DDP Yoga

Tuesday, March 25, 2014

What the World Was Watching: Monday Night Raw - April 27, 1998

by Logan Scisco

-Michael Cole narrates a video package that recaps last night’s Unforgiven pay-per-view.  Tonight, Vince McMahon will make a decision about WWF Champion Steve Austin’s future.

-Jim Ross and Michael Cole are in the booth and they are live from Hampton, Virginia.

-Footage of D-Generation X preparing for their “invasion” of WCW Monday Nitro, who are running Nitro in Norfolk tonight, which is about fifteen minutes from where Raw is being hosted, is shown.


-Opening Contest:  Ken Shamrock & Owen Hart wrestle The Rock & Mark Henry (w/The Nation of Domination) to a no contest at 1:43:

Shamrock and Owen had teamed for a few weeks on the house show circuit prior to this RAW and they were a ranked tag team in the Apter magazines, so I was excited to see them wrestle here.  However, Owen turns on Shamrock and ditches his lackluster four month run as a face.  Owen works better as a heel, so I fully approve of this move.  Owen Pillmanizes Shamrock’s ankle, which works to write Shamrock out of next month’s pay-per-view.  The beatdown, which extends to Steve Blackman and Faarooq when they try to make saves, was excellent. (1 for 1)

-Dude Love hosts the Love Shack and gloats about beating Steve Austin last night.  He proposes stripping Austin of the title and having the WWF put him against Shawn Michaels for the title or hosting a tournament or just giving it to him.  Very solid promo work for Foley, which included some classic heel cockiness.  2 for 2

-Call 1-900-737-4WWF to find out if a new manager is headed to the WWF!

-D-Generation X declares war against WCW in Norfolk.  WCW fans cheer when Triple H asks them if Eric Bischoff sucks.

-#1 Contender’s Match for the WWF Tag Team Championship:  Terry Funk & 2 Cold Scorpio beat The Headbangers via disqualification when Thrasher pushes the referee at 3:14:

It seems weird that the winner of this match gets a WWF tag team championship opportunity since neither team has accomplished much of note in recent weeks, but the WWF tag ranks are really thin at this point.  This match is non-stop action from the bell, with Funk moonsaulting the other three men as they brawl on the arena floor.  The finish is lackluster, but both teams keep fighting after the bell and at least this match made the tag team titles seem important.  Rating:  ** (3 for 3)

-Triple H asks if any of the WCW fans got free tickets for tonight’s Nitro.  X-Pac says high to Scott Hall and Kevin Nash and Triple H demands that they let them go.

-Steve Austin tossing Dude Love off of Sawyer Brown’s stage at Unforgiven last night is the Cinnaburst Rewind segment.

-Vince McMahon walks out and says he knows Austin was trying to hit him with the chair at the end of last night’s Unforgiven pay-per-view, which draws a huge cheer from the crowd.  He says he is not going to fire Austin yet and that Austin will defend the WWF title tonight against Goldust with Gerald Brisco as the guest referee.  McMahon announces that if Austin lays a finger on Brisco that he will be fired and stripped of the WWF title. Brisco says he will be impartial tonight and is not afraid of Austin.  McMahon closes by saying that any wrestler in the company would be a better representative with the title than Austin right now.  It’s a McMahon promo, so does it really need a rating?  4 for 4

-WCW closes the gate to the arena to keep D-Generation X from entering the arena with their vehicle.  I wish WCW had let them in and then had Scott Norton and Meng and kick their ass.

-Segments of Jeff Jarrett’s “musical performance” and altercation with Steve Blackman at Unforgiven last night are shown.

-Bradshaw beats Double J” Jeff Jarrett (w/Tennessee Lee) via disqualification when Kamikaze interferes at 1:14

Bradshaw doesn’t sell any of Jarrett’s offense and has the upper hand until Kamikaze hits the ring and attacks him.  Taka Michinoku tries to make the save, but also gets beaten down.  This time a fourth man is with Kamizake, but he is masked and his identity is unknown.

-Jerry Lawler comes out to replace Cole on commentary for hour two.

-Kevin Kelly interviews Dude Love, who is irate that he has not been given the title.  Love confronts McMahon, who doesn’t appreciate Kelly and the camera man being around and goes all Ronald Reagan on them by saying that he is paying for the equipment and for them to shut it off.

-Non-Title Match:  The Disciples of Apocalypse (w/LOD 2000, Chainz & Sunny) beat The New Age Outlaws (WWF Tag Team Champions w/D-Generation X) when 8-Ball pins Billy Gunn after an illegal switch at 3:35:

It’s like night and day having Ross and Lawler back-and-forth in the booth versus the awful Ross-Cole team and it’s amazing that it took so long for the WWF to just ditch Cole off the RAW broadcasts.  Even more surprising that they kept him around as Ross’s replacement.  The DOA dominate much of the match and when Billy Gunn hits Skull with a piledriver, 8-Ball makes an illegal switch and gives the DOA their first win in ages.  To show how much heat the Outlaws generated up to this point, the crowd goes nuts for the victory.  Rating:  *½ (5 for 5)

-The Undertaker beats Barry Windham with the Tombstone in 59 seconds:

And here I thought that Barry Windham was gone from the company by this point.  The sad thing is that THIS would’ve been a RAW main event if this was 1996.  It shows you how far the company has come since then.  The Undertaker sends Barry off to WCW with this squash.

-After the match, the Undertaker calls out Kane, who comes out after the commercial break with Paul Bearer.  Bearer begs the Undertaker for a truce and as he recounts the events of last night he reveals that Kane is his son.  Excellent promo work from Bearer here and I always say he doesn’t get the credit he deserves for his part in this feud in 1997-1998.  6 for 6

-The Undertaker’s plancha on Kane and Vader at Unforgiven is the Castrol GTX Slam of the Week.

-Kevin Kelly interviews The Artist Formerly Known as Goldust and Luna Vachon.  Goldust says that he is a pure man that would be a great representative of the company.  Dude Love ambushes Goldust yelling “That’s my shot!” and WWF officials have to pull him off of Goldust.

-D-Generation X comes back out and Triple H tells DOA that no one steals his buzz.  As Scott would say, “I love shoot comments that aren’t supposed to be…”  Triple H issues an open challenge to any member of the locker room that wants to face him for the European title.  Skull walks out, but Dan Severn walks past him and into the ring as Jim Cornette tries to convince him not to fight Triple H.  Cornette makes the mistake slapping Severn, which leads to Cornette being placed in an armbar and choke.  Unfortunately, this allows Triple H to get away.  This could’ve MADE Severn, but they pulled back.  This makes Severn a face now.

-WWF Champion Steve Austin tells Michael Cole that he’ll defend the WWF title and says that Vince McMahon isn’t going to get rid of him.

-Call 815-734-1161 to get your copy of the WrestleMania XIV video tape and a lifesize Steve Austin poster for $44.95 (plus $9 shipping & handling)!

-The new Val Venis vignette says that all men have “Venis envy” when compared to him.

-Marc Mero walks out and calls Sable to the ring.  Mero says that Sable humiliated him at Unforgiven last night when Luna took her evening gown off.  Sable counters that she enjoyed the experience and she challenges Mero to a match on RAW in two weeks.  She leaves before Mero answers her challenge.  This was pretty poor considering the past segments between these two, but that’s because they let Sable dominate all the mic time.  6 for 7

-Vince McMahon shakes Gerald Brisco’s hand backstage and says that he will enjoy watching him referee tonight’s main event.

-WWF Championship Match with Gerald Brisco as Guest Referee:  “Stone Cold” Steve Austin (Champion) and The Artist Formerly Known as Goldust (w/Luna Vachon) wrestle to a no-contest at 8:40:

Before the opening bell, McMahon jogs out and replaces the timekeeper to further stack the deck against Austin.  Brisco dares Austin throughout the match to hit him and counts quick falls for Goldust, but Austin resists and proceeds to wrestle one of the faster-paced 1990s Goldust matches you will ever see.  Ross actually acknowledges that if Austin loses the title that the crowd will riot, to which Lawler has a funny jab about being there for crowd control.  Austin hits a Stunner after a mule kick, but Brisco pulls a Nick Patrick and stops at two because something is allegedly in his eye.  Dude Love then runs in and brawls with Austin.  McMahon tries to take advantage of the opportunity in a brilliant callback to the previous evening by trying to hit Austin with the WWF title belt, but ends up KO’ing Brisco and that ends the match.  This is one of those underappreciated gems from the Attitude Era, but it’s a wild and fun match that foreshadowed the Austin-Dude Love rematch that is to come at Over the Edge.  It’s also Goldust’s best match in ages.  Rating:  *** (7 for 8)

The Final Report Card:  This show had a little too much D-Generation X and their “invasion” of WCW has been overhyped by subsequent WWE videos about the Monday Night Wars.  However, some of the segments were funny, like having a WCW fan claim that he didn’t pay for his ticket and then asking for the company to free Scott Hall and Kevin Nash.  The main event was fantastic as well and Austin really had his working boots on in his first run with the title.  The only missed opportunity was sidestepping a Honky Tonk Man moment with Triple H and the European title with Dan Severn, but you can’t always get what you want.

Monday Night War Rating:  5.7 (vs. 1.72 for Nitro)


Show Evaluation:  Thumbs Up

285 comments:

  1. Maybe it's been overblown but as a fan in 1998, watching DX openly run down WCW live literally outside their doorstep was a HUGE thing, really showed WWE was taking the charge after having their asses kicked in ratings for almost two years and solidified HHH as a major rising star and how DX was so much cooler than the tired NWO.

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  2. Oh yeah, Royal Rumble '05 is a classic commercial too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMqcA3wiKG0

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  3. "...then asking for the company to free Scott Hall and Kevin Nash."


    Would the WWF and Vince McMahon had even wanted those guys back at this point?

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  4. I love that shit. "123hegothimnohedidn't" and stuff like that. I'm actually one of the world's foremost (and few) Vince The Play-By-Play Guy fans. Some of my favorite Vinceisms:

    "BAAAAAAACK BODY DROP"
    "That remains to be seen."
    "Come on, ref!"
    "Whata maneuver!"
    "See-saw match-up"
    "That's tantamount to disqualification"
    "UN-BEE-LEAVE-ABLEEEEEEEE"
    "MON-DAY-NIGHT-RAWWWWW"
    "Stop it, Bobby Heenan"

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  5. I want the ability to create and share playlists, WWE. Please add that feature sometime in the future.

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  6. Harlan Leverage IIIMarch 25, 2014 at 3:24 PM

    Comedy can absolutely enhance a great main event feud. The best feuds are the ones where you really believe that one character is incredibly pissed at the other, and one way for a character (either face or heel) to get under the skin of someone else or play mind games with him is to get the entire audience to laugh at him. The nWo made the audience laugh at Arn Anderson's retirement; the Horsemen went berzerk. HHH did a series of videos when he was feuding with Mankind (the lead-up to the retirement match before WM2K, I think), where Dennis Knight did a dead-on, hilarious Mick impression. The next week, a pissed-off Mick beat the crap out of Knight backstage, being far more vicious than usual.
    The problem, though, is that the victim has to sell the comedy right. You can't "yes, and" or "no, but" like you're taught in improv class; you have to sell it like a slap in your face or a called shot to your self-worth, and nobody today wants to look dumb or like the victim of a joke.

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  7. Vince would have been fine as a color guy, but his play by play is fucking horrendous.

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  8. I like wrestling that takes itself seriously, but not too seriously.
    Funny interactions between wrestlers, and I'm thinking of Bookdust as a prime example, are great and add a chuckle to the program which is always appreciated. Rock and DX in their day were hilarious, Angle too, and that's all cool. Once you start getting cute with the matches though, I generally lose interest.

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  9. I don't care what you say, Hall and Nash in the WWF at this point would have kicked ass.

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  10. Kip Frye was the guy in charge at the time. JYD may have been fired by Watts, but he was hired during Frye's run.

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  11. I'm late to the party but my two cents. Whatever the reason Punk walked away, I'm very glad he did. The guy was beyond burnt out and had numerous nagging injuries. He needed time off. Do you really want those injuries piling up and him getting seriously hurt? Do you want him to have a mental breakdown? I actually could see somebody like Punk having a mental breakdown. Not on Benoit levels but bad nonetheless. Doing this is better all around for his health.

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  12. I love the way he just cuts in with "How about sadomasochistic activity?" with that creepy smirk

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  13. I'm a few episodes in, and it's fun.. Hell, it's made me really look forward to watching Wrestlemania IX again (something I'll have to wait a while for since I'm only on '89 WCW/WWE PPV, dammit).

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  14. I just finished that one in my chronological PPV viewing (watching WM V currently). Flair/Steamboat blew me away. I had only seen their other two matches on Flair's first DVD set back when it released, and at the time I just couldn't get into the "old style wrestling." Damn glad that's changed now.

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  15. Yes, I would absolutley love this feature. I gotta think the WWE would like this feature also as they are big with the WWE communicating and sharing and shit. Have a list of the most played playlists as well as a search feature. I could see WWE coming out with something like this in the next six months to a year.

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  16. Speaking of comedy, Steve Austin's story about his tricep surgery on his latest podcast has got me in tears.

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  17. Comedy should never be an intentional goal in wrestling.

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  18. *scrolls through thread* That's about what I thought it would be.

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  19. The payoff to feuds or arguments can be funny as long as it doesn't kill the character: Cornette taking a cake to the face, Heenan getting put in a weasel costume, Ric Flair going to meet Precious in a hotel and it turns out to be Ronnie Garvin in drag who beats him up. I agree that comedy midcard acts aren't bad either like Tons of Funk, Santino, but they shouldn't be the main event. This is why funny Austin was horrible. He was entertaining, but WWF took their biggest star and put him on the same level as Too Cool. That shit is fine if Austin is moving down the card, but not as the champ.

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  20. TJ: So for whatever reason today my voice has been cracking and is lower than normal. My only two thoughts are 1) I'm finally going through the last little bit of puberty, or 2) I have the kind of cancer that makes your voice dark and sultry.

    I hope it's 1)

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  21. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 4:31 PM

    In ECW, was the crowd chants of "She's a Crack Whore' supposed to be funny? Because I really thought it was hypocritical, considering that half the crowd had to be on crack themselves from the look of them.

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  22. Just like Flair on WWF TV with the Big Gold Belt and Scott Hall showing up on Nitro.. the DX Invasion was one of those "moments in time" that they can never really recreate again.

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  23. Funny doesn't draw? So The Rock didn't draw back in the day? Rock/Foley This is your life segment? Of course comedy sells... it just has to be engaging good quality comedy!

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  24. YES!!! (In my Daniel Bryan voice)

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  25. I don't think a funny Rock promo sold tickets. I wasn't buying Armageddon 2000, for instance, because Rock cut a promo making fun of his opponents.

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  26. I think they would have joined DX and eventually turned it into another NWO. I would have liked to have seen a Diesel vs Stone Cold feud or Razor Ramon vs The Rock in their prime..

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  27. He talks plenty about getting away with murder because Bischoff didn't care about anything unrelated to the main event in A Lion's Tale.

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  28. Bret Hart vs. HBK Survivor Series 92 time!

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  29. There's a good chance, sure. He was loaded on the Nitro Spring Break episodes, the one where he cannonballed off the stage into the pool featured a drunk out of his mind Nash.

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  30. Something as inherently ridiculous as pro wrestling needs some comedy and levity from time to time.

    That said, when wrestling is wrestling, it's competing with all the other wrestling readily available. When wrestling is comedy, it's competing with all the other comedy available.

    Vince and his team produce pro wrestling that is unparalleled in the industry. You may hate the booking, but no one produces a better presentation than the WWE.

    Do Vince and his team produce comedy that is head and shoulders above every other sitcom, comedy movie, stand-up act, etc. that is readily available? Fuck no.

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  31. Oh, it was very big and definitely gave DX the edge in cool that the bloated and overdone nWo had by that time lost, but you'd think that moment by itself won the war going by WWE productions now. It was still very cool, though, of course.


    I know he's not the first to say it, but in one of said productions Hunter says WCW should've let 'em in, and yeah...who's watching Raw if WCW let DX march down to the ring? Hunter says they had no plan if that had happened, and shit, the "unleash Haku on them" idea is better than most if you're WCW, lol.

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  32. Why does colt cabana get so much crap btw?

    His matches are good generally, his comedy matches are unique, and his 3 big feuds in roh (vs Nigel mcguennis, jimmy Jacobs and homicide) he more than held up his end and the matches/stories were good.

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  33. Was that from the 3 hour Raw commercial?

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  34. Here's the commercial.
    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DlyZYOZFQuA

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  35. B+ player.

    Honestly I don't know. It's weird, I've never seen him wrestle but he always seems to pop up in news stories, podcasts, interviews, shoots, and so on. Maybe that's part of it. I don't know.

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  36. Watching WM8....Sheri Martel singing HBK's theme is just...odd.

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  37. After Survivor Series 92, have started watching Raw's leading up to RR93. Watching Raw Ep. 2 (watched Ep 1 a couple weeks ago.)
    Terry Taylor and Perfect..Poor Terry. Why is Bartlett making fat jokes at Perfect?

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  38. I love Vince's "everybody is having a good time" fake laugh

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  39. Jesus how big of a down grade could they give the crowd? From jyd to Doug gilbert lol

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  40. ECW fans can't afford crack!

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  41. I've spent tons of time watching the network. Never once considered flipping on the live stream (expect initially to make sure it worked)

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  42. Iron sheik taps clean to the scorpion death lock 18 months before Bret was using the sharpshooter

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  43. "I'm here to do color… dysentery…"


    I don't care what anyone says, I thought Drunk Hawk was hilarious.

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  44. Flair is a fucking pimp. 40 girl entourage out to the ring. WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

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  45. Why put flair vs steamboat 3 before the two tag matches...and omg if Ricky's kid riding a pony to the ring?

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  46. The build to flair vs steamboat makes Ricky look like a tool

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  47. Speaking of Bryan, while I do love current Bryan, part of me REALLY misses snarky asshole Bryan. Especially when he was an asshole to Kane.

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  48. Your_Favourite_LoserMarch 25, 2014 at 5:44 PM

    3) barry white is slowly taking over

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  49. Wow...Mean Gene hyping Royal Rumble 93 with that old Rumble/SummerSlam theme music playing makes me want to contact my local cable company.

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  50. Your_Favourite_LoserMarch 25, 2014 at 5:46 PM

    ooh, cake!

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  51. I loved when the camera cut out JUST as Austin was about to sodomize Vince with the enema tube.

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  52. Your_Favourite_LoserMarch 25, 2014 at 5:49 PM

    ME GRIMLOCK WANT EVERY WEEK!!!

    ME GRIMLOCK MAKE YOU TAP OUT WITH RIMLOCK!!!

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  53. Vince: "Austin, I don't know what to do with you!"
    The Rock: ( walking up to Vince) "Vince, The Rock thinks you should fire him."
    It was a tiny little ad-libbed line, but it was so out-of-the-blue hilarious and made it clear The Rock could be something on the mic.

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  54. Wrestling is best when it is like long-form improv. You give the players a suggestion and then they work with each other to develop the suggestion into a scene. The scene can be dramatic, tragic, comedic, etc. The important thing is that it not be 100% scripted because the fun (for both the performer and the audience) is seeing what they can come up with on the fly while maintaining the reality of the scene.

    Anyone who has ever done longform improv comedy (the style of Upright Citizens Brigade, not Whose Line) will tell you that if you plan jokes or try to shoehorn jokes into a scene, they fall flat. They just aren't funny. The comedy comes from establishing a reality through a (usually absurd) setting and characters and then following it through to its logical conclusion. Pro wrestling already has the absurd characters and a fairly absurd setting. All you need to do is tweak the situation and then let the characters interact in order to generate funny scenes. The players don't even need to try to be funny as long as they play their characters consistently.

    Seriously, would it even be possible to put Macho Man in a real world setting without it being funny? That character would be hilarious just reacting to testimony while sitting in a jury box.

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  55. Ugh, the same Big E Inbox and Ambrose "Breaking Down The Match" that I've seen before. Why can't I ever catch cool things like Jake vignettes or something?

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  56. Same with Ultimate Warrior or George The Animal Steele.
    These days we have The Miz, Curtis Axel, Zack Ryder, and Jack Swagger. All would just blend into the jury box.

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  57. Entirely too little mention of the original DX in this thread. The Chrismas bit with the Misteltoe, "Lingual ain't one of 'em," the face guards for Sgt. Slobber, the State of the Union, etc. ad nauseum.

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  58. Also, lots of love here for E&C, but it's not like Edge ever stopped being funny. His "wrong" promo gets me in stitches every time, and his crusade against everything stupid was the funniest gimmick basically ever. His kidnapping of Paul Bearer was good for a few laughs too. And of course, his "Jeff Hardy, didn't you die like two years ago?"

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  59. Well it doesn't get any better than Flair vs Steamboat. I was on here awhile ago trying to say Cena vs Punk was its equal, if not better, but I was wrong. This is perfect

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  60. that's not true. of course their fake laughter ruins segments - but it also ruined several segments that would have been funny without it.

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  61. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:04 PM

    Anyone checking out the live Main Event?

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  62. Yup. Hoping for a Dolph-Big E match.

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  63. Sigh. If only they'd given in to his demand for ice cream bars.

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  64. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:06 PM

    I missed what happened to Christian. What's up?

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  65. Phillips said "slight concussion." Triple threat #1 contenders match with the 3 guys that didn't win last night, winner gets Big E later tonight.

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  66. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:08 PM

    Nice. At least they're still delivering a title match.

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  67. I think it's because he clearly is just in it to have fun and entertain the audience. I recall hearing somewhere that he doesn't even try to play backstage politics at all, which is why he rarely gets very high on cards.

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  68. Can you build a time machine and go back 11 years and tell me that?

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  69. this is awesome:


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84yRIxWZ58Y

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  70. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:11 PM

    Dig those WM XXX ads featuring acoustic versions of Orton and Batista theme music.

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  71. The acoustic version of Randy Orton's Vocies rocked.
    The acoustic version of whatever Batista's song is? Not so much.

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  72. One thing Vince said in an interview a while back that really resonated with me is that wrestling is like a circus variety show: There should be a wide range of acts that appeal to a wide range of people, so that people who don't like clowns for example will be entertained by the tigers jumping through fire, or the trapeze artists, or the elephants.

    He is right: A promotion of 50 Daniel Bryans gets old quick, as does 50 John Cenas or 50 of anyone. There needs to be a variety of people filling a variety of roles.

    The problem, though, is that Vince and co occasionally overlook the highest caliber clowns/elephants/human cannonball ammunition in favor of lower grade stuff that they themselves like more. Comedy ties into this. There is a place for comedy in wrestling, its just that, as SNL found out, the comedy has to be consistently good otherwise you just give people a reason to change channels. Santino has had his share of genius, endorphin-creating promo moments, and hes also had his share of "Oh god, this is the stupidest and/or most awkward thing I've ever witnessed." promo moments. Most aren't even Santino's fault, its just hes given third-rate material at times, which is the problem. WWE should try to mix comedy with soap opera with serious wrestling with serious backstage drama, because wrestling as a whole should be about good out-of-ring stuff, be it comedic antics or dramatic tension, setting up good in-ring stuff. If WWE keeps doing this occasional homerun occasional strikeout business with comedy though, it won't work cause the people who hate comedy will hate bad comedy even worse, and the people who wouldn't mind or even like comedy will either sit on their hands during a "funny" moment, or just hate it entirely.

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  73. Comedy can work if you know how to do it right. When WWE tries HARD for comedy - which is most times - then it's bad. It's just forced comedy, especially when the announcers start doing their fake laughing.


    Chikara's probably the best example of comedy done right. While they have had moments of seriousness (and some really great stories from it, like a banned submission move), the promotion as a whole doesn't take itself too seriously. And best of all, the fans enjoy it because of that. They go right along with all the ridiculousness, like the impromtu baseball game right in the middle of a 6 or 8 man tag match or the dance offs.


    Where Chikara succeeds, though, is that they space out the comedy in between some great lucha libre style wrestling. Yes, they'll have comedic moments, but they also have some great wrestling, too. I've watched through some of their six-man tag tournaments and the always fantastic Young Lions cup. In all their matches, they space out the comedic moments so that when they happen, they're special.

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  74. or this:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vODntEEeQXY

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  75. I think it's the new lead singer of Saliva trying to do it, that's why it sounds so odd.

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  76. Cena and Punk are as close as anyone is giong to get at delivering three near-perfect matches. And even then those matches were spread out over 2 1/2 years, not 4 months.

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  77. I'm watching.


    I almost bought that DDT as a win for Ziggler. only a ner fall though.

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  78. I wouldn't be shocked if wires got crossed and agents told the wrong guy to win. The Christian win seemed so random, especially after ADR's victory over Big E last week on Smackdown.


    If Christian's really hurt, though? Shit. He should retire. I still think he "brings it" in the ring, but he's too banged up and needs to worry about his future health (neurological and otherwise).

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  79. This is the second time I've had an issue with the live feed during main event. It goes black for a moment.


    Are there that many people really watching Main event?

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  80. Agreed. I did some of that via video and whenever we tried to go from a script it really sucked. We just kind of winged it and it turned out...bad, but better. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4CCLFk5NP4

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  81. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:18 PM

    Yeah, I think it's a signal thing.

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  82. Could be weather in the Boston area?

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  83. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:19 PM

    Holy near falls, Batman. This match is pretty tight.

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  84. Holy crap, that finish would've been awesome with a better camera view.

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  85. Maybe. The "LIVE" in the corner is still on display and the signal comes back quickly enough.


    Oh, Ziggler wins, now we get a face/face match for the IC title. I hope they switch the belt and find a nice opponent for Ziggler to deliver a ***+ match with at Mania.

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  86. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:20 PM

    Looked like Ziggler was a little late on the Zig Zag. Cool finish though.

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  87. I feel like the wrestling on these live main events has been delivering.

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  88. That triple threat was really good.

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  89. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:21 PM

    Yeah, if it's legit, it's time to maybe think about the end of his contract being THE end.

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  90. Ziggler should turn heel on Big E and win the belt.

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  91. As a pure fan, I wanted Ziggy to go over because he's likely in my Top 5, but I almost rather see Sheamus or ADR go for the IC title (I don't think either has held that title). Ziggler gets sucked into the US or IC title vortex every 18 months, it seems, and then does the non-title match losing streak.

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  92. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:23 PM

    If Ziggler wins the title, does that mean back to jobbing on a regular basis?

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  93. There was exactly one time Bret was funny. Who are you to doubt El Dandy?

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  94. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:23 PM

    I just had that thought. Having the IC title means squat to a guys push.

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  95. That's because WWE writers aren't comedy writers. SNL writers are some of the most talented comedy writers in the country and they can't pull off a whole 90 minutes of great comedy week to week. WWE hires soap writers. What do they know about comedy?

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  96. It'll be the usual, "win the belt so we can push you, then forget that's why we gave you the belt so we job you out again" push.

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  97. Awesome point. When they have to beat you over the head with the joke--especially when the announcers have to hammer home JUST HOW FUNNY THIS IS WHY AREN'T YOU LAUGHING--it doesn't work. The more choreographed they are, the less funny they end up. Except for Too Cool, of course.

    Christian trying to make weight for a cruiserweight title match (featuring Edge, Foley, Kurt Angle, and Kurt Angle's chicken suit), Angle's deadpan reaction to Bossman's "drove his dead daddy around the cemetery at a high velocity" monologue, CM Punk's "look at that...I just made you a million dollars in ice cream sales" to his demand for the return of ice cream bars. Just simple stuff, really, but good for a laugh.

    And sometimes the announcers help, too. Listening to JR play straight man for Lawler and Heyman between 98 and 02 was a joy.

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  98. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:26 PM

    Sweet Fancy Moses. Going from a pretty good triple threat, to a 10 Diva clusterfuck whogivesafuck.

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  99. TOTAL DIVAS IS FAKER THAN WRESTLING.

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  100. Summer Rae has her own music?

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  101. "1998 called and they're sick of you too" was just the perfect insult to X-Pac. "I promise not to "Billy Gunn" the title". He also convincingly feuded with a laptop. I miss Edge.

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  102. Poor Emma coming out with the rest of those losers from Total Divas immediately devalued her.

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  103. ARRRRR there be a pirate divar out thar..... ARRRR.

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  104. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:28 PM

    If they can keep the Divas match at WM to under 2 minutes, I won't complain too much.

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  105. Stuttering Goldust needs some love too. Adding a crazy trait to an already crazy character worked. He was really committed to it.

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  106. AJ is fantastic on commentary.

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  107. Only b/c HHH wasn't in power yet. Anybody want to discount that as baseless HHH bashing? Then explain 2011 to me.

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  108. I see this is a 2 man show right now.

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  109. And she just pointed out the gaping plot hole in setting up this Mania match. What ARE the rules here?

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  110. Man I didn't get DX at all as I was more a fan of the Nation. Back when they put black guys on the show and they weren't complete clowns.

    Have no idea why Owen joined. From a kayfabe perspective why would this even happen? It kinda worked but it still made no sense.

    Not sure why WCW didn't let DX in. Wouldn't everyone tune into Nitro to see what was up?

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  111. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:33 PM

    This thread loses steam around lunch time.

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  112. Main Event and NXT should get dedicated threads.

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  113. I just figured it'd be the same rules as the Cruiserweight Open at XX.

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  114. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:35 PM

    Does that "Snuka look" mean that one requires meth, a hotel room and a dead girlfriend?

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  115. The fire Naomi showed at the end makes me feel like she should have gotten a straight-up match with AJ. Maybe someone comes to their senses and sets up a Divas gauntlet or something during the preshow and gets us to a one-on-one match for AJ by Mania.

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  116. That commetator is getting screwed at so loudly by Vince McMahon right now I can here it in my apartment in Pennsyvlania.

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  117. "THERE ARE FOUR TEAMS!!! TAG TEAM WRESTLING IS RED HOT RIGHT NOW!!!"

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  118. This is too soon for John Cena/Bray Wyatt. This would be an awesome WrestleMania XXXI main event though.

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  119. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:38 PM

    Battle royal, multiple diva match, tag team fatal four way......everybody gets a payday. If they ever figure out how to pay out.

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  120. These videos were why I was hoping for a better Raw yesterday. Normally, the go home show for Mania will have a good half hour or so of packaged (and awesome) videos.


    Just that short Taker-Lesnar one makes me forget about how bad the build has been so far.

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  121. YES! I LOVE THIS GUY!

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  122. HEY! They remembered Bad News Barrett.

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  123. Owen hated the DX like the Nation.

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  124. Is Barrett injured or something? Why doesn't he ever wrestle? He's great!

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  125. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:42 PM

    Yeah! It's not about being sheep! It's about being ugly!

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  126. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:43 PM

    A pen through the hand and then a bunch of idle threats. What's not to like.

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  127. This Mania is going to be the one with the most wrestlers on the card if the 30 guys working the battle royal don't work any other matches.

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  128. Who wins the Andre battle royal? AND will it matter? I just have it stuck in my head that Ziggler's going to win it and they'll treat it like a breakout win (ignoring last year)

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  129. richard householderMarch 25, 2014 at 6:44 PM

    "Oh I'll take it from here, nurse!" from Stone Cold was the funniest thing in WWF history.

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  130. I figured it was going to be Big Show's last meaningful achievement.

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  131. The 'E has no imagination, so it'll probably come down to Sheamus and Big Show.

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  132. They needed a worker for the group

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  133. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:45 PM

    Big Show seems to be the consensus here.

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  134. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:46 PM

    All right. I'm starting this match at **** and working my way up or down from there.

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  135. Nope. It ended up being Paul ellering

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  136. Yeah, Ziggler and Show seem to be the ones talking about it the most, but I'd also have Sheamus in the final four, at least

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  137. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:47 PM

    And apparently Dolph is over it.

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  138. I want to bombard twitter with #ICtitle insults but I can't remember my password.

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  139. Oculus looks...pretty bad. I'll probably go see it in theatres.

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  140. I think comedy has a place in wrestling, but the champ can't be a comedy guy. He can work comedy in the way Angle, Rocky and even Stone Cold did, but he can't be Santino Marella...and I love Santino.

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  141. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:50 PM

    Will they work Kane's enormously large prosthetic penis into this one?

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  142. Which one is the "wrong" promo? Would love to see it.

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  143. So the one time I want the IC champion to job, he doesn't? FML.

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  144. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:54 PM

    Yup. Dolph gets pinned. Maybe Dolph wins the battle royal then.

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  145. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 6:56 PM

    Wrestlemania Rewind is new. Should be worth a look.

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  146. Wrestling isn't exactly known for originality, and I'm mostly fine with that...but that was almost, downright plagiarized from "The Andrea Doria" episode of Seinfeld when George recites everything that happened to him so he can get an apartment.

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  147. Decent and relatively harmless show. I don't know how I feel about the IC title. I was rooting for Ziggler, but I was secretly hoping both guys would lose so they didn't have to carry that albatross/belt/losing streak gimmick

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  148. The picture quality was consistently shitty for me -- rarely came close to hitting HD. I don't watch the live feed too often but that's the first time I've had that problem. Hope it gets fixed for WM.

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  149. So.. Christian gets a concussion and Ziggler has to job again?? They really HATE this dude..

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  150. Hall's problems were already evident back in 1996 (which is why he replaced by Piper at Wrestlemania XII), you think Vince was going to put up with that shit in 1998?

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  151. What all those guys have in common is that when chips are down and those guys need to get serious, they can come off as serious as a heart attack. Cornette has too many hilarious lines to count, but when he told you the Midnight Express were the best tag team in the world, he by god BELIEVED it, and for at least a moment or two you believed it as well. Comedy and seriousness (by wrestling standards) can be effective in emphasizing and contrasting each other, but only if there's a proper balance.

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  152. Rock's grin was supposed to come at the end of the This Is Your Life segment, when Foley said that every day was like the Rock's birthday. It didn't happen, and with the Rock's character not budging--he had to accept and like Foley for the turn to mean anything--the storyline was called off.


    Watching at the time, I was practically PRAYING for that segment to end with Foley bringing up one last memory, and showing all the chairshots at the '99 Rumble, and it ending with Rock facedown in a pool of his own blood as a bevy of suits tried to pry Mankind off of him--maybe have the other actors "break character" and try to help. That would have been an all-time, "where were you when...?" moment. Instead we got a tepid Triple H run-in and the most anticlimactic finish to a so-called "legendary" segment in history.

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  153. WWE in 2000 is the perfect use of comedy for wrestling.

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  154. To this day, as an editor, that drives me nuckin' futz. And they play it OVER and OVER. Gah!

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  155. The Rock during that one interview with the Nation, where Farooq does all the talking while Rock just looks at the camera during random tidbits.


    Classic.


    Also, whenever he cut promos on Undertaker, and made reference to "his Mickey Mouse tattoos, and his thirty three pound head!"

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  156. Nobody was better than Heenan than making fun of a guy in a way that also put them over--like how Bret Hart was "too dumb to quit" or that he was an idiot for being such a fighting champion.

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  157. "If you were going to give the United States an enema, you'd stick the hose right here in Pittsburgh!" (Naturally Bret had to bitch and moan about saying that line in Wrestling with Shadows, but fuck it, it was glorious).

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  158. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMarch 25, 2014 at 7:10 PM

    Tomko, gimmie a beat.
    No.

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  159. Goofy Kurt Angle from 2000 was such a fun character. The guy really took to pro wrestling/sports entertainment in very little time.

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  160. Oh wow, someone else who doesn't think Austin & Angle were the greatest comedy duo since Laurel & Hardy? I always thought I was alone.


    In fairness, some of their stuff was genuinely funny, but it was mostly stuff that wasn't trying that hard--which came off like the bits mentioned above where Cole and Lawler have to pretend to laugh hysterically. One that sticks out was Austin and Angle cutting a promo from WWF New York. Austin does all the talking while Angle just stands there, and then as they're walking off, Angle for no reason at all flashes his gold medal at the camera, right at the fade-out. THAT was funnier than a million tiny hats and Vince hugs, because it was so random and yet so perfectly in tune with Angle's character, being obsessed with beating the "Olympic hero" persona over our skulls.


    The rest of the time, it undermined both guys and did absolutely nothing to sell me on seeing them wrestle anybody, or each other, on a show.

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  161. Shawn was legit crazy at the time and what he said came across as funny cause he didn't give a fuck. Hunter as usual was trying so hard to act funny and be cool that he looked so awful and fake. I did laugh at their wiper helmets for slaughter.

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  162. Can we make miz into the name we shall not mention. Ugh, his fake talking head is all over the damn network!

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  163. Team Hell No is actually what brought me back into watching WWE after having stopped watching much other than a handful of good matches I read about for about two years. I have bought one WWE ticket since then and lots of NXT tickets. So comedy did in a way sell me tickets.

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  164. Just watched wrestlewar 89, the pot shots by Jr toward the WWF seem so bush league when he's subtly trashing hogan and savage. Also the Terry Funk angle is probably the coolest post match segment in history.

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  165. Cause he comes across as such a know it all prick.

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  166. Thank Brian gerwitz for that bullshit. All is knows is bad comedy for characters . Thank God he's not around for the shield

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  167. That was an end fererra idea that they stole from him after he left. He was using it for LA parka in 99

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  168. He was only funny as the clueless putz in wcw. He was trying too hard in wwe

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  169. Good god the trailblazers lost in Orlando??? Imagine if they end up missing the playoffs. Oh well it puts splash city one game closer to that 5 seed.

    Man its so hard to decide what I want to watch on the network. Im thinking GAB 89 but I kind of want to check out rumble 96 too

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  170. Lol that's good. Vince would rather "the humdinger"

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  171. You're so right.

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  172. Is the network freezing every 30 seconds for anyone else? I'm trying to watch WM 3 and it is not going well.

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  173. He was so unbearable from 93-95. Ugh

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  174. That's a hell of a better ending. You and Russo could work.

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  175. Santino jumped the shark about two years ago

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  176. Between Kurt Angle, Big Show's parodies, Commissioner Foley, the APA, and Edge & Christian, 2000-2001 were definitely the best comedy years for WWF/E.

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  177. I wouldn't think that would be enough to actually let him in the group. I could see him saying "hey we both hate dx. Help me get even with them." That's different from him actually becoming a member.

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  178. Russo and ferrea were hired at the end of September 99 and Nash was taken off the booking committee so they needed to fill time until Russo started. I have a feeling Russo said go with what you want until I start to Nash.

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  179. I thought D-Lo was coming along just fine. Those matches with X-Pac over the European title were pretty hot.

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  180. I lose it every single time when he gets to the little kid "Hey, hey little fella. You know what you're gonna be when you grow up? You're gonna be WRONG!"

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  181. It did make sense because all of his Hart Foundation teammates were long gone, and he kept getting screwed over on his own, so he needed to be part of a faction again.

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  182. I LOVE after the mick Foley vs terry funk match on raw in April 98 (Austin on color) when Vince gives Foley the dude character back and starts dancing with the strippers. Austin starts laughing and Ross yells "for crying out loud he thinks he's dick Clark,". So fucking funny

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  183. It didn't really make any sense why Owen would hang around with them. It didn't make any sense why they would let Owen hang with them. They had a common enemy, but that's different from joining their group. He may have wanted to be aligned with a group but not THAT particular group of guys.

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  184. True dat. Still don't think it was needed though. IIRC they didn't do much more than tag matches anyway

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  185. Stranger in the AlpsMarch 25, 2014 at 8:03 PM

    I'm sure crack made some people do some regrettable acts.

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  186. Gotta give love to TNA for Paparazzi Productions. The "Nash as Cruiserweight" era kept on giving EVERY WEEK!!!


    "When I beat Bob Backlund in front of 50,000 people at Madison Square Garden..."
    "Does Madison Square Garden even HOLD 50,000 people???"
    "It did that night!"


    "Jay Lethal, you go first!"
    "Why do I have to go first?"
    "Because you're black!"


    "It says so right there....authorized by Bob Backlund"


    The "training session" with the Madagascar cruiserweights (Shelley's submission = Nash clubbing forearm to the back)


    Sonjay Dutt: Steroid Abuser


    Crowd's "That was awesome" chant for Nash's forearm.


    "It wouldn't be an inspirational story if the winner didn't have chlamydia"


    Didn't do any favors for the division as a whole, but it DID bring out some personality for the others (and begat Black Machismo).

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  187. Actually, it may impact the tippy top guys more than anyone. According to Jim Ross, midcard level talent (and below) NEVER made a killing on PPV pay outs, so it may not impact them all too much. The top guys are the ones who made the money off of these pay outs.

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  188. I always thought it was meant to be absurdly comedic.

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  189. Hey! You stole that Meng & Scott Norton line from me. Seriously though, what a sight that would have been. Although you would have to be watching Nitro to see it! Vince would probably pout and sue over his guys getting manhandled.

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  190. Also..."At the Movies with Edge and Christian"....when they review the infamous Hardy backyard wrestling vids from their teenage years. Complete burial, but hysterical nonetheless....best E & C segment, IMO

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  191. There's a lot of little things they can do to ease some of the physical burden on their talent. For one, these gimmick PPV's. I've said it before but it bears repeating: These gimmick PPV's that are built around brutal matches that are always at the top of the card means that the same talent are competing in punishing matches on a monthly basis. In a year's time, Orton competed in a MITB ladder match, an Elimination Chamber match, a Hell in a Cell match, a TLC match, and various Extreme Rules matches. Making these matches your scheduled main events instead of a natural progression of a blood feud would go a long way.


    Additionally, why not do away with some of these unnecessary matches? Punk will fight a brutal PPV match and then, for no real reason, they'll throw him into a 20 minute match on Raw that doesn't really do anything to progress the story more than a promo would have. Allow your top talent to rest up and make their TV matches mean something.

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  192. IIRC, The Nation had more or less dropped the black power specific purpose by then, and especially once Rock ousted Faarooq. After that it was pretty much all about getting Rocky over like gangbusters.

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  193. Yeah, the black power thing was over and done. These were a group of young guys plus the Godfather that were just a black version of DX. DX was made up of young white guys that engaged in frat boy behavior. The Nation was pretty much black frat guys. I don't see where Owen fit into that.

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  194. It just felt like the bookers saying "we got nothing for Owen so let's stick him in the Nation."

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  195. Jesus, I was trolling Farva, not the humorless in general. Pick your spots.

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