When I was reading the comments in the RAW open thread, I was really glad a lot of the comments brought this up. I was hoping you would comment on this during your RAW review but you didn't(maybe Hulu edited it out?) but something from RAW really bothered me: Why is the Big Show using Daniel Bryan's YES chant? Daniel Bryan has nothing to do with that Authority storyline anymore. At least when Show did it before, Bryan was usually around and it sort of made sense. I mean at what point does every top babyface start doing the YES chant for a cheap pop? Because I guarantee you if Triple H came up with a chant as over as YES, NO ONE would EVER be allowed to use it. No one used Rock's phrases(other than Foley for comedic purposes) and no one used Austin's(unless they were mocking him). I mean do you think Bryan is at least a little annoyed that Big Show not only took his position at the top of the card but is now stealing his catchphrase?So to summarize, Bryan wins the title, gets screwed out of the title numerous times, gets jumped by the Authority almost every week, never really gets his revenge and now is in that 'parallel universe' along with CM Punk in a completely different feud. Meanwhile Big Show is now in Bryan's spot and is using Bryan's catchphrase to get, in my opinion, a cheap babyface reaction.Any thoughts?
Let's be brutally honest here: if Daniel Bryan drew money like the Rock or Steve Austin, this wouldn't be an issue.
No one draws money like Austin or the Rock. Why not give EVERYONE's gimmick to the Big Show? He'll be the most charismatic character ever!!!!
ReplyDeleteIf this includes Undertaker's gimmick of going away for a year at a time then I'm all for it.
ReplyDeleteHigh five on that one.
ReplyDeleteI think this really relates to someting that has been discussed before - that the focus is shifting from being on individual wrestlers (gasp...sorry, superstars) to the WWE brand. Which means that "YES" is not a Daniel Bryan chant, but a WWE chant that they can put on whatever t-shirt they want and give to whomever they want, because it doesn't belong to BRyan, it belonges to the E.
ReplyDeleteI hate it but that's what's happening. I guess it comes with the territory of scripted promos and generic guys with no personality.
This. It's unfortunate but true.
ReplyDeleteBut at least I can enjoy Emma's silly-ass arm dance on NXT and not worry that they're going to give it to Paige.
It's so dumb though. It'd be like if Parks and Rec decided, "Hey what if we made Ron Swanson the guy who says everyone's first and last name instead of Chris Traeger. Who will notice?"
ReplyDeleteYeah, I've never understood the argument that "Well, if X drew like X, then he wouldn't be in the spot he's in."
ReplyDeleteIt's an outrageously short-sighted argument when you consider that Austin and Rock were put into a position to draw, which is more than can be said for any non-Cena, non-Attitude Era star in the past several months. Maybe Bryan would have drawn if the focus hadn't been instead on Big Show, HHH, and how the title doesn't actually matter nor do any of these main events since Bryan and Orton aren't stars, and there's no one in the back HHH would dirty his hands with.
Bryan/Orton was never going to draw like Austin/Rock, but it might have drawn a whole hell of a lot better if HHH had taken a page out of Vince's playbook and actually shown ass at some point during the feud. Or maybe let it be more about Bryan/Orton than about how Edge, Jericho and RVD were never the guy.
Better start changing Daniel Bryan's merch then. Maybe he can start a "Maybe" chant.
ReplyDeleteWWE Creative thinks "Did I do that?" should have been Eddie Winslow's catchphrase.
ReplyDeleteThis is gonna be REALLY unpopular but the YES chant was always overrated. It's a one word chant that got over simply by the force of the likeability of Bryan. It wasnt anythjng groundbreaking. It's not "that's the bottom line..", "if ya smellllll...", "whatta gonna do brother...", etc.
ReplyDeleteIt was a nice little nuance that helped Bryan get over and got the crowd involved, but Big Show using it isn't gonna hurt or help Bryan either way in the long run.
The bigger issue is that by WWE not protecting it for Bryan, it tells us what they think if his drawing potential.
My original hope was that this would be the first step of him dropping it, shedding the underdog role, and just becoming an asskicker. A la, Kurt angle dropping the 3 I schtick.
In some ways, the YES chant has grown beyond Bryan, as now it's pretty much a chant you'll hear in any wrestling company, not unlike the WHAT chants of old (and please let them remain "of old").
ReplyDeleteBut in other ways, I think the YES chant will always be Bryan's, in the sense that people can't see him and not think YES. Fans rebelled when they tried to give the YES chants to Sheamus, and I could see them quickly tiring of it with Show, even if they have Bryan stop doing the chant altogether ("Well goddamnit, if they aren't going to let us give it to anyone else, we're killing this chant right here and now!"). The YES chant is Bryan's the way "If ya smellll" was Rock's and "And that's the bottom line" was Stone Cold's.
This, to me, is the evidence of Daniel Bryan's greatness. It was just people responding to the natural quirks in his personality and it blew up to something of a mainstream phenomenon (I see Daniel Bryan "YES!" memes on non-wrestling message boards a lot... Interestingly I also see the Dean Ambrose "Nnnnnope." animated GIF a lot.) I see him as the type of guy who can get over 100 different ways, because he understands the act of getting over.
ReplyDeleteI'm looking forward to Show breaking out the Cobra before the Knockout Punch.
ReplyDeleteI completely agree. That's why I don't think this is really gonna hurt him in the big picture. Think about how fucking stupid a "YES" chant is. It's retarded, but he still managed to turn it into a massively over thing.
ReplyDelete"Let's be brutally honest here: if Daniel Bryan drew money like the Rock or Steve Austin, this wouldn't be an issue."
ReplyDeleteDamn, Scott. I'm pretty sure Rock and Austin didn't have their first WWE title runs sabotaged the way Bryan has, and neither of them "drew money" immediately. It was built up over time. Additionally, as has been discussed, the WWE isn't really set up for any one person to be a "draw" anymore. In fact, it seems like they go out of their way to keep it from happening...Cena is the exception.
You make a decent point, but the comparisons aren't entirely fair.
You're right, it wouldn't be an issue, because the writer that suggested it would have been fired on the spot, and Show would have been buried for doing it. Even if it was Vince's idea in the first place.
ReplyDeleteYou can enjoy it. I don't.
ReplyDeleteThey did that already. It really don't work as well as you'd think it would
ReplyDeleteYou and I are on the same page, sir.
ReplyDeleteWasn't the first appearance of "YES!" when Bryan cashed in MITB on Big Show? In kayfabe, maybe this is his revenge.
ReplyDeleteThe wwe brand is the draw, Cena is the walking avatar/face of the brand. WWE won't let someone else get close to that point, just to protect the brand. It sucks but it's the way it is.
ReplyDeleteEmma is definitely one of the more divisive characters on NXT. You either love her or you don't, and I'm not sure if there's any middle ground on it. Not like anyone is wrong for having their opinion. I find her adorable, but I can easily see how she would grate on people.
ReplyDeleteLet's be brutally honest: Big Show has been the top face in the feud for like 2 months now.
ReplyDeleteYeah, but my argument is that this is a retarded mindset.
ReplyDeleteWhy on EARTH would you only want ONE guy at that level when you could have multiple guys? If they'd really pulled the trigger with Punk and not gotten him involved with HHH, if they'd really pulled the trigger on Bryan and not gotten him involved with HHH, etc., they might not be in such dire straits every time Cena goes down. If the Attitude Era had just been one guy the way the PG Era has been, they'd have been fucked. You can have a TOP "guy," but you shouldn't just have ONE "guy."
Let's be brutally honest, the way Survivor Series is shaping up, it's going to do 200K buys, so I'm glad he's the top face in their eyes.
ReplyDeleteI read that Big Show's position on the card is a combination of three things: he's huge (Vince apparently wants to go back to featuring big guys more prominently), he's one of HHH's closest friends backstage, and he can cry on cue (which they apparently love).
ReplyDeleteYet the only way the "WHY BIG SHOW, of all people?" thing makes sense is if he's just a placeholder for the real feud to come, and that they figured it'd be better to sacrifice an established guy at the Altar of the H than to kill an up-and-comer. But believing WWE would ever have that mindset is so ludicrous to me that I might as well add a few whips and handcuffs to the scenario, get it bound in a cheap paperback cover, and sell the glorified fan fiction as a cheap, tawdry series of novels, 50 Shades style.
I think their mindset is that the brand and therefor Cena have to be protected above all else. Hence why they actively try and cool guys off just to keep the gap between Cena and everyone else large. Hell, they got the Rock back after 7 years and they actively try to take some of the shine off him to bring him to Cenas level.
ReplyDeleteTheir mindset is "let's have as little turnover or risk in the core tv product so all the other revenue streams can leech money of it."
I'm not condoning it because they could do a better job protecting Cena and elevating other guys. They probably just believe that if something happened to Cena, they could plug anyone into that role (Sheamus, Punk, Reigns, etc.), build him up for 6 months, and not miss a beat.
the YES chant is no longer the sole property of dbry, unfortunately. it's long since been popping up in roh and tna
ReplyDeleteI think you hit it...He's been around long enough to not be hurt by being a sacrificial lamb in this HHH thing. I'm sure HHH/Orton will go over him strong by the rumble, hence giving them a little extra heel heat, and position them strongly for the eventual payoff feud.
ReplyDeleteLet's be brutally honest, I shouldn't have got that Big Gulp before driving to work this morning and getting stuck in a traffic jam. But the bright side is the cup didn't go to waste.
ReplyDeleteOh, I didn't mean to imply you were condoning it. And your argument is spot-on as far as their mindset is concerned. Or, at least, what available evidence suggests is their mindset.
ReplyDeleteI just hate all this corporate nonsense, from brand-speak to the reduced emphasis on building up younger talent. They essentially skipped over the entire Matt Hardy/Shelton/MVP/Kennedy/Carlito generation, and it looks like they're well on their way to skipping over the Dolph/Kofi/Barrett generation of guys too, for want of anything to really do with them, since their spots are going to the Kanes and Shows of the world. And that's obnoxious at best, and sad at worst.
Well, I guess Daniel Bryan should be free to use the pedigree as a transition move since Triple H never drew like Austin or Rock either.
ReplyDeleteAh, that's a pretty bullshit response SK. I mean, has the book already been closed on whether or not Daniel Bryan is a draw? Summerslam was the first main event match he'd ever been in after spending two years as a midcarder and tag guy. And then he got 3 months of being sabotoged while the TITLE WAS VACANT. Christ, this past few months is more a referendum on whether Abeyance is a draw moreso than Daniel Bryan.
ReplyDeleteI mean, I said this in other threads, but Stone COld Steve Austin utterly BOMBED in his first chance at being a draw. Wrestlemania 13— for which Austin vs Bret was by far the match that had the most hype going into the event, and was positioned as the main draw— was the lowest bought Mania of all-time. And that's a YEAR after the Austin 3:16 speech, and after Austin winning a Royal Rumble. So did that mean Austin wasn't a draw? No, it meant he was still rising up into a position where he eventually would become a draw. They didn't let Austin's COLOSSAL FAILURE at Mania 13 decide his future. Vince knew he had something with Austin and stuck with his push and it paid off.
And as for Rock, the dude was never put in a position where he had to be the sole draw until after he was already a main guy who had main evented Mania. He got to grow into the role while Austin was drawing the money on top. So again, it's a total bullshit comparison.
Not saying Bryan is gonna be the next Austin or Rock (spoiler alert: he won't! Second spoiler alert: probably nobody will!) but to judge whether he can or can't be a draw based on Summerslam and the bullshit PPVs that followed just makes no sense.
Oh, and also, fuck Big Show for stealing the Yes chants. As a 20 year veteran he should absolutely be embarrassed for going along with taking someone else's stuff. If he hasn't been able to get over in all these years on his own with all the chances he's had, then maybe he should just move on.
If DBry stops using it and stops wearing the shirt they figure they can transition it to Show.
ReplyDeleteI will be waiting to see if they have a Big Show "Yes!" shirt on sale soon.
Haven't seen enough of her to know if I like the character or not. I just don't like the silly dance.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I do find Bayley to be *incredibly* adorable and attractive.
So WHAT! no longer belongs to Austin either?
ReplyDeleteBut that's the nature of a catch phrase: It's not forced and usually come out of nowhere. I remember when Bischoff tried to get "Bite Me" over as an now catchphrase and it went nowhere. But Ron Simmons comes out, says "DAMN!" and it takes off.
ReplyDeleteObnoxious is a good word for it. Antagonistic is how I describe it. They know they're gonna get our money, soooooo fuck fans.
ReplyDeleteIt's the mid card that suffers the most IMO. Instead of the days of building up a strong midcard to eventually elevate, it's just a cluster fuck of shit.
next, one idea that wwe does steal was wcw is a feud over the chant, a la big vs. booker t over the T
ReplyDeleteDone that a time or two.
ReplyDeletethat actually crossed my mind when i made my post, and my question is this:
ReplyDeletehas WHAT?! infiltrated non-wwe events? i honestly can't recall
There's a difference between that and another wrestler in the same company using it.
ReplyDeleteYeah but there's a difference between fans just randomly chanting Yes at something they like at a random event, AND a wrestler actively leading the fans ina Yes chant.
ReplyDeleteBig SHow was actively leading the chant, and therefore knowingly trying to take the gimmick. No other wrestler in any company has done that, just him.
And I know he was directed to do that, but honestly it's still an asshole thing to do. Come up with your own stuff, you've certainly had a long enough time (20 fucking years of this fat lug!) to do so.
Bayley is great, and from the most recent NXT, it looks like they're going to do the old Rick Steiner/Varsity Club gimmick with her and Poor Man's LayCool. Could be a fun time.
ReplyDeleteWe're saying pretty much the same thing; you just went into much more detail. Well done.
ReplyDeleteYes. There was an article on how people were being disrespectful when they chanted "WHAT?!?!" during the National Anthem.
ReplyDeleteI've done that with gatorade bottles a few times. It always sucks when you start getting to the top and have to shut down mid stream.
ReplyDeleteOr Chyna & Billy Gunn vs Road Dogg & Xpac over the royalties to DX.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I hate what they've done to the midcard. Say what you will about Vince Russo, but he was ONE MAN who still found a way to get a storyline for everyone. But now they have an entire fucking team, and they don't have anything for guys like Dolph or Kofi. They just send them out there to have matches. No angles, no storylines, no programs, no direction. They just go out there and wrestle. And hey, they're good wrestlers, but a midcard needs more than just a bunch of aimless matches.
ReplyDeleteI might have to start watching consistently. I love me a girl with a nice, natural rack who wears little to no makeup.
ReplyDeleteWouldn't take much, either. Just have a midcard heel do something with which a midcard face takes exception; face calls out heel; match.
ReplyDeleteNo Scott, if he was 6 inches taller this wouldn't be a problem.
ReplyDeleteLet's be brutally honest here: the WWE is allergic to my money.
ReplyDeleteIf they want their top guys to be able to cry on cue, why don't they just start handing out copies of Hitman for them to read in the gorilla position?
ReplyDeleteDel Rio tried stealing it when he was trying to get over as a babyface. It was kinda sad to watch.
ReplyDeleteI love this post. I will be referring to it every time there is a Daniel Bryan discussion.
ReplyDelete"Let's be brutally honest here..." Scott's new catchpharase has been stolen by almost everyone on BoD.
ReplyDeleteLOL, um, Austin was drawing money pretty close to when he won the title. You cannot tell me Austin and the Rock are somehow equivalent to Bryan. He is not in their class nor ever will be.
ReplyDeleteIt's an easy argument. If Bryan was that great, we wouldn't have this going on. I know it is simplistic and it's a difficult pill to swallow for a lot of this board but it is true.
ReplyDeleteLet's keep being honest. A lot of the people complaining about Bryan no longer being in the main event refused to pay for the PPVs when he was in the main event. I apologize if you did actually buy them instead of pirating, but there are others.
ReplyDelete