The SmarK Rant for Monday Night RAW – 02.06.95
Hey, so as promised, Scott’s Blog of Doom Presents: Monday Night RAW Season Two, available NOW on the Kindle store for $2.99! I work fast. Sometimes.
Taped from Palmetto, FL, aka THE TAPING THAT NEVER ENDS.
Your hosts are Vince McMahon & Shawn Michaels for the last time.
Lex Luger & Men on a Mission v. Tatanka, IRS & King Kong Bundy
This is following from the Bundy v. Mabel “match” last week, so at least there’s some semblance of a storyline here. Mabel and Bundy have their showdown of suck to start and Mabel knocks him down for two, but Mo comes in and gets beat up by the heels. Because he’s just the worst. Shifting him to a managerial role was really the best decision for everyone. We take a break and return with Mabel getting a tag and taking over on Tatanka and even the heat machine can’t cover up the boredom of the crowd. Luger gets a backslide on IRS for two and the faces work him over, but then Mo tags in and AGAIN is a crushing disappointment to his team. Remember when you’d get squashes on Superstars where you’d have one semi-star like Brady Boone and then a total nobody pasty white nothing as a partner? And Boone would do pretty good and then tag in the loser, who would completely tank the match and do the job? Yeah, that’s Mo. So that “heat” segment drags on for an inexplicably ridiculous length of time, and Vince is like “I’m not impressed with either threesome tonight, to be honest.” Oh, TAG. Finally, 14:00 in (FOURTEEN MINUTES!) it’s hot tag Luger and one or two kids can actually be seen running back to their seats from the shitter in excitement. I bet one of them left mid-shit with the toilet paper hanging off his shoe and everything. Sadly, their dreams are crushed when Tatanka sneaks in with a DDT behind the ref’s back and Bundy gets the pin at 15:37. OK, why the fuck was Lex Luger doing the clean job with Jobbers On A Mission as partners? So weird. *
Man Mountain Rock does some word association to establish himself as a babyface.
We really ramp up the thrill ride with a prepared statement from LT’s lawyer, who accepts the WWF’s apology but stresses that Taylor doesn’t want to be a wrestler.
Man Mountain Rock v. Charlie Hunter
Poor Daryl has ugly tie-dye pajamas as gear and dreads, making him look like an escaped mental patient who got caught in a paint shaker explosion. Not a good look. The announcers stress the amateur credentials of Rock, because you-know-who is booking now. As a hint, it rhymes with “Hoss”. Rock with a slam and elbowdrop, and he finishes with a front suplex at 3:00. Another debut, another gimmick dead in the water. My thinking was that someone should have ripped off The Big Lebowski for him, but that movie didn’t come along until three years later. But I think a laid-back stoner who constantly falls into bad situations might have been a better fit for him.
Meanwhile, Vince has a sitdown interview with Diesel, who has completely dropped the tough guy New York accent and now just talks with a normal voice and smiles a lot. The talk about exciting stuff like being a role model and the demands of the championship. Meanwhile, another 2 or 3 shows get cancelled for low advances.
Mantaur v. Leroy Howard
While I’m thinking about it, why did they bother changing “The Minotaur” to “Mantaur”? Did someone actually feel that particular change would make a difference to his career or make people care more? I feel like I should know Leroy from somewhere but he’s probably just a generic black guy jobber. Leroy actually drops an elbow and goes up with a bodypress, but Mantaur catches him and stomps him down while Shawn questions which half of Mantaur is the bull part. Vince moves on quickly past that one. Mantaur cuts off the jobber again and pounds him down, then finishes with a pair of Avalanches and a belly to belly at 3:45. He’s half man, half bear, half pig!
Razor Ramon v. Frankie Lancaster
Hey, old school jobber time with “The Thumper”. He was actually part of a decent Rock N Roll ripoff team called the Heartbreakers with Wendell Cooley in the dying days of the various Crockett territories, and worked a lot in World Class as well. Ramon works the arm and slugs him down after a brief flurry of offense, then finishes with the Razor’s Edge at 3:45.
Henry Godwinn v. Bill Weaver
HOG with his usual kicking and punching on the jobber and he finishes with the Slop Drop at 2:20.
Next week: The dog show!
Two weeks hence: Diesel v. Jeff Jarrett, and Shawn Michaels introduces his new bodyguard! And that’s one payoff that actually pays off.
As for this week…if you can’t love a show with Man Mountain Rock, Mantaur AND Henry Godwinn, then clearly you’re not Jim Ross enough.
I only have $2.98
ReplyDeleteI just might pay money to see The Dude face Paul Heyman in a battle of wits.
ReplyDeleteHeyman: My client, Brooooccck Lesnar, will not only destroy you, he'll hunt down the ashes of Donnie and eat them for breakfast.
Dude: That's just, like, your opinion, man. Mind if I do a J?
Heyman: WTF???
Wasn't Bill Watts booking at this time?
ReplyDeleteI have $2.99, but I'm scared about the six-book commitment.
ReplyDeleteAll RVD needs to do is grow a beard.
ReplyDelete"Finally, 14:00 in (FOURTEEN MINUTES!) it’s hot tag Luger and one or two kids can actually be seen running back to their seats from the shitter in excitement."
ReplyDeleteOne thing I'll always respect about the old World Wrestling Federation was that they actually had the balls (or cluelessness, whichever) to let a shitty match run long.
It wasn't all that rare to get a house show or Primetime Wrestling match where Dino Bravo and Ron Garvin just shat the bed for 20 minutes until the timekeeper threw it out. Made you really appreciate the Bret Harts and Tito Santanas of the world.
It's starting to become clearer why Luger wound up bailing to WCW.
ReplyDelete"Mantaur cuts off the jobber again and pounds him down, then finishes with a pair of Avalanches and a belly to belly at 3:45. He’s half man, half bear, half pig!"
ReplyDeleteThis gimmick was super serial!
No, Watts wasn't until the Mabel heel turn and Dean Douglas era.
ReplyDeleteWendell Cooley.. a aname I haven't heard in years...
ReplyDeleteBring on the JCP/WCW shows, WWE Network!!!
Ah, OK.
ReplyDeleteSince SummerSlam I've been perfectly fine with the idea of seeing Lesnar vs. Cena III--even with the prospect of Cena winning. At WrestleMania 31. At Night of Champions? Not so much. This is a bad, bad idea. If Cena beats Lesnar so soon then what value is there in Lesnar afterwards? It completely validates the narrative of Lesnar being dominant only if he wrestles every so often. WWE has their pick of several potentially huge matches at WrestleMania: Lesnar vs. Cena, Reigns, or Bryan. Perhaps even the Rock, Batista or Undertaker. Hang a loss on Lesnar-- even through screwy means--and taking the title back off him before WrestleMania reduces the significance of most of those matches. They become just another match. And suppose Lesnar beats Cena again right away. What does that gain them? It's like climbing to the top of a mountain, crawling back down 10 feet, then returning to the top and bragging about climbing the mountain twice. Do they think they need to have Cena lose again, but in a more competitive match, to make an eventual rematch victory more believable? Can they really be thinking about Cena narrowly defeating Lesnar, only to have Seth Rollins cash in the Money in the Bank briefcase and stealing the title? Do they honestly think Rollins as a cowardly champion will be a bigger money draw than the seemingly unbeatable monster Lesnar? And what if... god... Cena wins and gets the title back. Period. Seriously?
ReplyDeleteI can't believe companies still use the ".99" deception rather than rounding up to whole sum.
ReplyDeleteThe Jesus vs Heyman.
ReplyDeleteWho could be Walter? Big Show? Actually, yes. Show ranting about watching his buddies die face down in the muck in Vietnam, and he doesn't wrestle on Shabbas would be glorious.
ReplyDeleteKofi Kingston will finally get a chance to bust out his acting chops.
ReplyDeletePaul Heyman wrote on a cocktail napkin and it was pretty good. Don't diss cocktail napkins.
ReplyDeleteIt would be worth it to see Zombie James Brown perform.
ReplyDeleteThere's a strict Zero Ghost Tolerance Policy in Pottery class!
ReplyDeleteIf CM Punk beating Brock could be believable I'm pretty sure Bryan could make it work.
ReplyDeleteworked for the five dollar footlong and dollar menu. People like their whole numbers and fast food I suppose.
ReplyDeleteRocky III: YOU CAN'T WIN!
ReplyDeleteCena LXVIII: YOU WILL WIN!
cereal*
ReplyDeleteHe's already won. If only he bolieves.
ReplyDeleteLawler should be The Jesus, so someone can reply with "8 year olds, Dude".
ReplyDeleteRocky III is a great storyline to go by, but not if you do the rematch a mere month after receiving the brutal beat down of a lifetime...and calling for the rematch two days after the fact!
ReplyDeleteIf they had Brock end the streak just to win the title from Cena and then lose it back the next month, what's the point? If they want to go all the way w/ Reigns, they need to have him and Lesnar destroy all competition until they meet at 'mania.
ReplyDeleteStyles make fights. Cena and Bryan are different wrestlers who employ different strategies. Even against huge people Cena is used to being able to use his power and his ability to comeback as a way to win his matches.
ReplyDeleteBryan is used to being small. He's used to be overpowered, he's used to being overmatched. He's not gonna try and match power with Brock and he certainly wont go straight at Brock like Cena tried to. Brock likes to use suplexes and Bryan knows the reversal to every suplex that's ever been invented. He's shown the ability to wear down a body part which is key in beating a big man while Cena hasn't shown that inclination. His strategy is come straight forward and trade big moves. Against Brock that's a death sentence. Bryan can stick and move, counter out of Brock's suplex attempts, and attack Brock's leg and get back to sticking and moving. A one-legged man in an ass kicking contest doesn't fare too well.
I just spent more time analyzing a fake fight that may or may not happen so I'll just say this: They can build anyone they want to be a believable fight for Brock because pro wrestling allows them to do so. They just have to build up the wrestler they intend on taking Brock down and build the match to make us believe.
Shit, i once sat through a 19 minute long match (!) between Jim Powers (!!) and Akeem (!!!) that probably only went that long to kill time. Longest match on the card. I was still firmly in my markdom, but even I knew there's no way it should've lasted that long.
ReplyDeleteIn case you're wondering, Akeem won by sitting on Powers during a sunset flip attempt. After almost 20 minutes, a guy who only weighed 235-240 at the time tried to do a sunset flip on a 400 pounder. So ridiculous, i remember it 25 years later.
Wrestling is SO cartoony (physics are causally ignored for things like irish whips) that I don't understand people having "believability issues"
ReplyDeletea grade ten science education makes 100% of wrestling unbelievable.
Bryan gets magic powers from people chanting yes.
Does Lesnar outsize Bryan any worse then Andre outsized Hogan (who had super strength)
it's more a comic book then a shoot fight for what I call "believable"
A-listers can fight on an even level. they utilize their strengths and weaknesses to make anything work
Let's not pretend that Bryan was ever going to be a long term champion. I love the guy, but face it he's not what Vince see's as championship material (big and juiced) and really only got there because the fear of a mania riot scared them. If Batista had gotten over Bryan wouldn't have been anywhere near the main event.
ReplyDeleteAnd yes Vince is an idiot for having his prejudices (smaller guys, southerners)
I thought the Jim Ross era was pretty good. Then again the only thing I remember from it was the main event scene where he had to build Diesel v Shawn as a viable main event for WM11 and he did a pretty good job with that by booking both guys strong and having them go over everyone in clean fashion. The opposite of 50/50 booking you see today. Unless JR booked KOTR that year, then yeah, there's no defending that.
ReplyDeleteThat's the one good thing about the Vince Russo era, he kept bad matches short. Of course he kept good matches short too, but you can't have everything.
ReplyDeleteThat's as silly as getting beat the crap out of by Brock for 20 minutes then cutting a smiling promo right after....
ReplyDeleteSurely Cena loses again right? Then what was the point of the Summerslam demolition?
ReplyDeleteHmm. "The Mabel Heel Turn and Dean Douglas Era". Doesn't sound like something you'd particularly want your name attached to.
ReplyDeleteI remember reading a WCW house show report where, due to cancellations,
ReplyDeletethey sent Renegade and Terry Taylor out there for twenty minutes. Taylor wasn’t
even an active wrestler. Might have been in one of the recent old Observers
they’ve put up.
Wrestlemania talk...SMOKESCREEN BABY
ReplyDeleteIf you think about it, the beat was not that bad. The story was Cena gets hit with an F5 in the first minute, but never recovers.
ReplyDeleteNOC will be an even match with Brock still winning.
Even WWE isn't dumb enough to give it right back to Cena. There are subscriptions to sell!
ReplyDeleteAnd would Jack Swagger play the role of Tommy Gunn?
ReplyDeleteTechnically if I eat the only apple, even if it's just one apple, I have eaten every apple.
ReplyDeleteSo, the size of his asshole is not necessarily larger than one square inch based on that comment alone.
Didn't Backlund reign for a decade?
ReplyDeleteBrock is singlehandedly responsible for keeping the tractor industry in business.
ReplyDeleteHe keeps on having to buy new ones because eating cars is just wasteful.
Okay, I'm seriously confused here.
ReplyDeleteJBL was an evil rich dude (stocks, specifically) who happened to be from Texas, he still repped the Lonestar but resided in the place he got rich.
How look did JR take over for Pat Patterson?
ReplyDeleteWhy is not surprising that you of all people immediately went to fast food.
ReplyDeleteAlso, it's weird how Raws started with their big match of the evening first sometimes.
ReplyDeleteTotally agree. I've been conditioned to expect the main event last.
ReplyDeleteMore like five, maybe six. Also I think with how different it is from then to now, it's fair to say Cena is pound-for-pound the bigger draw than Backlund, but to me the similarities are evident; they're both not quite accepted by all or a big enough portion of the fans, and their careers are (may be) book-ended by stars far greater than themselves.
ReplyDeleteCena hasn't hit the glass ceiling, he is the glass ceiling
ReplyDeleteWhite-bread babyfaces from New England that are physical freaks, if a bit on the shorter side. They that espouse family values and are above average if a bit underwhelming wrestlers that play better as heels than faces. Carried the company, even if they weren't what McMahon really wanted or traditionally worked with, but as they were the only guy there, they ended up becoming "the man".
ReplyDeleteHuh, not a terrible comparison.
Cena's the factory that makes the glass ceiling.
ReplyDeleteHe's the copyright on glass ceilings, the federal patent.
I hope Cena takes 16 more German Suplexes.
ReplyDeleteYou must love 50-50 booking based in this post
ReplyDeleteShawn claims he was in the room and it was 4 hours before WM
ReplyDeleteI guess when WWE uses toilet humor, McMahon is childish and pathetic, but when Scott Keith uses toilet humor, it's edgy and brilliant.
ReplyDeleteIt seems like the old SNME schedule. Is there a date when they changed the card? Or was it with nitro?
ReplyDeleteYep, SNME did it because they started very late, Raw did it because I guess, people had jobs the next morning. I totally get it.
ReplyDelete"Hey woman! Hey woman!"
ReplyDeleteActually the face side of the roster looks pretty thin, especially the main event. There is only Cena, Sheamus, Reigns, Big Show and Henry. Henry vs Lesnar? Could be interesting, but not a PPV ME. Lesnar Big Show? Revenge for the last match, could be interesting, but not again. Reigns vs Lesnar is too early. Sheamus vs Lesnar is good for a RAW.
ReplyDeleteIf they make Cena vs Lesnar, I would totally switch the match: What if Cena dominates for 20 minute and in the end Lesnar get's the fluke win, maybe because of Heyman? That would lead us to Hell in a Cell...and Cena vs Lesnar IV - Cena for USA, Lesnar for Russia *g*
They only had to run 1 competitive match for every 1 hour Raw. Totally different that this era of 3 hrs of Raw, 2 hrs of Smackdown where pretty much every match has to be at least semi competitive. Of course more people job now than then, it's apples and oranges.
ReplyDeleteI see Brock winning again. (Sort of like Mark Henry winning the title from Orton, then winning the HITC rematch clean). I hope so anyway.
ReplyDeleteIt's not the worst idea in the world. Renegade was a guy they wanted to push for the future and the only way they could get him to improve would be to get him in the ring with in-ring generals as they work a long match together.
ReplyDeleteI've never even seen the most recent one..
ReplyDeleteNot saying it's bad just so different haha
ReplyDeleteIt's a long time proven marketing strategy.
ReplyDeleteSo am I wrong that Cena will almost certainly have to win this? They aren't going to bury him two months in a row.
ReplyDeleteWell like I just mentioned, Orton did lost 2 matches in a row against Henry, and him and Cena were pretty much at an equal level around 2011. I really think it could happen.
ReplyDeleteGonna send him home in a body bag yeah!!!
ReplyDeleteVinnie Mac is still using Friendster.
ReplyDeleteI mean, it's not the worst movie in the world. I got a box set of all six movies on Blu-Ray from Amazon a few months back for less than $20. It was awesome.
ReplyDeleteI think Sheamus-Lesnar would be an awesome brawl.
ReplyDeleteSame here. He has enough credibility to at least make it an interesting fight, plus they will beat the hell out of each other for our enjoyment. Perfect for a future B PPV.
ReplyDeleteFantasy booking: Cena works with MMA fighters and teachers to up his game. Rener Gracie teaches him the finer points of BJJ, some striking with Jon Jones, armbar escapes with Ronda Rousey who shoot breaks his fucking arm and he goes away for a year.
ReplyDeleteI think it's just what they were used to at that point. On TV, big matches went first, with the kayfabe explanation that you wanted to have your main events have enough time for a finish. The rest of the show is just filler.
ReplyDeleteIt matters less now with the overrun, but some kayfabe about the card time would be nice.
That's the difference between a lighthearted review of a professional wrestling show and a professional wrestling show. One is comedy, the other is not.
ReplyDeleteThat is very true, it's so "convenient" how the main events always finish right when the show ends (Except of course the Montreal Screwjob, and the Sting/Hogan rematch the night after Starrcade. 2 dubious exceptions, for different reasons)
ReplyDeleteI'd say that both are kind of lame and unfunny to be honest. But that's just me.
ReplyDeleteTotally fine with this, 2/2 awesome matches so far
ReplyDeleteThinking for either Brock getting dq'ed or Cena getting dq'ed (brings the chain?)... I don't see the value in putting it back on Cena this soon.
ReplyDeleteI'm a Cena fan so I wouldn't care if he won. That would be a really bizarre booking move especially since Brock ended the streak but as long as it was a good match I'd be fine. I highly doubt Cena is going over though.
ReplyDeleteShow already has the camo tights. If they run a segment where he dives out of a golf cart backstage at 15 mph, I'm sold.
ReplyDeleteMake it 20!
ReplyDeleteBut Rocky Balboa's too small to be a main eventer.
ReplyDeleteI know it's the cool thing to rag on McMahon, but come on. Lots of small guys have been the top face by now.
ReplyDeleteLeroy Howard would pop up a bunch around this time as a job guy for both wwf and wcw. His most memorable outing was probably against Terra Ryzing a few months prior to this. He seemed to jump back and forth between the top two companies more often than Jeff jarrett.
ReplyDeleteWait a minute, Jim Ross was responsible for those three characters? Wow....just wow.
ReplyDeleteI don't think Daniel Bryan and CM Punk qualify as "lots".
ReplyDeleteI suppose you could make an argument to add Rey Mysterio, but he's always been more upper-midcarder than main event draw.
The only other "small" guy who held the world heavyweight title in the last 5 years is The Miz, who wasn't a face.
Bret? Shawn? Hell, Savage was only like 235 lbs. Jeff Hardy was right there before he screwed it up himself.
ReplyDeleteI'm all about Rocky III, but not THIS soon. Cena winning it back just makes the whole thing stunt booking, and the hideous gift of hearing Cole blurt out "GREATEST CHAMPION OF ALL TIME!" for the next 2-3 years. Sorry, I just think it's cheap.
ReplyDeleteYep. I might have to quit completely until Cena fucking retires.
ReplyDeleteSee ya in 5-8 years (or next Monday, which ever comes first.)
ReplyDeleteYou severely underestimate my ability to drop this shit completely.
ReplyDeleteIf Cena does win it back, his character better find some new fucking depths in the process i.e. he better bring out the chain and beat the absolute shit out of Brock
ReplyDeleteCena wins, but Rollins cashes in. Ambrose returns on Taw and the build begins for Rollins-Ambrose in Hell in a Cell.
ReplyDeleteI found that if they had one decent-to-good match, and one solid non-wrestling segment (usually an interview), that left me satisfied for a 45 minute show (commercials not included).
ReplyDeleteQuite possible. Let's run with it.
ReplyDeleteJR is highly overrated at most things
ReplyDeleteEh, not so much. Godwinn showed up before JR was rehired, and I'm sure Mantaur was in the works before as well. Besides, there's only so much one person could be responsible for in a company run by Vince.
ReplyDeleteDel Rio.
ReplyDeleteI guess it's the 4 years of 90% of people on here promising to stop watching every 2-3 weeks. If you do actually drop, then you are one of the special few. But I am skeptical.
ReplyDeleteI think fans would rather see Brock vs. BOO-tista at this point than Cena as champion again.
ReplyDeletevince is right. wwe is like crack to us, even if it sucks we still come back for more.
ReplyDeleteNo. No its not.
ReplyDeleteone for each title reign after he wins!
ReplyDeleteThey hate money if they don't do a screwjob here to extend the feud to Cena/Brock IN THE FUCKING CELL.
ReplyDeleteI've been beating this drum since July.
ReplyDeleteAnd after Brock we get Cena vs. Rusev, so Rocky IV.
ReplyDeleteWhat's sad about this cut-rate Rocky III is that Cena is playing both Apollo Creed and Rocky.
ReplyDeleteThis has been booked into such a corner. Had I the pencil I'd have Cena learn a few things and put up a really good fight, then have oh Nikki Bella come out and cost Cena the title with salt, something cheap like that. Later they'll play a rehearsed pretaped promo Nikki will explain that John didn't put a ring on it and now she's married to her job, the Authority comes out blah blah blah. H then explains that he can most easily control his world title by making sure a part-timer with simple financial motivation holds it best for business oh no will a new hero rise. Just something to get Brock heat by just going back to his farm with the belt until H says to return.
The important bit: CENA HAS TO GO AWAY. Like gone until the Rumble.
Booked into a corner? They could've easily kept Cena away from Brock for a bit after Summerslam. They chose to book the rematch. That being said, I can't wait for Cena to win the strap for the 16th time!
ReplyDelete'Just gotta hold on until Rocky Balboa' - Big E
ReplyDeleteGo away most popular t-shirt seller! Go away reason young fans ask their parents to take them to the shows. We have to build credibility for our play about fake fighting.
ReplyDeleteThen he can celebrate by dropping an elbow on his Cenation t-shirt. WHOOOO!!!
ReplyDeleteWell said.
ReplyDeleteSo who is Cena's protege going to be? You know, the one he'll have to beat up in an alley at the end of Cena V.
ReplyDeleteTommy Gunn always reminded me of Dustin Rhodes at that time. So there ya go.
ReplyDeleteYeah, and WWF should've completely wrote off Hogan in 1988 too, right?
ReplyDeleteCena isn't going away, especially since he's the most proven draw and merchandise seller when the company is already losing millions for reasons that have little to do with Cena.
I don't understand the hate for Cena. The guy has been the best in-ring wrestler in WWE in the last decade, easily.
ReplyDeletePlus Cena has brought the goods in the ring time and time and time and time again. But omg, he smiles and smirks sometimes, and he promotes fighting till the end, so HE MUST GO AWAY!!
ReplyDeleteHe's stale, boring as shit most of the time and although it's not his fault, his handling of feuds in promos often ruins his opponent's heat and credibility. He's a solid ring hand who can be counted on to deliver whatever is needed, but I get it.
ReplyDeleteHim "going away" would be awful for the financial health of the company and is a bad idea, but I totally get why people want it to happen.
What if Cena comes to the ring Monday with his old lock and chain necklace on and cuts an intense promo saying that he has to bring out the old Cena to beat Lesnar. They book a No Holds Barred match then.
ReplyDeleteThing is, I don't blame Cena at all for "ruining opponents' credibility". Losing to Cena is not what hurt Sandow and Cesaro. It's the immediate follow up of them jobbing every week afterwards that hurt them. There is zero shame in losing to the top guy. But then they got booked on super losing streaks. So I'd blame the booking for that, not Cena.
ReplyDeleteCena is boring in the same way that Big Macs are boring: they've been around forever in the same form.
ReplyDeleteBut McD's isn't going to pull its most popular item off the menu because people would rather see another, less popular burger in the #1 spot.
I'm hungry.
Do you think Cena does all the booking backstage? He's told what to say and how to say it.
ReplyDeleteEveryone that wrestles Cena immediately gains credibility and has most likely a very good match. WWE's overall booking is what is destroying the new talent. You can't just blame Cena.
Main Event actually does this as well. In a lot of ways, Main Event is basically the modern version of 93-95 Raw
ReplyDeleteDid you see the part where I said "it's not his fault?"
ReplyDeleteAnd the theory that everyone gains credibility by wrestling Cena is a myth, just as it's been with pretty much anyone since the 80s. Did Del Rio gain credibility wrestling Cena? Sandow? Ziggler? Bray Wyatt was WAY better off before the Cena feud.
That's 4 off the top of my head.
Cena/Brock in the Cell or they hate money.
ReplyDeleteI might change this to my screen name.
Read the last part of the post you replied to.
ReplyDeleteAmbrose/Rollins doesn't need the belt for their match to be in the Cell.
ReplyDeleteBrock/Cena in an epic for the world title does. It would be their two biggest stars for the biggest belt in their best stipulation match. I mean how do you not book that?
Sandow and Cesaro had little credibility to ruin to start with, so there, it wasn't that Cena ruined it so much as the idea that wrestling him somehow bestows +10 credibility upon you is horseshit.
ReplyDeleteBut Wyatt? ADR?
Cena isn't winning the title back.
ReplyDeleteIf they're not going to book Cena to sell these beatings, they could book differently. Rocky had to go train to return as well.
ReplyDeleteMy gut says yes, but history says Cena isn't jobbing two months in a row.
ReplyDeleteAlthough what's funny to me is that everyone says the worst part of modern wrestling is how everything is so predictable. They've managed to make two PPV main events in a row unpredictable by making one of the guys in them the predicted winner of every match he's had in the last 5 years.
That's... That's A way to keep people guessing. I guess.
You're asking a lot here, using different challengers or something.
ReplyDeleteDidn't you hear? The one guy sells all the bowling towels and t-shirts and always will and is going to be around forever why have another challenger?
WWE's shitty situation is 100% their fault to the point where they can't have Cena go out for a couple months to do a realistic injury angle because there are no challengers to their world title.
Is Wyatt really *THAT* destroyed? So he lost his feud to Cena 2-1 (all 3 matches had built in excuses for the loser), and now he just won his feud against Jericho. I think he's still just fine.
ReplyDeleteAnd Del Rio, well it was from 3 years of going 1400-1 against mid carders, while going approximately 1-280 against top players (Not just Cena, but Batista, Punk, Bryan, for example). As I said, it's all about the follow up.
Either it sucks because it was predictable, or it's stupid and illogical because they screwed up the obvious result. It's lose-lose.
ReplyDeleteDropped it in 2002 right after a period where I was more into it than ever before and didn't get back in until the beginning of this year, not like I couldn't do it again considering I can count on one hand the number of guys on today's roster I actually give a shit about.
ReplyDeleteI'd be shocked if they didn't go to the Cell. Of course WWE booking illogic would have Cena win that despite being in with a legit cage fighter. The drubbing Cena got Sunday, though hilarious, makes it tough to find a scenario where Brock isn't the prohibitive favorite and Cena just a punk who can't quit while he can still walk.
ReplyDeleteWyatt was way better off before that feud. "Destroyed" doesn't mean he's done forever, but he looked like much more of a world beater before he managed to nearly lose a 3-on-1 handicap cage match where he had the numbers advantage en route to getting stuck in a rolling equipment box.
ReplyDeleteAll that feud did was establish that Wyatt cannot hang at that level yet. Which is fine if it's true, but it doesn't help anyone to point it out so emphatically.
As far as the handling of people like Del Rio goes, yeah, of course the future matters, but the future doesn't erase the past. Why do the feud at all if the endgame is "Cena wins and you're clearly not on his level?"
Settle down, Beavis. I'm just saying I find it funny that the only way they've found (and by accident) to make the main event scene unpredictable was via multiple years of nearly-solid predictable bullshit.
ReplyDeleteThis is the wwe dude. After 10 years you know he ain't jobbing like that without getting his win back.
ReplyDeleteThey don't have to job Cena this time. Cena could fight a more even match, maybe have an advantage, and Brock low blows him and destroys Cena after the DQ.
ReplyDeleteNext night Brock says he's taking the next month off, per his contract, and Hell ina Cell is Ambrose/Rollins in a Cell match, and let's say Cena going over Rusev (after Lana taunts Cena on Raw as a failure for America).
Brock returns at Survivor Series to take on Batista or Brock or whoever.
The point is, WWE knows Wrestlemania (which is 100% coming off the Network, guys) is built around an "undefeated champion" Brock vs whoever (Bryan, The Rock, or Roman Reigns). There's no way they're doing what they did with Brock at Mania and Summerslam just to beat him in September. No way.
AJ should get naked... heh heh heh, YEAH YEAH, heh heh heh...
ReplyDeleteWell, if you've quit before it kind of diminishes the threat a little.
ReplyDeleteHe jobbed to Punk two months in a row, and several times again during
ReplyDeletePunk's heel reign, and didn't get that win back til almost 2 years
later.
He's never gotten the win back against Bryan.
And he ALREADY BEAT LESNAR, as they've made very clear on WWE TV all month.
But, but, WWE always sucks!!
ReplyDeleteBrock just killed fucking Cena dead 2 days ago and already EVERYTHING SUCKS. Jesus.
ReplyDeleteI think Sheamus is very boring right now and needs a new gimmick or so.
ReplyDeleteOh yay. 2 cases in 10 years. Totally invalidates everything.
ReplyDeleteBit of a straw man here. It's wrestling - the how matters more than the what. I doubt people are excited to see a Cena - Brock title match the very next PPV after Brock laid waste to Cena clean. Maybe if Cena had some sort of excuse like Heyman interfering there'd be some interest. Why would people pay to see a guy get his ass kicked a month later? Even Cena fans wouldn't want that.
ReplyDeleteBut he might eventually win a rematch! So I refuse to enjoy it!
ReplyDeletelol.
ReplyDeleteYes two very recent examples, plus Cena's already gotten the win against Brock.
ReplyDeleteAnd Cena just got killed by Brock TWO NIGHTS AGO. Maybe enjoy what was a good show before joining the freakout brigade?
I'm not freaking out. lol Cena wins is pretty much par for the course really.
ReplyDeleteExcept he just lost. 2 nights ago. And he hasn't won the rematch yet.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure about coming off the Network. At this point, I think they've killed their PPV business. You can't train people for a year to expect a PPV for $10 and then ask them to plunk down $60 for a four hour show. Will some buy? Absolutely, but I think they'll take a hit.
ReplyDeleteHe's going to. Which is the whole point.
ReplyDeleteYou teased quitting watching about an hour ago... I suggest you do. You are hopeless. Nothing WWE can do will ever make you happy, you'll always find something wrong with it.
ReplyDelete400k domestic bought Mania last year AFTER 670k people had already bought it on the Network. So yeah, there's a massive amount of people that would pay specifically for Wrestlemania.
ReplyDeleteEspecially if they keep Brock undefeated and a major attraction, and ESPECIALLY if they somehow put together Brock vs The Rock, which is the biggest possible professional wrestling match you can do and they'd be crazy not to do it if they have the chance.
I wouldn't say it's Strawman". It's "years of experience reading people finding negatives in everything". I can tolerate it, but i certainly will mock it.
ReplyDeleteHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHA youre just silly. You're mad because you've already told yourself he's GOING TO WIN. Oh my god this place is amazing.
ReplyDeleteI have to agree with that. You can buy this one PPV... For only... $59.99!!!! Just not the same ring to it.
ReplyDeleteI can totally see them having Cena regain the belt only for Rollins to cash-in immediately after. Sets up Rollins vs. Ambrose for the title in 'Hell in a Cell' and you can do a Lesnar-Cena blow-off in the Cell as well.
ReplyDelete400K NON-Network subs bought the show. They haven't been paying $10 a month for these PPVs. Completely different market. It'll be interesting to see how many NETWORK subs will pay for the show. The 400K isn't part of this discussion.
ReplyDeleteExactly, and that's why the UFC has not included their shows in Fight Pass. Dana White said once you tell an audience that your show is only worth $10, you'll never get them back, and that's the case. Obviously, some very diehards will pay the money, but I think a large majority — myself included — won't now feel the $60 for a SINGLE show is worth it when I just paid $60 for SIX shows.
ReplyDeleteI agree. I just don't think that's what will happen. I think Cena took the shit-kicking at Summerslam because he's getting the win back at NOC.
ReplyDeleteGood lord, you two. We are allowed to be critical of the product. We're not obligated to happily slurp down whatever the machine decides to force down our throats.
ReplyDeleteHow is the 400k not part of the discussion? That's the amount of people who payed full price for Mania last year. Isn't that exactly the discussion we're having?
ReplyDeleteObviously that 400k (plus the foreign buys, which was I think another 200k-300k) are the first batch of people that would pay full price for Mania this year. Then there's the Network subscribers, who would have to be sold into paying $60 for a one time event. So yeah, that's the tougher sell, and maybe the smart thing is don't charge what you used to charge for Mania--- bring it down to $30 or something.
Anyway, I could see them going in that direction. Which is all the more reason that Brock needs to be kept as the ultimate attraction, and why there's zero chance he's losing in Sept.
So sad... lol
ReplyDeleteAnd you're not even critical of the product, you're critical of something that HAS NOT HAPPENED. We are totally justified in making fun of you right now.
CENA HASN'T BEATEN BROCK YET!!!!
ReplyDeleteThis isn't legit criticism of something. This is freaking out about something that hasn't happened, and saying something sucks that HAS NOT HAPPENED. That's annoying. It's legitimately dumb as shit.
I criticize WWE booking plenty, but this is over the top weirdo bullshit.
It would be fantastic if they built up the whole Cena redemption storyline just to have Brock clobber him with the belt as soon as the bell rings, get DQed and walk off with a massive grin on his face - all just to fuck with Cena's head.
ReplyDeleteAnd Lesnar what, becomes a midcarder and comes back for a Mania match against Dolph Ziggler? Do you really think that after all they've done the last 5 months that they're alreday done with brock Lesnar as their #1 draw?
ReplyDeleteEh, too honorable. Salt in the eyes.
ReplyDeleteSo when he does, like history shows he will, will you two shut the fuck up then?
ReplyDeleteWell, that's how rasslin' has worked for the past 60 years. Build up a strong heel, feed him to the top face, lather, rinse, repeat.
ReplyDeleteAnd now he's angry because we called him out... hahaha
ReplyDeleteBAHAHAHAHAHAHA, I love this. Continue to get mad and hate everything just because a match has been booked.
ReplyDeleteYou're a goddamn cartoon character at this point.
"Like history shows he will" oh man, that's amazing how ridiculous you are.
ReplyDeleteYou know what history does ACTUALLY show? That Brock Lesnar beat Cena on Sunday in a really satisfying match. That's what actually has happened so far. But, ya know, everything sucks because of the thing that hasn't happened but that you've already decided HAS HAPPENED in your head. So silly.
I don't doubt that Cena would job two months in a row...I have trouble seeing Cena get destroyed..while getting the cheap win then getting destroyed destroyed in the rematch...then losing in the rematch rematch.
ReplyDeleteOk, goodbye then!
ReplyDeleteNot everything, mostly John Cena and his insane win percentage and domination of the product.
ReplyDeleteIt hasn't happened yet.
ReplyDeleteAnd also I gave you two very recent examples of John Cena doing clean jobs (in the case of Punk, several months in a row) without getting the win back and your response was... uhm, it wasn't a thousand examples!
The match hasn't happened. They're booking Brock Lesnar stronger than anyone they've booked in fucking forever, and they're obviously planning on Brock being THE selling point at Mania 31. The freakout here about a match that HASN'T HAPPENED is insane. Calm the fuck down crazypants.
And if Brock does win the rematch, and we point this out to him, he'll be like "Why are you 2 on my back, leave me alone, i never did anything to you!! Just let me be miserable in peace!!"
ReplyDeleteWell then the crying about how "Lesnar's just gonna job to The Rock or Roman Reigns so who cares this still sucks" begins.
ReplyDeleteWasn't that the build to the Extreme Rules 2012 match? Which was cool and all, but Cena needs to find some other level to make it seem like he's got a chance against Brock. Not sure what that could be though.
ReplyDeleteThen you will be called a troll and a gimmick.
ReplyDeleteAnd my heel turn will be complete.
ReplyDeleteOh lord. I wish I could accurately convey how hard I'm rolling my eyes at you right now.
ReplyDeleteObviously I want to be wrong about Super Cena this time.