One of my favorite topics -- why Last Action Hero was such an underrated and fascinating trainwreck of a failure -- explored by the AVClub. I have a ridiculous love-hate relationship with this movie that I'm pretty sure I've talked about before, in that I know how ridiculous and terrible it is most of the way, but it's just such a COOL concept and I'm unable to look away. Luckily Shane Black went on to make an more unambiguously awesome trainwreck with Kiss Kiss Bang Bang, much in the same cliche-busting fourth-wall-wrecking vein. But with Robert Downey instead of Arnold.
This film needed to be rated R...that would've fixed a lot of it...
ReplyDeleteWell, in alternate universe, you have to calculate how EVERY LITTLE CHANGE CHANGES ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING.
ReplyDelete...And I've done that.
- The Undertaker clones himself, becomes World Tag Team Champion.
- Savio Vega becomes longest-running WWF Champion, with 21 years undefeated.
- Droz breaks said streak; earns WWF billions of dollars.
Stephanie McMahom goes through her impressionable teem years without a father figure...starts dancing on a pole and eventually gets into porn.
ReplyDeleteThe wrestling stuff is honestly the most boring conversation here to me most of the time (outside the live threads) because it is the same shit over and over again, everyone knows where everyone else stands, and cultstatus stands on the opposite side of that. If this site were just wrestling I would have asked for the check a long time ago.
ReplyDeleteI dont disagree. I like the wrestling part, but usually it just provides the backdrop for the really entertaining/fun stuff.
ReplyDeleteI mostly agree. The goofing around is fun.
ReplyDeleteThe BOD is a community centered around wrestling. But we're not curing cancer here, we can goof a bit. We can talk about other stuff too.
one of the baddest fucking movie villains ever
ReplyDeleteShouldn't you be tapping married trim?
ReplyDeleteStill better than having her shriek on my TV.
ReplyDeleteKiss Kiss Bang Bang is one of the greatest things ever committed to film.
ReplyDeleteThe Last Action Hero is not, but it's definitely enjoyable. It's one of those films where, if I viewed the trailer first, I would be completely satisfied with the finished product.
Macho Man becomes her "father figure" in this scenario.
ReplyDeleteIf Vince is found guilty? Nails gets his revenge while Bossman makes sure Vince serves HARRRRRD justice.
ReplyDeleteOooooooh yeaaaah, can ya dig it... and by it, I mean the madness.... OOOOOH yeah.....
ReplyDeleteSavage really did have a voice for porn commentary
I love the movie. I just love how they use all the action movie cliches while also pointing out their flaws. Pretty much the same thing Edgar Wright did with Shaun of the Dead and Hot Fuzz (not that Last Action Hero is on the same level as those).
ReplyDeleteDroz breaks the streak? HE'S GOOONNA PUUUUKE
ReplyDeleteThere were many wild cards, dark horses, and dependent variables to factor into this...and you considered them all! Great work. I originally had Kwang as the champion in this equation, but I double checked my work and realized the gimmick change to Savio still happens.
ReplyDeleteI think we can shut this thread down for the remainder, duck out for some delicious iced tea, and call it a day.
I think it would have been a mass talent exodus followed by Turner slowly starting and winning the war. Remember, those weren't exactly profitable times for Vinnie and Co. anyhow.
ReplyDeleteSo you think it would be a Ted Turner wrestling world we would be living in 2013?
ReplyDeleteI remember there was one summer in my youth when HBO played Last Action Hero literally every day and I loved it each time. Much like a different summer that was taken over by watching The Sandlot each day.
ReplyDeleteIn that other scenerio she would certainly be shrieking on mine.
ReplyDeleteActually, considering how porn operates, maybe Chyna becomes her father figure
ReplyDelete"What if Vince McMahon is found gulity in 1994?"
ReplyDeleteWould've been like UFC in the dark ages. Pro wrestling would've disappeared for a while. Stigma would've been way too bad.
Mornin'.
ReplyDeleteVince goes to jail. Kayfabe remains on TV. Jim Ross becomes the primary announcer ( I think he still had a job then, am I correct?). Linda trims the fat to cover for the loss due to lawyer bills, so some of the talent goes to WCW. The heavy players at the time, namely The Kliq, Bret Hart, Lex Luger stay onboard. Turner smells blood, and the Monday Night Wars KILL the WWF, moreso than in reality. Linda isn't really hands on with the talent end of things, and leaves guys like Bill Watts and JJ Dillon running the talent. The in-ring product is pretty good, the gimmicks are kept to a minimum, and the WWF becomes an internet darling like ECW was in the early days. They barely stay afloat, overseas tours are cut out due to budgetary constraints. Randy Savage stays on because he sympathizes, and eventually gets inducted into the Hall of Fame.
No. That is his misogynistic evil twin ParalLEX1978. The did the "Twin Magic" switch last night.
ReplyDeleteDont agree with everything but good points. Well said
ReplyDeleteLinda never runs for US Senate twice due to her husband being an ex-felon (and possibly because they are not worth several hundred million dollars).
ReplyDeleteSo maybe Russo should book porn then.
ReplyDelete:: THEY ARE ON TO ME :: HOLY SHIT! Look over there its Brooke's ass!
ReplyDelete:: Flees the scene ::
Magic Ticket my ass Mcbain
ReplyDeleteHow can they keep JR if they are going to trim the fat?!?!?
ReplyDelete(JR is portly)
So Yoko doesnt make the cut?
ReplyDeleteMaybe she would be fine if she wasn't on whatever is making her seem more mannish the older she gets. I used to think she was cute.
ReplyDeleteIf he hadn't found Jesus (the make believe guy, not the guy that mowes my lawn) I could seriously see him doing that
ReplyDeleteGotcha.
ReplyDeleteI think she has had another round of implants as well... probably why she has to be so muscular... to carry around those things all the time must be hell on your back.
ReplyDelete:: shoots fleeing 'lax in da back ::
ReplyDeleteShould've gone with the ice cream distraction.
The only thing Yoko ever cut was in line... at the buffet!
ReplyDeleteHHH's baby batter is high in protein...and HGH.
ReplyDeleteI know im in the minoriry but def think shes sexy.
ReplyDeleteWell at least 'lEx is ok...
ReplyDeleteHow the fuck did I end up the BoD schizophrenic?
ReplyDeleteThe only reason we are not curing cancer is because everyone refuses to wear pink while posting on the BoD!
ReplyDeleteActually I was distracted by this:
ReplyDeletehttp://i.imgur.com/W8oEDaG.gif
Yeah...I went back and read the stuff. I think they still do what Vince did in the 90's and that was put a focus on the smaller guys, cut the big guys like Luger and anyone that might have the smell of steroids on them. Plus, Luger might be a little too expensive to keep, so he goes back to WCW earlier than he did. I still think the in-ring is pretty good.
ReplyDeleteNo, it's because paralLEX1978 is so misogynistic he CAUSES breast cancer in women.
ReplyDeleteIt's that Captain Planet/Captain Pollution
If Tub Girl makes you ill, never watch a Serbian Film.
ReplyDeleteNothing about Kiss Kiss Bang Bang is a train wreck. That film is a fucking masterpiece.
ReplyDeleteI agree on the ring work. Stays top level. It interests me if the top guys all leave to go to turner. I think wwf survives, barely in the end
ReplyDeleteYears of hard work.
ReplyDeleteWell, duh. He's more fun, and I like his avatar better.
ReplyDeleteNever have quite given in to referring to spew as "baby batter." Make me picture guys spunking onto a cookie sheet, popping it into the oven, and ending up with offspring 45 mins later.
ReplyDeleteI think her voice bugs me more than anything, and is best illustrated by the tone she achieved while repeatedly slapping Show and asking if he was going to cry.
ReplyDeleteCharles Dance can do no wrong and is the guy currently carrying Game of Thrones on his back.
ReplyDeleteShe has her fans. I ain't among them.
ReplyDeleteIt was fucking awful
ReplyDeleteA 24 year old Shane becomes the figure head under the guidance of JR and Linda.
ReplyDeleteI'd shoot her in the back too. Just....differently.
ReplyDeleteId go "jelly donut" style
ReplyDeleteI was just coming in to say the same thing.
ReplyDeleteIt's also probably why I enjoyed Ironman 3 as much as I did. It almost felt like the KKBB's cousin.
I just assumed he WAS breast cancer in blog form.
ReplyDeleteYou assume that I'm not wearing pink..?
ReplyDeletePunk: "I was wearing pink last night because I had Lita on my di-"
ReplyDelete***PLEASE STAND BY***
I loved Guy Pearce in it but imagine if Val Kilmer played the villain. Suddenly it is the greatest movie ever made.
ReplyDeleteI don't think I'm certain about what exactly that means.
ReplyDeleteBut, I am certain that I'm comfortable with that.
Maria... my mighty heart is breaking...
ReplyDeleteCasting my vote for the brilliance that is KKBB. To me, that movie WAS Downey's comeback. To hell with Iron Man.
ReplyDeleteWow, that's really quite something.
ReplyDeleteI've never caused anything more than nausea and a general sense of revulsion.
Absolutely Not! He would book himself to star in every scene, with horrible storylines, and they would all be set in New York
ReplyDeleteI know, right! If every single one us bought a WWE "Rise Above" T-shirt, then $5.00 would get donated to cancer research!
ReplyDeleteOr 3 guys, 1 hammer, which is a literal snuff film from spree killers the Dnepropetrovsk Maniacs. Wiki that and lose whatever faith in humanity you had left.
ReplyDeleteI always thought this guy also did a good summary of why the movie is better than most give it credit for. Also fun to read someone else trying to defend Land of the Lost, too:
ReplyDeletehttp://moviebuzzers.com/editorial/movies-deserve-awful-reputation
Well you were the one that said we weren't curing cancer and that is the singular way to cure cancer so yes I assumed so!
ReplyDeleteWe'd be raising awareness!
ReplyDeleteWe helped you up your game!
ReplyDeleteYea, fucking terrible. I remember hearing about the case and how how apparently a website offered 40 snuff films. Apparently this was their way to get rich, bc they really couldnt pinpoint a motive? I dont remember all the details
ReplyDeleteWWF would have struggled for a little while but ultimately been ok.
ReplyDeleteNow...to Richie Incognito I say...fattyfatty fat fat, fattyfatty fat fat.
Discuss.
Something tells me they wanted Kilmer, but he was too fat.
ReplyDeleteIf Vince had been convicted, I think there would have been a very real possibility that the WWF loses their show on USA, who wants to cut all ties to the product, leaving them at best in syndication.
ReplyDeleteThe WWF goes regional (back to the Northeast) to cut costs while Vince is in prison and, since the guys at Turner proved time and again they had their heads up their asses, they fail to full take advantage of the situation and the territory system comes back into play in some form or another. WCW stays as the main national promotion.
PWI revokes World title status from the WWF leaving the WCW title as the main belt in wrestling.
Lawler sees an opening and expands the Memphis territory to the entire south and mid-west, giving the USWA credibility on a much larger scale.
Shane and Stephanie go to college and get honest jobs.
The more I read hear/read about it, im convinced he was encouraged to "toughen martin up" by someone in upper management. Dont know if it goes as high as the GM, but the GM is the same guy who was asking Dez Bryant riduclious questions at the predraft.
ReplyDeleteEither way, I hope Martin sues the Dolphins and Incognito never gets another nfl paycheck
I agree that some of the talent jumps ship and ends up in WCW. WWF probably loses TV and I bet the networks wouldn't touch them for a while. The sidebar question to all this is: if Vince is convicted, what is the ripple effect on WCW? Do the TV networks bail on pro-wrestling entirely? WCW didn't exist in a vacuum and I wonder what effects Vince's arrest would have had in Atlanta. Once all the WWF roid monsters appear in WCW, do the feds go after Turner's company next?
ReplyDeleteInteresting take on the higher ups encouraging him to do it. I agree that Incognito went way over the line, (above all he was being a shitty teammate) but at the same time I think Martin is a bit of a wuss for straight up quitting the team.
ReplyDeleteThe 90's were such a ....weird time for Arnold. Last Action Hero...Junior...Jingle All the Way. Let me revise that by saing the MID-90's. Even his turn as Mr. Freeze in Batman & Robin. I'm not as sold on LAH and it's alleged good points.
ReplyDeleteBut then again, I'm a guy who walked out on Pulp Fiction the first time because I couldn't follow the narrative. Watching it a second time, I got it.
Im sure there is alot more to come out. I say the management thing bc apparently he was "different" and didnt have that nfl killer mentality. His parents both went to harvard, he went to Stanford, and was a second round pick. I can see tge higher ups saying "lets this try and mentally toughen him up a little."
ReplyDeleteSo, wait....Richie Incognito is a real guy?? I don't watch football, so I could care less about this, but I've heard about this and I was like...is Richie Incognito someone's anonymous Twitter handle?
ReplyDeleteDon't know about a website but the video was leaked during the trial. I've never seen it but read the synopsis on the urban dictionary.
ReplyDeleteReal guy
ReplyDeleteYeah I thought Martin shouldn't have quit the team but I hope Incognito never comes back to the NFL. He's a complete prick.
ReplyDeleteWas his dad Guy Incognito?
ReplyDeleteI present to you Exhibit A: in both English and I assume Spanish, I dunno.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KVHURoOZiY
I've got to side with incognito because the other guy is being such a-pussy. How can someone that gigantic be such a cry baby? Oh no, they won't eat lunch with me....oh no he left me a mean voice mail...hard for me to feel bad for a guy that ran off to his mom and dad.
ReplyDeleteWithout Vince I think the wwe goes under before 95 and wcw vanishes during the AOL merger and we live in a world with small fractured nwa territories
ReplyDeleteWasn't the plan for Jerry Jarrett to take over? If that was indeed the case, we would've seen Jeff Jarrett, 19 time WWF champion.
ReplyDeleteShane kind of did that anyway.
ReplyDeleteIt was more the racial slurs and extortion for Vegas money, then the lunch thing. Like I said though I think Martin was being a wuss for quitting.
ReplyDeleteStanford guys seem to be doing well in the NFL these days. No point to me made just thought it was worth mentioning.
ReplyDeleteIf you call a gigantic man a half-a-nigger over the phone, and he abandons his team, forcing other guys to do his work for him so he can run off to his mom and dad because his feelings were hurt that seems kind of pathetic. I'm not supporting what Richie ingognito did (and I remember those back to back penalties and him screaming in spagnola's face) nor do I doubt he's a piece of shit, but this other guys actions are kind of enraging to me.
ReplyDeleteI've read the money thing was a yearly tradition where all the rookies pay for the Vegas trip. I feel like he should have either just fucking gone to vegas or been a man and said no you can't have my money.
I enjoy when he casually shoots the closet door and the kid says "Wow how'd you know there'd be a guy in there?' Arnold responds with "Dere's always a guy in dhere"
ReplyDeleteThey have a massive football program and have for years. Going back to the 70's and bill Walsh. Its weird to me that a school with that kind of rep pumps out so many pro athletes (including two sets on NBA twins!)
ReplyDeleteHa, I can relate to both those. Never understood any Last Action Hero hate. The movie is what it is.
ReplyDeleteWho's to say he didn't try to address it internally first and nothing was done? The whole story hasn't come out yet, but the more that comes out, the worse Incognito looks. Would you put up with crap treatment like that at your job?
ReplyDeleteDid a quick net search; I got as far as what they did to a kitten and I was out. People who commit animal cruelty get a special place in hell from me. I don't exactly endorse killing adults, but at least a grown man has an opportunity to defend itself. A kitten? Puppy? Normal dog? Child? Not so much. Ok. Stopping now. Getting really angry and have to function at work.
ReplyDeleteI don't remember much about the movie,not really my cup of tea, but when they killed that guy by using the exploding glass eye it was pretty bad ass.
ReplyDeleteOr just one-time champion....for 19 years
ReplyDeleteI agree that the talent would have moved toward WCW, but I think if they had successfully convicted Vince, the rest of pro-wrestling was probably next. I bet the feds go for Turner too, especially once he's filled his roster with WWF's roided up guys
ReplyDeleteScott should have at least changed the page to pink. He must not care much about sick people, otherwise he could have made a superficial gesture to let people know.
ReplyDeleteI am going to run for Water and Sewer manager (yes that is an elected position here) next time we county elections and hire the marketing person from Susan G. Komen... hopefully she can have WWE and the NFL turn everything brown in support of my campaign
ReplyDeleteA turd floating in a puddle of piss could actual be a good logo for our federal government to adopt so make sure you lock down some trademarks
ReplyDeleteI don't know if the plan was for him to 'take over', but he apparently was hanging around so he could help out in some capacity. Bill Watts was there as well.
ReplyDeleteIf Vince can arrange a good system whereby he can continue to run the company through middlemen from behind bars, then they have a shot at a continued existence. If anyone else has to really take over then they are done for.
ReplyDeleteAnd all of that assumes that they don't lose all of their advertisers, and their TV slots, which I think is pretty likely.
WCW was always going to self destruct, with or without WWE around. So really, I think that if Vince goes to jail then there is a very high likelyhood that wrestling as we know it would not exist at all.
I...just looked up tub girl...I had to know. Why did I do that? Why?
ReplyDeleteI thought that she was cute before she had her tits done.
ReplyDeleteI still think she's pretty ok for her age.
Don't you EVER forget Kindergarten Cop!
ReplyDelete"It costs me a fortune in closet doors!"
ReplyDelete