Obviously the overall product is way down and almost unwatchable cause of weak story lines and everything else. However the actual in ring product is okay. Reading your retro rants for as good as the product was in terms of character development and storylines in the 1997-1999 era, the actual in ring product outside of Shawn and some Austin brawls was weak.
So my question is what was the best year for in ring performance (wwf/wwe only) from the top down.
Sent from my iPad
So my question is what was the best year for in ring performance (wwf/wwe only) from the top down.
Sent from my iPad
Man, how do people do lengthy e-mails from their iPad, anyway? Is it just that you kids today have adjusted to a touchscreen keyboard? Because as much as I love my tablet, I would go insane trying to do any kind of typing without the tactile feedback of real keys. But then if I was up to me I'd use the full size ergonomic keyboard from my desktop all the time, so maybe I'm just weird.
ANYWAY...
I think 2000 was pretty much the consensus best, with Rock and HHH having great matches with everyone, and then the additions of Benoit and Jericho and Kurt Angle taking everyone to another level. Plus just look at all the ****+ matches we were getting that year -- HHH v. Foley, Rock v. HHH, Benoit v. Rock, Jericho v. HHH, Angle v. Rock, Hardyz v. E&C v. Dudleyz...it's pretty unheard of, actually. Plus you had the great tag division and Radicalz spicing up the undercard and it's hard to find a better contender up and down.
In ring performance, I would definitely give it to the year 2000 (the WWF that is), but 2001, even with the Invasion storyline that year, gives it a SERIOUS run for its money.
ReplyDeleteI've gone exclusively from using a laptop to using my iPad at home (I'm 33, if it matters), and the lack of the tactile keyboard is why I almost never post anymore. I've had this thing since it came out, and I'm still getting used to the touchscreen. Really tough for a guy who spends most of his day needing to write stuff, which is why I'm looking at getting a new laptop.
ReplyDelete2000 was a great year, but I'll always be partial to 1997. A lot of great stuff from both of the Big Two (I had lost track of ECW at that point, but from what I remember seeing, it still wasn't horrible). While Wrestlemania and Starcade in 1997 were disappointing, there was a lot of other stuff that made up for it.
Jesus, that took forever typing out. I can't wait til I get to work on Monday so I can type normally on a keyboard.
Blue Tooth Keyboard on the iPad and you can be a typing machime
ReplyDeleteI'd put the 2000 WWE roster as far as workrate against any other fed and year in the history of pro wrestling.
ReplyDelete1997 was amazing. The rise of Austin, heel Shawn/DX, Bret Vs. USA, Foley really getting over, The Rock becoming The Rock. Even the though the gang warz dragged forever at least they had actual mid card feuds the emphasized a important.
ReplyDelete2000 was the best year for wrestling, for sure. Well, unless you were an ECW or WCW fan. But what the WWF were doing there was spectacular. Occasionally there was a dud PPV (like Survivor Series or King Of The Ring) but on the whole their big shows were awesome thanks to to one of the strongest bunch of workers ever. Royal Rumble was terrific that year, and a good way to wipe away the memories of the two lousy previous ones.
ReplyDeleteAgree w/ 2000 followed by 1997.
ReplyDelete2007 and 2008 were both pretty solid too, from what I remember. This was when Undertaker was at his best (against Edge/Batista), Orton Hardy Cena Edge and Batista had all improved substantially in the ring, a less-bulky HHH was working better, and (above all else) Shawn Michaels was working his ass off + getting good matches out of everybody. There was a lot of crap in the midcard at that point, but there were also guys like Punk and Morrison in there.
The other thing about 1997 that rates high for me - I got on television during the Raw from Lake Placid at the end of June. Also, Jim Neidhart threatened to punch me in the face. Would have been the high point of the month for me, had I not graduated from high school the following week.
ReplyDeleteWWF 2000 wins pretty easily. However you want to look at it. Match quality: Triple H when his shit didn't stink, The Rock was great, Jericho, Benoit, Kurt Angle, Eddie, Malenko, the tag division of the Dudleyz, Hardyz, and Edge and Christian, plus some good teams like APA, Too Cool, The Hollys. It wasn't exactly Undertaker's best year in terms of workrate but he brought star power, plus you had other big names like Kane, Show, Austin for the last half of the year.
ReplyDelete2001 is a pretty close second due to the sheer volume of great matches alone, but the Invasion and last half of the year really drops the ball in terms of storylines and angles. But look at the amount of great matches on Free TV and PPV: Benoit-Jericho Ladder match, the Rumble match, Austin vs. Triple H NWO, Angle vs. Rock, the Fatal 4 way at NWO, WrestleMania X7, Angle-Benoit(any number of the matches they had) HHH-Austin vs. Jericho-Benoit, Austin vs. Benoit, TLC III, If you want great matches look no further than 2000-2001. Of course on the SmackDown side of things 2002 was a damn good year as well.
Through all the rambling my point(and yes I do have one) is that 2000 all around what you want from a wrestling product delivered the most compelling, entertaining, and well rounded product.
2000 was easily the best year it just had a perfect mix of everything. Yet despite how awesome it was wrestling history seems to overshadow it greatly by events that happened in shittier years like 1999. 1997 was a fantastic year to be watching from an historical point of view, but taking the rose tinted glasses off it was actually full of a lot of crap wrestling, boring storylines and a paper thin roster between the awesome stuff if you look at the WWF as a whole during that time.
ReplyDeleteFor me personally, as much fun as certain parts of the late 1990s were, I think my overall most favorite time was late 1991 through the summer of 1992.
ReplyDeleteYeah, this is a pretty one sided question as while there's been some good years in WWE, 2000 will always be the general consensus as being the best, but in terms of what my favorite year of WWF and WCW was, it was 1992 as both promotions were kicking ass in the workrate department in that year.
ReplyDeleteI don't see the point of even getting an iPad. They cost more than a laptop and can do less. You can't even load most videos on the Internet on an iOS device. Then, there's the whole lack of a keyboard and its inability to run more than 1 app at a time. They're fine for a phone, but there's no way I'd get an iPad because it just isn't priced reasonably for what it offers. I'm glad I got a Windows 7 laptop because Microsoft apparently thinks copying iOS is the right way to go. It isn't because Apple and Google are the established leaders in the cell phone market and devices that run a cell phone OS will never be a substitute for a real computer.
ReplyDeleteOn the main subject, 2000 was definitely the best year for WWF/E PPVs. They had a better roster in 2002-2003, but put on better cards in 2000. Probably the best 12-month period of PPVs WWF/E ever put on was from Backlash 2000 to Wrestlemania X-7, although the Rumble and Backlash were also very good in 2000. The best year for JCP/WCW was definitely 1989 (Flair/Steamboat, Flair/Funk, Sting/Muta, etc.). 1992 was also a pretty good year for WCW PPVs. I doubt WCW could top those shows after Hogan arrived and all the old guys from the 1980s took over the top spots, although I haven't seen the later WCW shows yet. TNA's best year for PPV is probably 2012. Their shows are said to be really good in 2005-2006, but that was also the period when Double J hogged the spotlight at the top. This year, Genesis and Victory Road were OK, Lockdown was disappointing and had a really bad crowd and No Surrender was a weak show. The rest of the PPVs were consistently good or great.
In terms of the best year for wrestling PPVs in general, 1992 is probably the clear winner. I've only seen some of the WWF PPV matches from that year, but it looks like it was probably WWF's best year up to that point and WCW was also good that year. 2000 may have been a good year for WWF PPVs, but WCW and ECW probably weren't very good that year. I haven't seen 2000 WCW or 2000 ECW PPVs, but the consensus seems to be that 2000 was a very bad year for both those companies. 1999 was probably the worst year for wrestling PPVs, but a case could probably be made for 1995 or 1993 as well. Its probably no coincidence that Wrestlemania 9, 11 and 15 are probably the consensus worst 3 Wrestlemanias.
Quite interestingly, WCW in 2000 was the exact opposite in terms of in-ring workrate. In fact, I would put 2000 WCW up there with 1993 WCW, 2011 TNA and CZW in any year for being the all-time worst years of in-ring action.
ReplyDelete2001 had some awesome matches, but the stink of the Austin turn and Invasion angle, you just want to keep the thought to yourself sometimes.
ReplyDeleteI'll agree that 9, 11 & 15 are the consensus for worst Wrestlemanias, but that assessment seems off to me. I think 11 is actually a very good show. The tag-title match is really fun, LT-Bigelow match is really fun, Yoko's return was really cool, Piper's appearance was a nice surprise, Shawn's performance was one of his first where he really elevated his game to a main event level, & it's great to see Bret (at the peak of his popularity) wrapping up a 9 month angle with an exclamation point (beating a guy with his own finisher, the one that had sidelined Bret for six weeks 3 months before).
ReplyDelete2, 9 & 16 are the ones that are a chore for me to sit through. To each their own, but those three are at the bottom of my list.
No one is pimping 2002? Smackdown 6?
ReplyDeleteI may be in the minority, but I definitely think WM27 was the worst WM ever.
ReplyDelete2001 was a fantastic year as far as the in-ring product, maybe even better than 2000 - too bad it was overshadowed by the terrible "inVasion" storyline. The "Two Man Power-Trip" was pretty bad, as well.
ReplyDeleteI'm with "MrMaye", 2001 may have had even better matches than 2000 - the story-lines sucked, but the actual wrestling was phenomenal.
ReplyDeleteIt is kind of a toss-up, though. How do you compare, say, the Rock/Trips and Austin/Angle feuds? Both provided fantastic matches, but do you prefer the star-power involved in a feud between the 2nd and 3rd biggest stars of era, or the "star-making" factor of a feud between the #1 guy and a respected upper-carder? Plus, Austin was out during most of 2000, and had a few bad matches at the end of it, while Rock and Trips were lighting the ring on fire every night; conversely, Rock and Trips were out during most of 2001, while Austin was now having some of the best matches of his entire career.
What about the Hardys/Dudleys/E&C feud? What they were doing in 2000 was revolutionary, yet somewhat clunky, in terms of taking a long time to set-up their spots; by 2001, they had perfected the formula, the matches were faster-paced, but it began to feel like a replay.
Angle, Benoit, and Jericho were the stars of the mid-card in 2000, but were moved into/closer to the main-event in 2001; in their place, Edge and Eddie were given more time to shine on their own, and RVD debuted.
It's amazing to think just how talented and packed the roster was during the time, and it makes me wonder if we could have something similar today. Imagine if Punk and Bryan were allowed to go all-out every night; I'm not saying that either will be the next "Hogan" or "Austin" in terms of star-power, but there's no reason that they couldn't be this generation's "Bret" and "Shawn". What about guys like Justin Gabriel, Tyson Kidd, and The Usos? All four are very talented, and could be fantastic additions to the mid-card if they were actually given a chance. What if Sheamus weren't a smiling goober? Could he be the next big no-nonsense ass-kicker?
Yeah looking back 2000 was awsome, and not because I am a known Triple H mark, (well yeah sorta.) You had Hunter at his best, Foley having those great matches with HHH at the beginning of the year and then having so much fun as the comissioner. Angle basically rose, and rose, and rose. Jericho did Jericho things, (mostly insulting Stephanie) Rikishi danced, Austin came back, the Under,(biker)taker called Vince a "stank ass," The Hardy's, Dudley's and E/C broke new ground with TLC, and The Rock was the star who tied it all together....Something else happened too...I forget....oh yeah Chris and Eddie showed up at ringside which was just spectacular. (And they had great matches for the rest of the year which was also spectacular)
ReplyDeleteVery good pick.
ReplyDeleteWorst main event not involving a non-wrestler for sure
ReplyDeletePutting CZW in their is an insult to WCW '93 and 2011 TNA
ReplyDeleteThose of us who type long messages on our iPads are probably using a bluetooth keyboard, which makes it way easier to type with the exact same finger movements as we use on a real computer.
ReplyDeleteYeah that's what holds it back. Stupidity, and the storylines weren't as good. But on Free TV? Nearly every week you had a ***+ match. And there was a stretch of 2 weeks in May where Benoit was involved in a couple ****+ matches. He had the 2/3 falls match with Angle at Judgment Day(Haven't seen it in a while but I remember thinking it was about ****) later on in the same night he wins Tag Team Turmoil with Jericho including a good finish against E&C. The next night he's in the classic Tag match with Jericho against the Two Man Power Trip(***** from me) Then on SmackDown he's in TLC III another match I'd put near the ***** range. Then the NEXT week on Raw he has a good match against Stone Cold and on SmackDown they have the classic in Edmonton. That two week run alone is a shit ton of quality wrestling.
ReplyDelete