Monday
Nitro #164
Date:
November 23, 1998
Location:
Van Andel Arena, Grand Rapids, Michigan
Commentators:
Mike Tenay, Tony Schiavone, Larry Zbyszko, Bobby Heenan
Reviewed by Tommy Hall
We're
on the road to Starrcade now with a main event of Kevin Nash
challenging Goldberg for the World Title. The other main story
coming out of last night was Hogan not appearing in the big battle
royal for reasons that weren't explained. Other than that we didn't
get the two big midcard matches we were promised because this is WCW
and giving us angles instead of delivering advertised matches is a
great idea. Let's get to it.
The
announcers talk about the battle royal last night and tell us to tune
in to the Tonight Show on Thursday to see why Hogan wasn't in the
battle royal.
We
get some stills of the battle royal as well.
Lex
Luger vs. Mike Enos
They
circle each other for a bit to start until Luger runs him over with a
shoulder block. A headlock sends Enos to the floor as the announcers
talk about everything other than the match. Back in and Mike drops
him throat first across the top rope and nails a piledriver for two.
We hit the chinlock on Luger followed by a nice powerslam for two
more. Back up and Mike can't hit a superplex, allowing Luger to hit
a top rope clothesline and a superplex of his own. A powerslam sets
up the Rack for the submission from Enos.
Rating:
C-. Enos didn't look all that
bad here and Luger was actually doing more than just the usual for a
change. It's still not all that entertaining but it was better than
a lot of the dull matches with guys like these two on Nitro. I'd
still like the Wolfpack to actually do something of note instead of
just having random matches of no consequence.
Goldberg
shows up in a limo, followed by the Wolfpack in their limo. Konnan
tells Nash that he's next but Goldberg says that's not a safe place
to be. “Just ask your girlfriend.”
Gene
brings out Kidman to talk about the situation last night where Rey
Mysterio helped him win back the Cruiserweight Title. Rey
comes out and Kidman offers him a title shot tonight due to Mysterio
being back to his old style. Wasn't he only away from his old style
for six days and by force? They shake hands and say may the best man
win but here are Eddie and his bodyguard to interrupt. Eddie says
Rey is still a contracted member of the LWO so he needs to put the
shirt back on. Guerrero pulls out a gigantic shirt that Rey is
forced to put on, but he promises to make this right later.
Norman
Smiley vs. Chris Benoit
Benoit
is actually taken down pretty easily and kicked in the back, only to
have him pop up and slap Norman in the face. They hit the mat for a
bit until Benoit takes him into the corner and stomps away, only to
charge into a knee to the ribs in the other corner. Smile does that
spinning slam of his but Benoit comes right back with Rolling
Germans, the Swan Dive and a Crossface for the fast submission. This
was better than expected.
Nitro
Party.
Stills
of Hall vs. Nash which wasn't a match.
Here's
the Wolfpack to celebrate their victory. Luger doesn't like
finishing second in anything but at least it was to another Wolfpack
guy. Nash takes the mic and says he's next and will be the 1 in
190-1. So Heyman stole his big promo from Kevin Nash? The Wolfpack
leaves but Gene follows to ask about Hall. Nash can't trust him
because of what's happened already, which makes sense. Goldberg
comes by and says he'll be the truck that runs Nash over. Nash: “Lay
off the caffeine Bill.” Nice to see Big Kev so serious before his
title shot.
Kanyon
vs. Tokyo Magnum
Before
the match we see Kanyon trying to get Raven to come out with him but
Raven says Kanyon wouldn't understand. Once in the arena, Kanyon
yells at Raven to come out, allowing Tokyo to grab a rollup for two.
A bulldog gets the same but Kanyon snaps off a Russian legsweep to
take over. Tokyo gets two each off a sunset flip and small package,
but a hiptoss is countered into the Flatliner to give Kanyon a fast
pin.
Nitro
Girls.
Glacier
vs. Bobby Duncum Jr.
The
cowboy takes him into the corner to start and shrugs off some kicks
before nailing a headbutt to the ribs. More
power shots such as a clothesline and shoulder drop drop Glacier and
we head back outside for even more punishment, including a hard whip
into the barricade. Back in
and a top rope clothesline is good for two on Ice Dude but he comes
back with his usual variety of kicks. A powerslam gets two for
Glacier, only to have Duncum come right back with a running DDT.
Duncum's attempt to use his bullrope doesn't work so he hits a Skull
Crushing Finale for the pin. That's not a good finisher for him.
Rating:
D. Duncum is trying, but him
going after the cowbell and bullrope shows how stupid WCW could be at
the time. I know they're a southern based promotion, but I got so
sick of their OBSESSION with cowboys. Yeah we get it you have a
bullrope and a big hat. DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT!
Giant
comes out to talk about the battle royal last night. He wanted a
piece of Nash but Nash needed an army to take him out since Big Kev
won't fight him one on one. Since that's out of the question, Giant
wants to know if Goldberg has the guts to face him tonight.
Hour
#2 begins.
Saturn
vs. Silver King
Before
the match, Saturn tells Ernest Miller to jump him if he wants to.
Why is this feud still a thing? A
hard shoulder takes Silver King down to start followed by a drop
toehold. Back up and a few kicks drop Saturn, setting up a slingshot
splash for two. Saturn is bored by selling and nails a clothesline
and superkick to send Silver King outside, only to draw out Sonny
Onoo and Ernest Miller. After some lame trash talk, a German suplex
and the Death Valley Driver end Silver King.
Cruiserweight
Title: Rey Mysterio Jr. vs. Kidman
Kidman
is defending. Feeling out process to start with Rey sending him into
the corner for an early Bronco Buster to a bit of a mixed reaction.
Maybe the huge shirt is
offputting. They trade headscissors takeovers with Rey's taking both
guys over to the floor. Back
in and Rey hits a quick dropkick to the knee followed by something
like a Fameasser for two.
Kidman
is sent to the apron but comes in over the top with a top rope cross
body for two of his own. The
champion charges at Rey but Mysterio uses what would become the 619,
sending Kidman flying out to the floor in a cool spot. A big
springboard flip dive takes Kidman down but he's able to dropkick
Mysterio out of the air as they come back in. Kidman powerslams him
for two before getting caught in the sitout bulldog for another near
fall. That's FINALLY enough
to get the announcers to care about the guys in the ring instead of
Nash vs. Goldberg.
Rey
comes back again with a sunset bomb out of the corner but Kidman is
right back as well with a running bulldog up the corner. The masked
dude hits a superplex but
West Coast Pop is countered into the short powerbomb in a great
counter. Juvy and Eddie come out for a distraction with Kidman going
after the latter, allowing Guerrera to hit the Juvy Driver on Rey,
setting up the Shooting Star to retain the title.
Rating:
C+. This was a
nice back and forth match between these two but the LWO continues to
go nowhere for the most part. It's nice of
them to have some kind of a story, but there's only so much that they
can do against each other. I'd love to see them get out of the
division for a change, but this
is WCW so that's a very rare thing to see.
Here's
Bischoff for his weekly Horsemen address. He understands that Flair
isn't going away and asks
for him to come out here right now for a showdown. Flair comes out
for the staredown on his own and says he's humbled by the reaction
he's getting here in Grand Rapids. Bischoff actually says Flair
deserves this before saying they have to acknowledge that Bischoff
runs the company. Flair will admit that Ted Turner is a great man
but made a mistake in hiring Bischoff.
Eric
brings up Flair bringing in Barry Windham but Flair has no authority
to hire anyone. This brings out Barry who immediately hugs Flair.
Bischoff thinks that Barry is going to turn on Windham, which might
be an accurate prediction. Bischoff slaps Flair and gets jumped,
only to have Barry hit Flair low. The NWO jumps the Horsemen as they
try for a save and Horace works over Dean's leg. Eric makes Bret vs.
Malenko tonight.
Stills
of Booker saving Stevie Ray from Konnan last night.
Booker
T. vs. Konnan
Tony
tells us that Horsemen have left the arena other than Dean. Nice
teammates they are. Booker takes over to start with a wristlock but
walks into the rolling clothesline. A clothesline and back elbow to
the jaw drop Konnan and a pair of kicks but Stevie comes out and
nails Konnan in the head with a slapjack for a DQ.
Stevie
asks Booker where his head is but Booker says he doesn't need his
brother.
Gene
brings out Bret Hart for a chat. Bret says that punk DDP stole a
cheap win last night and wants a rematch. He'll destroy Dean's knee
until Page accepts the challenge.
Nitro
Girls.
Wrath
vs. Kevin Nash
The
idea here is simple: Nash is facing the ultimate streak at Starrcade
so he's challenging a smaller streak here. Wrath drives in knees in
the corner and nails a bicycle kick to drop Nash with ease. A
dropkick sends him over the top and out to the floor as it's all
Wrath to start. Nash comes back in with right hands and elbows in
the corner but Wrath easily suplexes him down. Wrath gets two off a
top rope clothesline but he charges into a boot in the corner. Side
slam is good for two on Wrath and a shoulder gets the same on Nash.
Kevin comes right back with a big boot and the Jackknife to end Wrath
once and for all.
Rating:
C-. The match actually wasn't
all that bad but the booking is pretty questionable. I fully
understand the idea of having Nash beat a winning streak, but Wrath
was a guy with potential and they just burned through it here. On
top of that, Wrath dominated the match and Nash hit like two moves
for the win in less than five minutes. This should have been a
bigger deal than it was.
Gene
brings out Chris Jericho for a chat. Jericho's hair looks like he's
been subjected to static electricity experiments. However Jericho
wants to be serious tonight. The Jericholics have disappointed him
lately by not cheering loud enough. He's their role model because
he's better than every single one of them. Gene brings up Bobby
Duncum Jr. and Jericho can't pronounce his last name. As Jericho
makes fun of cowboys, Duncum walks out with a hogtied Ralphus.
Jericho: “GET AWAY FROM HIM! HE'S A TRAINED KILLER!”
Scott
Hall vs. Alex Wright
Jericho
is still trying to untie Ralphus during Hall's entrance. Hall says
cut the NWO Black and White music. Tonight is going to be the final
survey because the fans are all here to see the.....something I can't
make out. There are two factions in the NWO and Hall doesn't care
for either one of them right now, so send out Alex Wright so Hall can
destroy him. After the toothpick throw, Alex flips out of a belly to
back suplex but gets punched in the jaw and clotheslined out to the
floor.
Alex
actually pulls Hall outside for some right hands as the fans chant
USA. Back in and a missile dropkick puts Hall down again but it's
time to dance. Heenan is LIVID over this as you can hear the manager
in him trying to come back out. They slug it out a bit until Hall
levels him with a clothesline and the Edge is good for the pin.
Rating:
C. Far better match here than I
was expecting as Wright got to show off here in a bit of a surprise.
Hall being serious is a good thing though as I really didn't care for
the drunk angle. Hall is talented enough to put on entertaining
matches with almost anyone so it was a waste of his talent to use
that kind of a gimmick.
Nitro
Girls.
Bret
Hart vs. Dean Malenko
Dean
is favoring his knee after the attack earlier. Bret goes right for
the knee to take over and kicks away but Dean gets in a right hand
and some stomps to take over. Dean tries a rolling cradle but the
knee gives out and they roll to the floor. We take a break and come
back with Tony telling us about a special bonus Nitro tomorrow with
another hour. Oh freaking JOY.
Dean
tries a suplex and the knee holds up for the most part but he can't
follow up. A small package
is good for two on Hart as Tony actually gets a fact right: Windham
wasn't an original Horseman. Dean comes back with a sleeper which
Heenan points out allows him to rest the leg. Bret fights out of it
with a belly to back but Malenko keeps the hold on. They
head outside for a few seconds before Dean chokes with the boot in
the corner.
Bret
goes right back to the knee to take over though and snaps the bad leg
down. He grabs the leg again but gets enziguried down to give Dean a
breather. Back up and Dean
slams him into the buckle while hobbling across the ring. Nice
touch. A superplex doesn't work but Bret goes down to the apron to
keep Malenko out of trouble. The leg lariat sets up the Texas
Cloverleaf but Bret is right in the ropes.
They
fall to the floor with Dean landing on the leg to keep him down.
Bret tries to bring in a chair but the referee takes it away,
allowing Malenko to nail a missile dropkick for a very close two.
Malenko tries a leapfrog but can't get the elevation and goes down
again. Bret wraps the leg around the post a few times and nails a
Diamond Cutter, causing the referee to stop it.
Rating:
B. I was really liking this one
and the ending actually makes it better. Malenko doesn't have to do
a clean or even dirty job here and goes down fighting the whole way.
His comeback was great with the knee being sold the whole way
through. But of course we couldn't have Dean move up the card long
term or anything like that as a result of a great performance like
this.
DDP
comes in to save Malenko's knee but gets beaten down with a chair.
Bret misses a chair shot to the knee but gets away from the Diamond
Cutter. Page calls him Hitscum Hart as Bret walks away. We get a
challenge for a rematch for the US Title next week.
WCW
World Title: Giant vs. Goldberg
They
fight into the corner to start and Giant kicks him in the side of the
head. Chokeslam gets two and Goldberg hammers away with some kicks
to the ribs. Spear and a delayed Jackhammer retain the title.
Bam
Bam Bigelow runs in post match but Nash comes out for the save.
Goldberg goes after Nash and security separates them to end the show.
Overall
Rating: C-. This was an
entertaining enough show but I'm not interested in Starrcade so far.
Goldberg vs. Nash just doesn't feel like a big showdown main event
but it's what we're getting no matter what. The Jackhammer to Giant
was very impressive and Malenko's match was good so it's a watchable
show but in a bad time for WCW.
Remember
there's the extra Nitro show Tuesday and no Thunder this week.
Remember to check out my website at kbwrestlingreviews.com and head over to my Amazon author page with wrestling books under $4 at:
http://www.amazon.com/Thomas-Hall/e/B00E6282W6
And they're still better than anyone in the WWE or NXT tag team division.
ReplyDeleteNo one said they have to build the division around them, but I bet Daniels and Kazarian can put on some good matches with the Usos, Rhodes' and other tag teams.
ReplyDeleteFor entertainment purposes alone, I say the E should sign them up.
Same... I have thought that maybe it is just his gimmick... like it is probably an exaggerated version of how he really is.
ReplyDeleteAny gimmick done by a message board poster is lame. One of the weirdest internet phenomena.
ReplyDeleteAgree with all of this but I don't think it would ever happen
ReplyDeleteThe story in Bret's book about the random kid that came into the ring and acted like he was a member of the Hart family makes that celebration even better to me.
ReplyDeleteRepackage him as refusing to dance...or Bring Russo back so he can be the Wrestler formerly known as Fandango
ReplyDeleteHe could refuse to come out to his theme song because he hates it now.
ReplyDeleteHe's fine as a mid card jobber. Fandango is at least a unique character amid the sea of mostly generic jobbers.
ReplyDeleteJust based on how often he posts the same kind of statements, I always assumed it was a gimmick. At least, to the extent that he plays it out.
ReplyDeleteOf course, I may just assume that so I don't feel so bad about not trying to help...
http://bitchsandwich.tumblr.com/
ReplyDeleteHe's really a pimp. Right now he's laying in between 5 naked women and he has one typing his every word on command.
ReplyDelete"Bitch, type my motherfuckin' words!"
I legit tried to help, for a long time and he just shrugs it all off so I got tired of it. I really think he is like a reverse me when it comes to exaggeration.
ReplyDeleteWhen they took it away from him, it was the end of his character and he became just another guy
ReplyDeleteI agree..people who pretend to be anyone else on the internet is a weirdo. Cheap Plug: If you aren't already following me on twitter follow me @peyton_drinking
ReplyDeleteWhoa I was told by a VERY RELIABLE PERSON that Fandango was going to be a mega star.
ReplyDeleteThat is without a doubt the best part of Fandango flopping so badly.
ReplyDeleteYeah. Not everyone can be a billionaire basketball player, playboy and part-time secret agent like me.
ReplyDeleteI think we know what Bret would rate her.
ReplyDeleteOh yeah. I was really nice to him at the start, because I was actually concerned. Now, I just treat him like I treat everybody else here.
ReplyDelete..true..I play football
ReplyDeleteWho?
ReplyDeleteHe wanted to be loved by NPP so badly.
ReplyDeleteI don't like Russo as much as the next guy, but to be fair I doubt the product sucking right now has anything to do with him as the wording of the news piece makes it sound he hardly wields any power over the current product and most of the blame should go to Gaburick as he seems just as incompetent as Russo.
ReplyDeleteChandango.
ReplyDeleteNash beating Wrath and then and then pulling the old "putting him over by nodding in his general direction after the match" bit was another one of my "fuck this company" moments. Not that Wrath was my favorite wrestler, but he was a good one, on a roll, who was one of the rare guys in WCW having clean finishes to his matches.
ReplyDeleteWrath and Saturn should have been working in the US title mix with Hart and DDP at this point.
- No one ever
ReplyDeleteFandango should have a nerdy alter ego that is all serious and can't dance to save his life.
ReplyDeleteThey can call him Dan Fango
That was such a midcard gimmick that has overstayed its welcome, especially once they took away the name thing. But even that would have gotten annoying eventually.
ReplyDeleteIf anyone expects him to be more than a comedy heel, they need to give him a more serious gimmick.
It's not so much pretending to be someone else, though that is weird too and is way more extreme than a simple 'gimmick'. It's harping on certain unrelated subjects like the fellow here who apparently has some sort of cuckold fetish. What that has to do with the topics at hand I have no idea, and yet it's brought up in every thread.
ReplyDeleteThis a thousand times!
ReplyDeleteNFL or the European style?
ReplyDeleteYeah, the build up was awesome, but as soon as he won the title, he became cold as TNA forgot all the stuff that got Aries over in the first place.
ReplyDeleteI'm all for Chikara-style comedy gimmicks being brought into the WWE midcard. I love that shit and it would at least give meaningless characters some sort of hook.
ReplyDeleteRichard and Rod Belding
ReplyDeleteI don't mind the change to Layla, though. She was a professional dancer (for an NBA franchise, I believe) and, to me (and maybe Jef Vinson), is much easier on the eyes than Summer Rae. When Layla actually cheated to help Fandango to get the win a couple weeks back, I thought they'd actually show a more devious and ruthless side to them.
ReplyDeleteHey hey hey hey hey! WHAT is going on here?!?
ReplyDelete...MAYBE?!?!?!
ReplyDeleteWould a stewardess accompany Rod? Would he come down the ramp with a raft? If not, no buys.
ReplyDeletelol. Didn't want to put words in your mouth.
ReplyDeleteThose Uppity midcarders!
ReplyDeleteChan did. I'm fairly certain that he started being a colossal douche when he figured out they were mocking him there.
ReplyDeleteOnly after the male lead rushes across town to stop her from getting on a plane and taking that new job she got on the other side of the country.
ReplyDeleteI may have told this story before, but at the height of his "You pronounced my name wrong" bit, I was planning on going to see a movie with my girlfriend. She told me to check Fandango for tickets and showtimes.
ReplyDeleteMe: "I'm not checking until you say it right."
Her: "What?"
Me: "It's Faaaandaaaaango!"
Sometimes, I'm amazed I get any from her...
As I have stated before, I have zero problems with Nash ending Wrath's mini streak, as Thomas said, it does make perfect sense. I just don't understand why they just gave up on Wrath afterwards. So he lost 1 match to a top guy. Why not keep pushing him? Strange.
ReplyDeleteAnd Goldberg, the WCW champ was NOT in a match the previous night on PPV... Yet he gets a huge match against the Giant the next night on a free Nitro. Brilliant.
Don't get hurt is the lesson here. His career went down the toilet once he got the concussion
ReplyDeleteThat's like caring when the dorky goth kids in high school mock you because you have your shit together. Who gives a shit. Dougie is 38 and steals avatars to make his own emoctions and BuckDiddy is a crack baby.
ReplyDeleteAh, those were the days.
ReplyDelete:: obligatory comment about me being the one getting some from her ::
ReplyDeleteAgreed. Loved M:TG up until Tolarian Academy combo decks ruined the game.
ReplyDeleteIt's been years since I picked up any cards, but I have a version of the game on my iPad for when I'm bored. It's not the same as making some kid cry after I forced him to wager his Shivan Dragon on a game and then I kill him in two rounds, though.
ReplyDeleteI thought the Summer Rae nose meme was already a thing? Maybe I'm thinking of MLW...
ReplyDeleteDo we have to call the 900 number to find out who?
ReplyDeleteHindsight makes the Wrath v. Nash finish even worse. If Nash had stayed champ and Wrath had challenged him they could have played off their past. But with the Fingerpoke of Doom it negated any chance for a Wrath rematch. WCW really wasted a lot of potential talent.
ReplyDeleteMeanwhile Kevin Sullivan, Jake Roberts, Raven and like 50 other guys hang out doing nothing.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.profightdb.com/wrestlers-with-highest-win-percentages.html
ReplyDeleteGreatest website ever if you like wrestling stats
It might be. Who...nose!
ReplyDeleteI slay me!
Everything about the main event booking was a mess here. Can't wait till we get to the POV shot of doom.
ReplyDeleteeh...I don't know about Sullivan at this point. TNA doesn't have a buget for that many fake casts.
ReplyDeleteWarrior had the highest win %?
ReplyDeleteOther people bring it up way more than I do.
ReplyDeleteI want to see Dragon Dragon in a WWE ring.
ReplyDeleteWhat's wrong with black? Why would someone need protection from black? My feelings be hurt yo
ReplyDeleteShocking isn't it? I was more surprised by how low Hogan is.
ReplyDeleteFeminist gimmick on a wrestling board is lame too. If people want to goof around and have fun about something that makes no difference why should it bother anyone?
ReplyDeleteKevin Nash is always trying to put himself over. It's like he just can't turn it off. Shawn and Hall seem to be able to look back and put things in perspective but Nash will be working an angle until the day he dies.
ReplyDeleteHave TNAs financial ever been leaked? Heyman said on Austins pod that he's been told that TNA is about 80-90 million in the hole, amd regularly loses 7 million a month?
ReplyDeleteBullshit or believable? My guess was that they regularly operate slightly in the red...nothing near ti what Heyman claims tho.
They must count all the house show DQs used to build up feuds.
ReplyDeleteYou ARE the fellow who apparently has some sort of cuckold fetish!
ReplyDeleteWhy would someone goofing around for shits n giggles bother anyone.
ReplyDeleteHey, the Black Knight had protection from white. It went both ways!
ReplyDeleteExcellent rebuttal my friend, one point for the gentleman from New York.
ReplyDeleteYears they tried to contact him I believe,Heyman booking TNA would be interesting,just don't let him take care of the money.
ReplyDeleteSeems to be major televised events (including big MSG house shows). That must have been time consuming.
ReplyDeleteYeah. They don't need help losing money. They do just fine on their own.
ReplyDeleteAccording to a bunch of posters over at 411 TNA makes at least 20 million a year.
ReplyDeleteThis promotion will die in the next 2-3 years.
ReplyDeleteI remember Save wrestled Hogan at MSG a few times and Hogan lost by countoout or got DQ'd to build up to a cage or some other specialty match.
ReplyDeleteAnd WWE does?
ReplyDeleteHe claimed he was being considered for the position of TNA President., whatever that entails
ReplyDeleteGod you miss me, LOL
ReplyDeleteSome people looked at me nuts when I said I thought ROH would outlast TNA two years ago.
ReplyDeleteObviously anything can still happen but it looks like a safer prediction then ever
What's NPP? Don't get me wrong I love that the legend builds itself without any effort on my part but I'm curious.
ReplyDeleteHeyman said that Raven and Tommy Dreamer did a good percentage of the booking They should consider bringing one of them in as head booker.
ReplyDeleteThat indeed was the joke, thanks for keeping it going!
ReplyDeleteRight on cue baby! (I do miss chin wins legit-though)
ReplyDeleteBack when WWF was running MSG monthly, they would do a three-month cycle with the big feuds: heel wins via countout/DQ/screwy pin, face wins via countout/DQ with a heel beatdown, Blowoff in a specialty match (cage, Texas death, etc.).
ReplyDeleteHogan did lose a ton of MSG matches via countout back in those days.
ROH can be a competition against WWE in the next 10-15 years,they now have a PPV,if they get a national TV deal they will become bigger.
ReplyDeleteTNA won't die but they won't be any bigger than what they are now.
ReplyDeleteSeems high but I wouldn't be completely surprised by that actually. They don't pay their talent shit and have a major cable deal. I really have 0 idea
ReplyDeleteI love watching Parallax complain that he hates me and then bring me up at least twice a week. I haven't been a poster here in a year but still this guy and his delightful fictional pimp stories, gotta love him!
ReplyDeleteI wanna see the Invasion 2.0
ReplyDeleteThey have some international TV deals that makes them enough from going out of business but that is it
ReplyDeleteInvade what, NXT?
ReplyDeleteSuperstars.
ReplyDeleteDon't they do better overseas than domestically?
ReplyDeleteIt not bothersome itself, but it dilutes the type of discussions I come here to read. I often see an interesting thread, start reading some great comments, and then have to skip through several pages of nonsense. I totally get that it's fun for a lot of you regular posters though. More of an observation than a complaint.
ReplyDeleteWhen it comes to finances, Heyman is not someone I would believe at all
ReplyDeleteIt's a mess board with like 4 posters dominated by Dougie and Buckdiddy from here that talks about/mocks this site.
ReplyDeleteYes, it's a real thing and it's probably lamer than you think it is...regardless of what you think of it
Anything can happen but I don't think anyone is gonna rise to real competition. Vince will crush you with his resources as soon as he had a need to actually be afraid
ReplyDeleteI remember Heyman doing an interview with Arda Orcal where he talked about "potential ownership percentage" as what he was looking for in a TNA deal.
ReplyDeleteCan a company sustain itself with that much debt? That seems like a lot to me.
ReplyDeleteGiven TNA's decision-making process, I'm AMAZED they didn't go for that.
ReplyDeleteAnd he says his name in a COMPLETELY normal voice.
ReplyDeleteDude no way that's true. They can't afford to pay anyone but the shit parts of their roster.
ReplyDeleteEspecially in the context of this discussion. It came up because Austin asked him how ECW folded and he said they were in debt 7 million when they shut and kept trying to rationalize it..je went into a whole tanhebt aboit tna losing 7 million monthly was
ReplyDeleteReal competition,no way.But as a solid rival it can be.They just need to get more guys now.
ReplyDeleteHuh, not sure how I'm tied to a place I've never seen or posted at. Oh well, if it keeps Parallax talking about me then it's great.
ReplyDeleteHe wanted to slowly phase out the older stars and develop new ones.
ReplyDeleteTNA can't afford that brother.
ReplyDeleteThere was a whole thread a few days ago about cartoons that was just screaming for a Chan run in
ReplyDeleteWhenever everyone talks about how Heyman is a liar, it's always the same type of lie.
ReplyDeleteSeriously, I don't care what he says because he is not capable if telling the truth. It's why I didn't bother with the podcast. I like Heyman on air but that is about it.
It's not like Wrath was going to be a long-term commodity or anything, but there WAS value in running a Goldberg vs. Wrath ppv match. Why not do it at WW3?
ReplyDeleteIf only Sting was healthy around this time. At the time, I wanted to see Sting return and win it. (I didn't know Sting was legitimately out at the time). Goldberg vs. Sting and a Hogan vs. Nash blow-off made sense at the time.
I remember this Nitro a little bit. I was SURE the Bret-Malenko match was leading to Benoit vs. Bret for Starrcade. Unfortunately that was not the case and the Horsemen did not even wrestle at Starrcade.
Goldberg vs. Wrath should have happened at WW3.
ReplyDelete"Goldberg should have wrestled at WW3, period".
ReplyDeleteFixed that for you.
I'll buy that for $1.25
ReplyDeleteI will always wonder if things would have been significantly different if they did a slow-burn to Goldberg's first title win. Maybe he gets screwed out of his winning streak to end his US title reign, then goes on a tear leading up to cleaning house at WW3. He beats the champ (Nash? Hogan? Hart?) at Starrcade to claim his first title.
ReplyDeleteWell people declared Goldberg destroyed and ruined beyond repair forever after the fluke loss at Summerslam 2003, where winning the title the very next month apparently meant nothing because he was RUINED FOREVER. So I'm guessing that no, people would not have been thrilled about your scenario.
ReplyDeleteEven though it can be debatable about Nash beating Wrath, the whole execution was a joke: A sudden match, Nash basically does a lazy win (two moves after selling for a while), it's barely five minutes long, a hot guy's push ends (they didn't bother with his streak or even any kind of a push after this), and Nash basically leapfrogs him to Goldberg. It doesn't help that it seemed pretty obvious that Nash was just beating a guy that could have been a potential threat, either. This was politics, plain and simple.
ReplyDeletePutting him against Scott Steiner instead of Goldberg doing a run in would have worked for me.
ReplyDeleteMan on paper WCW had an endless well of potential feuds. With that roster it seems like it would have been easy to simply rotate talent and book viable feuds on just two guys "wrestling" to get closer to a title shot, without needing shitty angles EVERY TIME. A Hart/Malenko feud or even a Nash/Wrath FEUD sounds good to me. Bigelow/Goldberg should have been a beast of a feud. Wrath was never going anywhere past the U.S./Hardcore title level but why not use his undefeated push to elevate someone else? Saturn was a sick talent, the fans all knew it. How bout Saturn ends Wrath then gets fed to Goldberg? Fans could have easily bought him hanging with Billy boy.
ReplyDeleteWCW just really blew it and I want to slap whoever is to blame. If they only had a true "Vince" there to run shit we wouldn't be stuck with the monopoly we have. Competition made it easy to be a wrestling fan. Damn you Dubbya.
Goldberg was hot as hell in the Chamber. If you don't think that hurt him, and winning at a B-PPV was the right idea, I dunno what to tell you.
ReplyDelete