrcade1993OriginalAdTVHostScan.jpg

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  10. Oh for the love of... the 10th anniversary was LAST YEAR you morons.

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  11. Call me crazy but I bet Sid works out well for them. Sid as a bad ass anti-hero version of Hogan could have been awesome.

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  12. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 3:00 PM

    True. That is a hard thing to pull off. Even nWo Sting had promise but fell flat at the end.

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  13. Thanks my dear.

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  14. For as big as he was in WWE, if somehow finds a way to that character in WCW, he gets just as huge. The crowds would have ate that shit up.

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  15. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 3:02 PM

    Other than when he tried to stab 'taker.

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  16. You mean that main event feud with Savage? Man, Flair really had it tough.

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  17. Imagine Hogan versus a Horseman of Flair, Austin, Pullman, and Anderson? It even would have made sense because Arm had been in the Dangerous Alliance with Austin and there is your natural bridge. The old bulls are impressed with them after the Clash match and there it is. But I guess Beefcake and Tents had to eat, too.

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  18. Then Austin and Pillman turn on them because they feel they are holding them back.

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  19. Big Stevie is in line for a push

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  20. I think it's fair to say Flair almost always looked inferior when facing Hogan but with Savage it was more even.

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  21. I am still in disbelief that Brutus Beefcake headlined a Starrcade

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  22. Probably because they were more interested in doing Hogan vs Doom instead of Hogan vs Flair with a strong Horsemen behind him.

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  23. And it wouldn't surprise me if Flair wanted Hogan to no sell him since Ric is part of the old school of always making your opponents look good.

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  24. By Vince McMahon WWE logic (The 25th Anniversary of WrestleMania, not WrestleMania 25), then you are correct. By actual logic and math, that's not right.

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  25. Stranger in the AlpsMay 26, 2014 at 3:19 PM

    How did Shockmaster vs. Equalizer not end up on the When Worlds Collide PPV? Not for anything resembling lucha style, but for the sheer fact that two globs of shit coming together in one ring would have caused a black fucking hole that would have swallowed us all.

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  26. Stranger in the AlpsMay 26, 2014 at 3:22 PM

    A man getting his wife a 25th anniversary present a year early gets him in the dog house. Mainly because he doesn't know how long they've been married.

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  27. Ric has always said he never had any problems with Hogan or jobbing to him. Even said he was willing to job for him on a potential 8 match.

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  28. Vince McMahon probably got himself into the doghouse with Linda a lot more than just forgetting their anniversary...

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  29. The most sophisticated bot on the planet

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  30. Netflix has gotten fucking terrible about some of its content, as I have no idea when most stuff gets added. I've used this example before, but they didn't add the seventh season of Psych until after the eighth (and final) season ended. And I waited forever until the sixth season of Mad Men.


    Hulu has a discernible schedule of when content goes up. Netflix does not.

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  31. About to try my hand at making a meatloaf for the first time. Everyone says it's easy and impossible to fuck up. We'll see about that, won't we?


    Yes, I saw Tony Atlas make a meatloaf on Legends House and decided I wanted one. Who wants to make something of it?

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  32. Bigger question is do you have a chance to get into the Top 5 tonight!

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  33. I'll say yes to both questions!

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  34. Ric lost their retirement match at Halloween Havoc, did he even show up between then and Superbrawl V? Losing matches for Vader while he was retired was pretty goofy but they had to have a reason for Hulk Hogan to "allow" Flair's return to the ring if i remember it right.


    Plus he main evented that huge North Korea show with Inoki in that time frame too.

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  35. I almost never see BoD Raw until the next morning. I don't see Andy's review until Tuesday morning either. I go to bed WAY too early.

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  36. Local color for Steve: his dump of a hometown is known for a water tower shaped like a Brooks catsup bottle, so if there's a need for an international object...

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  37. Best. Avatar. EVER!

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  38. He admitted to cheating on her in past interviews.

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  39. Yes, that's what I was alluding to.

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  40. Hey, lets give away our Starrcade main event on free tv a month before the big show! What a brilliant idea! Yes, yes i know it was supposed to be Sid but was Big Dust truly serious about keeping Sid and rewarding him with the world title no less?


    Either way WCW was heading into '94 with some interesting stories, can Ric Flair keep the World title in a rematch against the mighty Vader? If so is a reunification match between him and Ravishing Rick Rude on it's way? Stunning Steve Austin as the new US Champion and rising fast as were the Nasty Boys who were getting a strong push as the tag-champs. Lord Steven Regal as TV champ was the worlds most boring wrestler to me back in the day with his endless tv lime limit draws.


    Oh and BOD question - Do you consider WCW's 2nd World Title whether it was the NWA Heavyweight strap or the International Heavyweight Title in 92-94 as a true "World Championship"

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  41. I barely consider the International World Heavyweight belt a championship, let alone a "World" level title. They kept the belts separated WAY too long before giving up and unifying them.

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  42. I saw it as above the US title, but a notch below the world title.

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  43. Pretty sure they didn't know Flair vs Vader was going to be the main event at this point.

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  44. To be fair, the life of a wrestler seems pretty exhausting work that I'm shocked that more road accidents haven't happened.

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  45. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMay 26, 2014 at 3:47 PM

    No, same thing for the World Heavyweight Championship. Same actual belt too, mostly.

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  46. So is Ravishing Rick Rude a former World Champion in your books? Should Ric Flair & Sting's wins count as world title reigns in their resumes?

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  47. Did Flair hold the big gold belt outside of the unification match? I say no to both questions.

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  48. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMay 26, 2014 at 3:54 PM

    At least he remembered at all.

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  49. In WCW during those 2 years of dual World Champions, the WCW World Title was always presented as the Top title (Despite the Big Gold Belt being so much more aesthetically pleasing)


    But in WWE the top title changed numerous times. When HHH was crowned World Heavyweight Champion in 02 on Raw that title was the big deal despite the WWE Title having the actual 40 year history etc.

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  50. Yes, Ric won the NWA World Heavyweight Title from Barry Windham in '93 before dropping it to Rick Rude in the fall. During his reign WCW again left the NWA so that's where the name change for the title came into play.

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  51. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMay 26, 2014 at 3:58 PM

    To be honest as long as WWE had 2 belts I couldn't count either as a true world title, they canceled each other out, I guess. Though the Big Not-Gold-Anymore (looks like gold spray paint) Belt was clearly the #2 title from 2009 or so on.

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  52. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 3:58 PM

    See? Now I want a meatloaf sandwich.

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  53. The whole situation was too stupid to try and commit to memory. I still say no.

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  54. Exactly. The Stone Cold character can be attributed to both Austin's displeasure with business, and thedesire of fans to see something fresh.

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  55. If you go by Wrestlemania match placement


    World Heavyweight Title - 20,21,24
    WWE Title - 19,22,23,25,26,27,28,29

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  56. Or did Ric Flair's official reinstatement come about when he attacked the Macho Man's dad?


    Or was that just the starting block to re-ignite their old feud?

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  57. Depends on whether you consider the NWA title a "world" title fate the early 91 Flair/Fujinami debacle.

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  58. Robert Bradley CurranMay 26, 2014 at 4:13 PM

    I imagine that may be something Dolph Ziggler and the Miz have to say to themselves every day. In an "at least I'm not that guy" way.

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  59. I wonder what Dusty was planning then? Really go through with Sid as Champ? Say fuck it, have Vader beat him at Starrcade and never air those Florida tapings with Sid as champ?


    Or have Vader defend against someone else entirely?

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  60. Again it all depends on whether you think the NWA title lost all credibility after the early 91 Japan thing or when Shane Douglas tossed it on the ground over 3 years later.

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  61. Oh yeah, SCSA is definitely a WCW character. It's amazing that WWF even got it. To this day Vince still doesn't get it.

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  62. Sure, why not. Ric wins the title back from Sting in january, loses it to Tatsumi in Japan then regains it at Superbrawl I just as what actually happened.


    Ric's then stripped of world champion status by both WCW and the NWA when he signs with the WWF. Lex Luger is crowned new WCW champ and Masahiro Chono the new NWA champ in the fall.

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  63. I think Vince definitely got it.

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  64. I consider the NWA title dead after the ECW thing.

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  65. The NWA title ceased being a world title when WCW left the NWA for good in Sept. '93. It regained it's status again in TNA in 2002-2007.


    Now it's just a indy geek title.

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  66. Back in the 90s he said on many occasions that he didn't understand it. He could have gotten it by now but I doubt it.

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  67. Stranger in the AlpsMay 26, 2014 at 4:22 PM

    Not yet.

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  68. Well, New Japan still seems to care about it for whatever reason.

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  69. After WCW split from the NWA there was no reason to care about the NWA

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  70. That's what they all say

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  71. That belt looks like shit. For as much as they put into tv production, I'm surprised they send people out with that thing.

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  72. Are you talking about stuff Vince said in character?

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  73. No. He did plenty of interviews during the boom period saying that he didn't get Austin's popularity but he was rolling with it anyway.

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  74. Either way, that spot will be mine tonight or tommorrow.

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  75. Again, sounds 100% in character.

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  76. Like the NWA itself it still has name value due to it's long history and lineage. I'm surprised Vince hasn't bought the name just to end it entirely by now.


    After WCW left for good in 1993. Who really promoted under the NWA banner? ECW for a year? At least until TNA came on the scene almost 10 years later.


    Vince could have probably bought the trademark for a jar of mustard and some old Psycho magazines.

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  77. i can't recall one non kayfab interview Vince ever did back then. So unless you source it, I'm calling bullshit.

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  78. Get me some meatloaf with mash potatoes and gravy.

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  79. It blows my mind to think he's been around that long.

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  80. Sid was fresh off of main eventing a Wrestlemania less than 2 years prior, and he was definitely Vader's equal when it came to being a name. He was definitely capable of being the man in that scenario.

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  81. Yes, at least she has the decency to respond back.

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  82. Mitch, The GodfatherMay 26, 2014 at 4:31 PM

    Speaking of which, I never got the hate for Jack Swagger's title reign. He had decent promos and matches with guys like Orton and Big Show. I believe not doing anything with him after losing the belt is the main reason why his reign is looked down upon.

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  83. Even if Vince wanted the trademark I highly doubt the owners would sell if only out of general principle.

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  84. And Caliber, don't forget Caliber.

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  85. I want to say he was on Landsberg and maybe Fox News. It's not worth trying to dig up, but I'll link it if I ever come across it.

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  86. Man.....just imagine had Sid did what he did and won the belt at Starrcade. Hogan, Savage and later Hall and Nash probably never come in and the Monday Night Wars never happen.

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  87. Yeah. Like Kane he's probably just sticking around now for the money and to have fun.

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  88. Sure, in a perfect non-stabby world i'd agree.

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  89. What makes you think Flair would have left?

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  90. I have it on the Raw 15 Anniversary DVD, very good.

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  91. These guys aren't exactly Jim Crockett & Fritz Vin Erich keeping the tradition alive.


    In fact who does own the copyrights? Like i said who has operated under the NWA over the last 2 decades?

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  92. You're not that far from me, Jef. Come on over.

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  93. Patrick BrandmeyerMay 26, 2014 at 4:37 PM

    Jesse's justification of Rude's attack was classic: "He mighta called Rude a name!"

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  94. They got sold in 2012 to someone who pretty much priced out most of the territories. Now I think there are about, a dozen?, official feds.

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  95. Your nephew did that? Give him an award, it's a brilliant belt.

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  96. Don't feel like making the mashed potatoes, so it's meatloaf, french fries and broccoli tonight. Deal with it.

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  97. How do you figure that?

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  98. First time I saw the Hey Bret segment was in Wrestling with Shadows.

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  99. Fine then.
    :goes out to buy microwave mash potatoes.

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  100. He had just come back from the WWF at the beginning of the year. And I think regardless of who had the belt at Starrcade, Hogan coming in around June was fait accompli at that point.


    Once they finalize the deal with Hogan, Flair beats Sid for the title, unifies the straps with Sting and everything goes as it happened from there.

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  101. Exactly, maybe Sid sticks around so he can challenge Hulk Hogan but either way Ric Flair gets the book in early '94 and you know he's booking the title back around his waist.

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  102. More likely scenario is a Sid vs Hogan.

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  103. I don't have a microwave.

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  104. I disagree. The money match - which WCW knew - was Flair vs. Hogan. One way or another, Hogan's first match is against Flair.

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  105. Owen vs. Bulldog in the Euro Title Finals is as close to a 5-star TV match as you will find.

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  106. I still see the Nature Boy doing the J-O-B to Hogan in the summer no matter what happens, but if Sid can resist playing softball for once he would have made for a hell of a Starrcade'94 opponent for the Hulkster.

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  107. A much better Starrcade opponent than Brother Bruti the Zodiac Man With No Face.

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  108. I guess you started watching later, because they showed it constantly.

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  109. Stranger in the AlpsMay 26, 2014 at 4:48 PM

    Catsup. Ketchup. Catsup. Ketchup.

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  110. I don't get this reasoning at all. Why would Sid being crowned champion at Starrcade '93 effect Hulk Hogan's signing? Let alone Macho's or The Outsiders 2 and a half years later!

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  111. I'm so confused.

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  112. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMay 26, 2014 at 4:51 PM

    All their belts look like shit.

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  113. Probably but I'm trying to say that Flair would have just been a stepping stone for Hogan to lead to Sid. Sid was going to be THE guy in WCW if not for the stabbing incident, so it makes sense that they would have thought Sid/Hogan a much bigger match.

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  114. I think he's referring to this supposedly being Flair's last hurrah before Sid became the star. Flair's last run taking place in '93 is hilarious, of course.

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  115. If Sid caught fire, I could see them thinking they didn't need him.

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  116. It should have been. He had what, under 10 good/great matches from 94-until he retired?

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  117. Meltzer had a story on it that Undertaker and another wrestler were going to travel with them, but whatever reasons, chose other means of transportation.

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  118. Are you even American?

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  119. WCW was also known for changing its mind at the drop of a hat. Most likely, if Sid wins the title, beats Vader in a rematch at Super Brawl, loses to Flair at Spring Stampede, Flair defends against Windham at Slamboree (Jesus, WCW had a lot of PPVs already in 1994), unifies the titles at the June Clash and then loses to Hogan in July.


    You start to build Sid back up over the summer to be Hogan's Starrcade opponent, allowing for the defeat of Flair at Halloween Havoc.

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  120. It's a small kitchen! There's no room!

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  121. The only way they have Sid drop the title to Flair is if Sid is a bust as champ.


    Flair wins the INT title, drops to Hogan, and then Hogan vs Sid to unify.

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  122. Define good/great. I understand Flair has deserved plenty of the criticism being thrown his way in recent years, but if good/great means, say, *** or better, then that number is ridiculously low.

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  123. No way Hogan is content with the fake world title. You're not taking in to account Hogan's ego and WCW's willingness to stroke it.

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  124. Remember Ric Flair does get the book back in early '94. Hence why he goes back to facing Ricky Steamboat & Barry Windham on PPV.


    He knows he has to lose to Hulk Hogan either way so i can't see Slick Ric not booking himself to be the guy who takes down Sid Vicious for the strap.


    Either way i agree Hogan Vs Sid would have headlined Starrcade before Hulk moved onto say Vader. I like to think Sid just leaves and joins the WWF in early 95 just like he did originally.

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  125. MAKE SOME ROOM, IT'S YOUR AMERICAN RIGHT OR SOME PATROTIC SHIT

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  126. Obviously he is getting the real title from Sid so it is a non issue.

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  127. No chance. Eric Bischoff always had a hard-on for the Hulkster and even a non stabby Sid would have gotten bored and walked out/got injured/etc by the end of 1994 tops.

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  128. I highly doubt Eric lets Ric take the title off Sid.

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  129. For some reason, no one wants to say it, but Flair was awful after like '97. I know, he still had some good matches, and he was obviously fine on promos, but I found him boring as crap. I know I'm probably getting flamed for this, but it is what it is.

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  130. **** or better.

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  131. Hogan was hardly a slam dunk in 1994.

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  132. 4 Snowflakes is a Great match under any definition. If Slick Ric's still pumping out 3 star matches then he's more than pulling his weight.

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  133. Too poor to buy the requisite shelving unit to fit a microwave?

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  134. In WCW i'd agree save for his hot return in the fall of '98 which fizzled out in a hurry after Eric Bischoff booked his big win at Starrcade.


    But when Ric went back to the WWF in 01 he regained a lot of his old mojo even though he was physically falling apart and obviously showing his age.

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  135. He still had more name recognition than EVERYONE in WCW combined.

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  136. True, but not in Eric Bischoff's eyes. Signing Hulk was the first volley in his i'm a better promoter than Vince McMahon war.

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  137. No doubt, but that is why I said "If Sid caught fire..."

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  138. Sid doesn't keep the title that long. Flair would book himself back to being champ well before Hogan signs.

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  139. Like I said above, no way Eric lets him unless he is a bust.

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  140. Even if they knew that Vader/Flair was going to headline Starcade, I thought this actually did a decent job at building the match up. I remember watching this as a kid when it first aired and I was convinced that Flair could win a rematch and that he could totally beat Vader.

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  141. Atlanta would have to burn again for Sid to catch enough fire for them to keep the world title on him with Hogan on the horizon.

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  142. Everything was a "bust" in 92-93 WCW. Even when it was awesome and had the fans going nuts.


    I don't see Sid moving the needle all that much on his own.

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  143. 4-5 has always been good to very good to me. 5 is great. 3-4 is average to good.

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  144. Sid got over everywhere he went, it isn't out of the realm of possibility that he does really well when a promotion gets fully behind him.

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  145. It's not about if Sid is the man or a bust, it was about beating Vince McMahon. The one thing VKM didn't do was put Hogan-Flair on PPV for the World Title. Bischoff could do it. Hogan wanted to be the man in WCW.


    One way or another, Hogan was facing Flair for the WCW Title at his debut PPV.

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  146. I agree, but now i forgot what we were arguing about in the first place!


    Was it just over whether Sid or Ric would be the one to hand the title over to Hulk Hogan right out of the gate?

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  147. Yup, pretty much. And the reasons why.

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  148. All wrestling titles are fake titles.

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  149. Sigh.


    Really, Vince? I thought we were on the same side!

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  150. I think we can all agree Hulk Vs Flair and Hulk Vs Sid are 2 big PPV matches that WCW would have run in 1994 and that Hogan would have won them both. That's set in stone!

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  151. You may have thought that, but couldn't you hear Heenan in the background? 'WHOSE SIDE IS HE OONNN???"

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  152. WWF had no idea how to use him. WCW had the right idea by having him be pretty unbeatable for a while and when he'd wrestle on Nitro, he'd usually squash a couple of jobbers. It looked awesome.


    Having Show look vulnerable so early took away the allure.


    I'd like to point out that I miss stuff like WCW having Luger go out on Nitro and squash some guy in like 2 minutes. The crowd was always hot for it and it kept Luger (or whomever) strong.

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  153. You know what? You don't get any damned meatloaf!

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  154. I get all that and agree with you. I just don't think Eric is that desperate about it with Hogan/Sid waiting in the wings.

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  155. How much of that has to do with the Network that the show originally aired having control over that? Same thing happened with the final episodes with Breaking Bad and that's been over for nearly 6 months.

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  156. I was actually at the Bret/Kid match. It was in the Poconos at the Fernwood Resort. Here's the four phases of it from a 10-year-old Bret Hart mark's perspective:



    Phase 1: Whoa! A televised title defense! I can't believe I'm here! And the Kid's a pushover so it'll be an easy win for Bret.


    Phase 2: Wow, the Kid's not making it easy for him.


    Phase 3: Oh my god he's going to lose the title to the 1-2-3 Kid!


    Phase 4: Whew....that was close.

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  157. Flair turns heel on Sid, Sid brings Hogan in as backup, Flair beats Sid for the title, Hogan beats Flair, Sid is pissed, Sid Power Bombs Hogan into oblivion.

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  158. If Sid gets the belt, WCW goes out of business in the end of 94.

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  159. Flair helped bring all those guys in. If doubt he'd be that helpful if he wasn't on the top of the card.

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  160. Flair had zero to do with Hall and Nash. Savage comes in regardless just so he could wrestle again. Hogan still probably comes in without talking to Flair.

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  161. True dat. That gold fucking sucks. Give me the white gold (or diamond, whatever Flair's belt was) any day.

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  162. Hulk Hogan approves of those wins but would never agree to be brought in as another guys "backup"

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  163. Agreed. Ric may have played a part in talking to Hulk & Randy but he wasn't cutting the cheques or giving them sweetheart deals in terms of dates,creative control or other Turner goodies.

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  164. Take title off him, I bet...just because they are WWE. Plus, it will make him a huge sympathy figure when he comes back chasing the strap. I wish Triple H would win it or just strip Bryan then put the belt on himself.

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  165. Plus i say Ric Flair IS on the top of the card in '94 after he books himself to beat Sid for the strap.

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  166. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 5:32 PM

    HHH is busy working with the Shield.


    I'm waiting for the inevitable B-Cup Bella/Stephanie match.

    ReplyDelete
  167. Step 1: Create meatloaf with meat, onions, some ketchup.
    Step 2: Make in shape of rectangle/square pan.
    Step 4: Bake said meatloaf for about an hour to hour and half at 350 degrees.
    Step 5: Cut meatloaf.
    Step 6: Put piece of meatloaf on bread.
    Step 7: Enjoy.
    Step 8: Rip your eyes out watching RAW.
    Step 9: Take leftover meatloaf and use it as a door stopper.

    ReplyDelete
  168. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 5:34 PM

    The Andre route would have been best. Loan him out to New Japan a Mexican organization for a few weeks here and there so he didn't get stale.

    ReplyDelete
  169. Rollins vs. Ambrose vs. Reigns vs. Triple H vs. Batista vs. Orton in a Ladder match for the vacant strap at Money in the Bank


    Have a 2nd Ladder match for the briefcase.

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  170. Had Flair not brought Hogan and Savage in then Nitro would have never happened. Had Nitro not happened, no way in God's green earth Hall and Nash jump ship. It's all intertwined.

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  171. It takes more than a squeegee to keep Sid down for long.

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  172. As joeduest stated, Flair was the main reason Hogan/Savage signed. His convincing (aiding Bischoff ironically) was what made it happen. Without those guys and Nitro, Hall and Nash stay put.

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  173. Nitro happened on a whim from Eric. Hall and Nash would have still gotten big deals without Nitro. Savage had nothing to do with Flair or Hogan. And even without Flair, Hogan still probably signs.

    ReplyDelete
  174. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 5:48 PM

    Not bad. Would this fuel dissention between members of the Shield?

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  175. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 5:50 PM

    You could at LEAST tell him details, like to CUT the onion before putting it in the meat.


    Also some breadcrumbs in it would be nice.

    ReplyDelete
  176. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 26, 2014 at 5:51 PM

    Put the microwave meatloaf in a saucepan and heat it on the stove.

    ReplyDelete
  177. Uh nah. The main reason Hogan/Savage signed was $$$ paired with less dates. Nitro debuts as is as does the free agent signings of the Outsiders.


    I like Ric Flair but lets not go nuts.

    ReplyDelete
  178. Brutus Beefcake main eventing a ppv: It's good to be friends with the Hulkster.

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  179. I kinda wish they'd take that approach with all the guys.

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  180. Which Hogan immediately no sells.

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  181. YankeesHoganTripleHFanMay 26, 2014 at 6:34 PM

    "Breaks my heart every time" Fuck you Scott. Flyen Brian"s heart actually broke.

    ReplyDelete
  182. I think a change of scenery was definitely good for him, which makes it all the more perplexing he didn't jump earlier. Didn't he have the chance to while WCW was still in business?

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  183. Yeah, I was thinking of that, too. Just an amazing match.

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  184. If it's not Flair, Bishoff gets someone else that knows Hogan to put out the feelers about him joining WCW.

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  185. Definitely. I mean, more power to the both of them for staying around so long, but it's just so weird to me think it's been that long since Big Show debuted in WCW.

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  186. The first time is one thing. But the announcers were forced to "buy" it every single time, even when it was painfully obvious the impostor was not real.

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  187. Yes, because while he loved to complain about WCW, he didn't complain about WCW's money.

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  188. That sounds familiar, it was Fox News or some other news station doing a piece of WWF's popularity.

    ReplyDelete
  189. Yeah, he was very much a hypocrite in that regard.

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  190. I am not satisfied with this because http://bit.ly/1jT1GGy

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  191. It's been over 15 years ago so God only knows where I heard it, but Vince was completely dumbfounded that Stone Cold was so over.

    ReplyDelete
  192. If Bischoff was willing to offer the money, Hogan and Savage are coming in. Sid or not

    ReplyDelete

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