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Clash Countdown: #16

The SmarK Retro Rant for Clash of the Champions XVI: Fall Brawl 91

(Historic show for me, as TBS finally became available here in the frozen wastelands of Canadaland and I bugged my dad to get the movie channels so we could watch some motherfuckin’ WCW, son!  And it launched just in time for this show, my first Clash that I could watch LIVE.) 

- Not to be confused with the Coliseum Video Rant XVI, which happens to share the same roman numerals, but has a wittier subtitle.

- Cool experience of the week: I was browsing through a local Chapters bookstore (the biggest bookstore in Canada, basically) and went over to check out the price on the new Mick Foley book in the wrestling section. And what was sitting on the shelf right next to it? My own humble book, The Buzz on Pro Wrestling (thumbs up, cheap pop). See, Mick and I are book buds!  (Geez, who buys books in paper format anymore?  Go back to the old folks home, gramps!) 

- By the way, if one more quasi-talented bubblegum Green Day-sounding punk trio calls themselves something with a number in the name (SR-71, Blink-182, Sum-41…) I will be forced to kidnap and torture Billy Joe and eliminate the source of the entire problem. I think the groups should just merge into one big group and add up all the numbers in their name to prevent confusion, then learn to create their own musical style, along with another chord or two. With that in mind, I think I’ll spare American Hi-Fi, because even they’re derivative, at least their name is somewhat original and number-free.  (This was written before “American Idiot” became one of my favorite albums of all-time, and in fact the number band craze did not get any better.) 

- Live from Augusta, GA

- Your hosts are JR & Tony, with Matrats.com Vice-President in Charge of Totally Bitchin’ Operations Eric Bischoff and RAW color commentator Paul E. Heyman wandering around the building picking their nose and stuff. For those stuck in the low-end of a dead-end job, have hope: Look at Bischoff and know that you, too, can go from coffee boy and junior announcer to sinking the second-biggest wrestling promotion in the country in less than 10 years!

- Opening match, Georgia Brawl Battle Royale:

Your participants are Tom Zenk, Tommy Rich, Bobby Eaton, Ranger Ross, Tracy Smothers, The Great and Mighty Oz, PN News, Buddy Lee Parker, Steve Austin, Dustin Rhodes, Terrence Taylor, Big Josh, Barry Windham, One Man Gang and El Gigante. You’d think putting Kevin Nash and El Gigante in the same ring would cause a black hole of suck that might conceivably end the universe, but there they are. And PN News, too. In hindsight, Paul Neu may just have been 10 years before his time, at which point the wacky dancing fat guy became en vogue in the wrestling business and he wouldn’t have looked like a complete and utter tool. (Let’s not go crazy here.)  Of course, if he HAD become the big star in Rikishi’s place, I don’t think I could have lived with the promos: “Austin it was ME who ran you over! YO BABY YO BABY YO!” Trust me, say it out loud and it gets funnier. Sadly, Kevin Nash was nearing the end of his run as the Great and Mighty Oz at this point, and indeed the transition provided the world with one of those Moments in WCW History We’d All Like To Have Been Present For backstage, as someone actually proposed turning him from the living embodiment of a magical land into a snappy dressing Italian stereotype who wrestled in a tux, and someone else actually thought it was a good idea and gave the first person the go-ahead to implement it. It’s not even the original idea that I find so perplexing, it’s the fact that there was little quality control that “Vinnie Vegas” actually was considered a better gimmick than “The Great and Mighty Oz” by someone who was presumably being PAID to keep track of this stuff. These are the same people who couldn’t think of any way to market Steve Austin or Mick Foley, but felt Shockmaster had some good upside potential and El Gigante would be the next Andre the Giant. To be fair, Vince McMahon also gave it the old college try with Jorge Gonzalez, but at least he gave him that muscle suit to wear so that he could make a few bucks on the side as an anatomy teaching aid at local colleges. Anyway, El Gigante eliminates Oz & One Man Gang to win at 9:31, and trust me, you didn’t miss anything. I don’t rate battle royales.

- Lightheavyweight title semi-finals: Bradstreet v. Brian Pillman.

Brad begs off to start, but Pillman gets a headscissors and victory roll for two. It should be noted that Pillman was doing the Yellow Dog gimmick for god-knows-what reason from June until this show, until (as JR notes) thousands of cards and letters from WCW fans necessitated Pillman’s reinstatement into WCW. I didn’t even know there WERE thousands of fans watching at point, let alone enough who could actually read and/or write. Armbar, but Brad breaks. Pillman’s sunset flip gets two, dropkick follows and Brad bails. Bradstreet suplexes Pillman off the apron to the floor in a typically sick Pillman bump, and when Brian gets back on the apron he takes his patented chinfirst bump to the railing. He gets posted and Bradstreet stalls. Yup, he’s a Freebird. Pillman in with a bodypress for two, but Brad gets a neckbreaker for two. He goes up but gets dropkicked to the floor, and Pillman follows with a tope suicida that nearly gives poor JR a heart attack. To the top, missile dropkick misses. Spinkick gets two, but Brad comes back with a DDT for two. Backslide gets two for Pillman. Crucifix is reversed to a samoan drop by Brad, but Pillman finishes with a flying bodypress at 6:52. This would be classified as a good Smackdown midcard match these days, but for 1991 it was amazing stuff, considering Liger was a few months away yet. ***

- And now, as my own alternative to the DVDVR 500, here’s the WCW Top 10 rankings for the week of whenever the hell this Clash was…

10. Beautiful Bobby

9. The Z-Man

8. The Diamond Studd

7. The One Man Gang

6. Dustin Rhodes

5. Stunning Steve Austin

4. El Gigante

3. Barry Windham

2. Ron Simmons

1. Sting

Champion: Lex Luger

Now I ask you, can the DVDVR guys possibly top a list of talent like that with their nobodies like that Kawada fella or that Yuji Nagata guy. C’mon, how are they supposed to draw money if they’re not 7 feet tall like El Gigante? And can either of them flick a toothpick with the pinpoint accuracy of the Diamond Studd? I rest my case.  (Another wasted opportunity for a top 10 gag.) 

- Sting v. Johnny B. Badd.

Sting’s US title is not for grabs here. Sting gets a quick pump splash, but it misses. Elbow misses, Badd gets a sunset flip for two. Sting gets a small package for two. Sunset flip gets two for Sting. Sting to the arm, Badd reverses. Blind charge misses and Sting goes back to the arm. Suplex is no-sold by Badd, and they back off as a gift box is delivered. Stinger splash misses and Badd gives some bodyshots. Badd and Sting both get distracted by the box sitting at ringside, and the match just stops cold. Sting rolls Badd up for the pin at 6:29, a lot of which was standing around. ½* Cactus Jack of course pops up and beats the holy hell out of Sting.  (The gift box gag was a good one, but unfortunately the Luger payoff fell pretty flat.) 

- Lightheavyweight title semi-finals: Richard Morton v. Mike Graham.

Ricky Morton’s heel turn might have worked due to the resentment from the female fans, but they make the fatal error of not actually having him dress or act terribly different in the heel role. I know the Joe Dirt mullet defined the guy, but it WAS the nineties and might have been time to cut it off. The guy you’ve really gotta pity is Mike Graham, who had a cushy road agent job until this show, at which point WCW decided to make some cutbacks and force him to actually WORK for his money again by wrestling. (I’m sure Mike later took credit for that idea.)  Graham grabs a headlock, no luck. Morton trips him up and rolls into a Boston crab, and into a sunset flip for two. Graham escapes, so Morton bails. Back in, he works a headlock. Pinfall reversal sequence and Morton begs off. Morton goes up and gets suplexed off for two. Morton resorts to a show of fisticuffsmanship and choking. Graham pulls a figure-four out of his ass, no go. He works the arm, as does Richard. Graham gets an indian deathlock (thus dropping the match ½* automatically) as Alexandra York distracts the ref, and Morton rolls Graham up for the pin at 7:42 in a match the entire arena didn’t give a crap about. Maybe were it 1972 and 4 minutes shorter, it might have gotten over better, who knows. **

- Eric Bischoff brings Bill Kazmaier out to bend a “steel bar” around his neck for the Guinness Book of World Records, but the Enforcers attack him after the deed and injure his ribs. Now what, may I ask, was the record that he was going after here? I know the whole point of the skit was to establish the injury, but really you’d think someone would stop and consider that bending a “steel bar” around one’s neck might strike the more discerning viewer as a totally pointless exercise, especially with no actual reps of Guinness there to verify whatever record he was supposed to be trying to attain.

- The Fabulous Freebirds v. The Patriots.

Speaking of dumb ideas, may I present Firebreaker Chip and Todd Champion: The Patriots. The concept? Take a couple of muscle-bound talentless hacks, dress them up in costumes right out of a B-level ladies night and/or a Village People reunion (“Hey, it’s the fireman and the solider!”) and push them to the moon. Plus 10 for developing new talent, minus several million for style. Hayes tosses Chip, but gets powerslammed, as does Garvin. Freebirds bail. Back in, Chip dropkicks Garvin and gets a sleeper. So bush league I almost feel like setting up a booth at a flea market and selling tickets there. Billy Kidman could main event. Chip works the arm, and a sunset flip gets two. Rollup gets two, but Hayes cheapshots Chip. Todd Champion comes in, and he’s a house of fire! I often wonder why Todd didn’t get a shot in the WWF: He’s no less talented than Billy Gunn, and has the advantage of looking like an extra out of a bad porno movie. I mean, c’mon, don’t tell me you don’t look at him and think of Dirk Diggler’s male exotic dancer pal Todd Parker? (That would be Thomas Jane for those of you in this century.)  Big elbow on Hayes gets two. Chip comes off the top with a double-clothesline. Double-team on Garvin, but the ref is distracted with Todd and Hayes nails Chip for the pin at 5:38. Those dastardly Freebirds would get their comeuppance when the Patriots won the US tag titles from them a few days later. Indy level mess here. ¾*

- Paul E. interviews Cactus Jack, and he declares Sting’s career OVER after that beating. A box is delivered to ringside, which Cactus assumes is Abdullah the Butcher out to congratulate him, and he decides to go give it a big Cactus Jack Hug without even opening it. Sting of course pops out, returns the beating, and they brawl all over the place.

- The Diamond Studd v. Ron Simmons.

Hey yo, chico, you’re gonna job. Studd attacks, but Simmons fights back. Studd chokeslam gets two. Bulldog gets two. Simmons slides out and posts Studd. Atomic drop both ways for Ron, spinebuster and shoulderblock finish at 2:26. WCW just had absolutely no clue what they almost had with Scott Hall in those days. ½*

- Terrence Taylor v. Van Hammer.

This was Hammer’s debut, as WCW decided to see if they could trick fans into thinking it was a repackaged Ultimate Warrior. No, seriously, that’s what I heard they were going for: The Jim Hellwig look. Hammer squashes Taylor in 1:08 with a kneedrop before settling into life as enhancement talent and DDP’s bootlick for the rest of his career. DUD  (Thankfully still alive, unlike the real deal and his other pretender, the Renegade.) 

- WCW TV title match: Stunning Steve Austin v. The Z-Man.

Hey, Zenk’s #9 on the top 10, Austin had better watch his back! Austin grabs a headlock into a hammerlock, reversed by Zenk. Austin begs off. Austin overpowers him, but Zenk goes to the headlock and Austin begs off again. Another headlock, Austin reverses, and they fight to the ropes. Austin goes to the headlock as the announcers lament Zenk’s lack of a mean streak. Too bad Meltzer didn’t have a radio show back then so Zenk could prove that one wrong. Zenk goes to the arm and gets the superkick and a backdrop for two. He followed up a superkick with a backdrop and wonders why he didn’t get credit for being a better wrestler? I mean, Zenk is a terrific interview these days, but geez that’s bad strategy. Austin bails and stalls. Zenk follows with a tope con hilo to the ramp, and back in for a bodypress … that misses. Austin stomps away, and hits the chinlock. Stuntun, but he doesn’t cover. Zenk cradles for two. Zenk gets the SLEEPER OF DOOM, but Lady Blossom slips Austin an international object, and he bops Zenk for the pin at 9:11. I’ve seen way better matches between them on Worldwide, and probably have about 4 of them on a tape in my collection somewhere. *3/4

- Special feature on Ron Simmons, leading to the Luger-Simmons contract signing, which turns into the usual brawl.

- World Tag team title tournament finals: Rick Steiner & Bill Kazmaier v. The Enforcers.

Steiner chases Larry Z and powerslams Arn for two. Enforcers double-team him and larry goes for the arm. They pound Rick in the corner, and Zbyszko gets a suplex for one. Rick fights out of the corner, but Larry blocks a superplex on Anderson. Kazmaier tags himself in and cleans house, but gets hit in the ribs and pinned at 3:34. Rushed and sloppy. ½*

The Bottom Line: No one ever accused 91 WCW of setting the intellectual bar too high for everyone else, that’s for sure. But if watching a guy bend a steel bar around his neck and El Gigante doing battle with Oz in a battle royale is what makes a show for you, then RUN out and find a copy of this right now.

For those WITHOUT mental problems, strong recommendation to avoid.

Comments

  1. Apparently the steel bar Kazmeier used was real. Dude may have sucked as a wrestler, but he was insanely strong.

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  2. Just watched this the other day and Scott Hall looked freaking huge here. And he called himself "a Bad Guy" so he totally could have gone by that when he went back to wcw in 1996.

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  3. But what was the point of bending the bar? I mean how does that show you are strong?

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  4. The top ten says everything you need to know about the roster at this point. It's weird that the boom of the 80s created no one that could make money. Sting and Luger both got over but neither drew a dime. The WWF made Warrior but he couldn't draw either.

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  5. I'm sure there's no one reason and this is strictly option, but I always figured marketing almost exclusively to children was the reason for lagging business. Adults who are smart to the product are turned off by cartoon crap, and children can't buy shit without the adults. Unless I begged my parents, they would never have bought one PPV, let alone take me to a show (we lived in NY and easily could've gone to MSG, but chose not to).

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  6. Sting and Luger should have headlined Starrcade.

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  7. Try bending a steel bar some time, whether over your neck or any other way, and see if it requires some strength.
    Not saying it was the best way to build up a wrestler, but there are worse ways to show strength. And Kazmeier was legit one of the strongest people in the world.

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  8. It kinda did... they were the finalists of a stupid Battle Royal. How did WCW stay in business?

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  9. That last line is bullshit.

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  10. Oh boy this means tomorrow is Clash XVII, with one of the greatest bouts in Clash history....
    "NOOOOOOOOT RICKY STEAMBOAT!!!"

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  11. Dammit Scott, Vinnie Vegas IS a better gimmick than Oz. That's not a high bar to leap i'll give you that but i always thought the character had decent mid-card potential.


    I'll give Sting credit, he never pouted about being shunted down the card after losing the world title and went out there and worked with a nice variety of up-and-coming mid-carders. Plus putting over strong the returning Nikita Koloff and Ravishing Rick Rude.

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  12. Warrior was a moderate draw, far more than Sting and Luger. To be fair, WCW couldn't draw flies to horse shit. Their house show numbers were laughably bad, always.

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  13. I loved the Sting/Rude angle at an upcoming Clash where Rude won the US Title. Sting makes the miracle comeback from the hospital, then does a 5 minute job.

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  14. Give em a break, Big Show and Mark Henry were pulling shit like this 20 years later.


    Besides what else did Kazmeier bring to the table? Might as well highlight his one attribute.

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  15. He carried an inflatable globe across his back. License to print money!

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  16. I think wcw was just trying to turn on McMahon with that strength trick and ultimately distract him from his job.

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  17. By this point the decision had been made Superbrawl > Starrcade.


    With Dusty holding the book, it is a surprising decision since Starrcade is his baby but it was what it was.

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  18. I actually don't think a single RAW match has ever ended during commercial. At least that I recall.

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  19. I would say Mo is getting exposed in victory but both guys are getting exposed.
    Rampage is only nominally an MMA fighter at this point, really just a brawling boxer.
    And Mo is a wrestler who can't even hurt a guy with no variety in his game who's been washed up for years and had to win by LnP.
    In their defense, maybe 10,000 people paid for the fight so nobody knows what happened.



    I have it 29-28 Mo but the hometown crowd might give it 29-28 Rampage. Not like anyone cares who wins, I sure don't.

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  20. I'm in limbo here as to whether or not I want to start a ppv. I kinda do, but they're like three hours man.

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  21. Rampage gets the hometown decision. Don't agree but again, don't care

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  22. I'm on part 2 of Austin's podcast with Bischoff. Fantastic so far.

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  23. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:11 PM

    Aren't they supposed to be doing something with TNA?

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  24. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:15 PM

    I'm taking it down. Goo productive talk gents. See you tomorrow.

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  25. Tom the Actuary! Haven't heard that name in years, or of the Oratory, which I assume has been closed for years now.

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  26. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:17 PM

    [Scooby-Doo]...er?[/Scooby-Doo]

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  27. I think they were part of the aces and 8s angle. I know Rampage was. I don't think TNA has the budget even for them anymore at this point.

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  28. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:34 PM

    Marry: Trish
    Fuck: Trish
    Kill the other 2 bitches.

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  29. Settled on Clash of the champions starting with 1.

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  30. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:39 PM

    I'm a homebody and I get bored at work. That is why my post count is high. The conversation got much better over the last few weeks.

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  31. Xpac vs d lo brown at judgment day 1998 might be waltmans best match in his 2nd WWF run

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  32. Me too, one of my favorite angles actually.

    The whole goofy Paul E interview, Sting showing up at the building and the crowd losing it with every move he hit and booing Rude out of the building is all great. Plus the finish too and Rude's interview. It's a really well done angle all the way around for a free TV thing especially.

    Plus you got Steamer back into the fold. Clash 17 was the first moment you kind of felt WCW would be OK without Flair.

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  33. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:42 PM

    Then whose kid is Axel?

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  34. I'm actually really digging this show. I would have figured it sucked

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  35. Yeah I think starting with the show in 1991 that Superbrawl was intended to be the big new main supercard, although they waffled on it quite a bit over the years.



    What's funny though is Superbrawl 1 was in May 91, but then they bumped Superbrawl II back to February.

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  36. "The only thing you're tag teaming is each other-" one of the Headbangers in a pre match promo on NAO

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  37. WCW should have booked Sting vs. Luger at Starrcade (Sting wins world title). Have the rematch at SuperBrawl II. Luger puts his career on the line vs. Sting's world title. Sting wins and Luger leaves for the WBF.

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  38. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:46 PM

    TGGI

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  39. WWF judgment day 1998

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  40. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:47 PM

    Stop killing the fantasy.

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  41. The crowd is red hot for the outlaws. Daniel Bryanish

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  42. The weird thing was, some years Starrcade was bigger than SuperBrawl while other years SuperBrawl was bigger. It's like they kept changing their minds which ppv was their biggest.

    By 1993, it was Starrcade, with the exception of 1995.

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  43. Yeah could have worked if they'd viewed Starrcade as the big show at that point.


    I think Luger gave notice in early January, after Starrcade. I do sort of wonder if they had any long term plans for him at that point given how quiet his exit was.

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  44. I dropped my Sony remote and this outlaws vs headbangers match ffwd about 6 minutes. I didn't bother rewinding it. Figured it was a sign the match sucked. My controller was right.

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  45. Bischoff has said it was because Starrcade was so close to Christmas

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  46. Yeah, I'd say Starrcade was clearly supposed to be the big show in 1993/1994 and certainly during their big run from 96 till the end.


    Even the original Sid/Vader match for the 1993 show was being pushed as the biggest match of the year, so it wasn't just Flair's inclusion.

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  47. It wasn't so much that Rude won, it was how he won. Common sense is something that's lacking from 99% of wrestling matches, but here Rude knew the knee was injured, so when he had the chance, he clipped it. Then, because he's smart, held the tights as an insurance policy.

    My seven-year-old self cried after watching that match. It was glorious!

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  48. Headbangers are another instance of guys I liked for some reason despite sucking.

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  49. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 17, 2014 at 11:55 PM

    That doesn't cover Colon winning the Universal title a million times.

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  50. Yeah, which is weird, considering clearly it was the biggest show in 1996/1997/1998/1999 when he was running the thing. I guess maybe he was referring to the earlier years before he had power, because he wasn't executive vice president until the 1993 show.

    So really the only 'gimmick' Starrcade during Bischoff's whole reign was the 1995 show -- which coincidentally Hogan was promised not to work.

    So if anything, despite what he's said, he probably did more for it than anyone in a long time to make it the biggest show.

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  51. Oh wow Foley vs Shamrock for the ic belt? Damn this show is all right

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  52. I wouldn't go that far. They never did the kind of numbers the WWF did on a regular basis, but they certainly made huge strides in that area (among other areas) during their big run.

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  53. Sting vs. Flair? Yeah, this is going to be awesome

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  54. WCW's house show business was mostly a giant fail except for a brief period during the hottest era of wrestling since the big WWF boom of the 80's. They didn't run nearly as many live shows as the WWF, but when they did, they were drawing less than what would be considered awful attendance for WWF cards.

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  55. Correction: How did they stay in business as long as they did? Ted Turner was that much of a mark he didn't mind losing money on a regular basis?

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  56. Kerplunk was Green Day's best album. Or, at least it's the only one I can listen to straight through.

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  57. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMay 18, 2014 at 12:20 AM

    American Idiot was fucking terrible.

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  58. Your_Favourite_LoserMay 18, 2014 at 12:28 AM

    do one of the better IYH's

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  59. That and a strong personal desire to put Vince out of business. Ted even admitted it in his autobiography.

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  60. Think about that. You're talking about WCW here. "Long term plans"?

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  61. THIS, THIS, THIS, A MILLION TIMES THIS!


    I've lost count of how many awesome slideshows were ruined by that shitty time of your life song, and of course American idiot gets an incessant amount of play, even making it into a fucking MADDEN GAME. THE FIRST ONE I EVER SERIOUSLY PLAYED. YOU FUCKING PEOPLE.


    They sound like Generic Modern Rock #193A. I don't know if they fathered the style, and I know music is entirely subjective, but to me, fuck em. They don't do pump-up themes, they don't do a good celebration theme, they don't do good entrance themes, and they don't do a serene relaxing theme. FUCK EM.

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  62. 2014 Scott got a bit lazy there towards the end.

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  63. A boom that began with the NWO angle.


    I don't think it's anything to sneeze at --- They went from only 960 fans a show in 1993, and an average of 1,600 for 1994 and 1995, upped it to almost 3,500 in 1996, 5,470 in 1997 and 8,000 in 1998. Those are remarkable gains for a company with no track record at all for being able to sell house shows to fans -- far from the point of giving away two for one specials in 1991.

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  64. Over the years I only remember a couple Nitro matches actually ending during the break. Tony gave the replay and they moved on. If they cared one bit about working they'd have a commercial finish every once in a while.

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  65. I hate Green Day.

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  66. yeah, marry fuck or kill is a fun game until you have t do it for real. And there's only one woman.

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  67. Amsterdam_Adam_CurryMay 18, 2014 at 1:47 AM

    Every terrible band gets into a Madden game. I mean, that's like a sure sign that a band sucks, getting on a Madden soundtrack.


    What was that Genesis football game, Joe Montana Football or something? That game is better than every Madden game combined, me and the kid I lived across the street with used to stay up until 3 AM playing that shit.

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  68. I'm thinking it shows that people aren't switching channels if they have an app on a second screen. Honestly, I think cable channels are just happy that things aren't being DVR'ed as much with the show because of an incentive like the app, and it plays into "the live experience" while trying to maintain WWE's image of being DVR proof as much as regular sports.

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  69. I'd argue that Halloween Havoc was Bischoff's "WrestleMania".

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  70. I don't think the lackluster TUF seasons are the problem, as that show and format was bound to get old after a while. That said, an upcoming TUF season is going to be for an actual title, the 115-pound women's belt, so that will provide something of interest. At least a champ will be crowned from that, rather than some mid-range fighter who will go .500 in the UFC if he's lucky.

    Anyway, TUF isn't the problem, but the sheer amount of UFC programming is the problem. Comdukakis mentioned injuries and a lack of star power....neither would be as much of an issue if there were fewer shows per month. The way it is now, there is a UFC card running almost every single week, and it's diluting the product big-time. If a main eventer on one of these thin cards gets injured, it ruins the whole thing since there's no depth whatsoever. There are even two UFC shows on the SAME DAY on May 31 --- one in Brazil, one in Germany.

    Ideally, the UFC would have one PPV per month and one free show for either Fox Sports 1/Fox Sports 2 per month. Every third month, you add one more in the form of the FOX Network card. Since the UFC seems to be running two North American TUF seasons and at least three or four 'international' TUF seasons as well now, you'll need finale cards for all of those. Add it all up and it works out to 33-34 UFC events per calendar year, which seems like a followable amount especially since a lot of fans will skip those TUF finale shows.

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  71. Sting vs. Mero around that time period sounds like it would have been a decent match had they not been waiting for the big surprise to emerge.

    And I have a hard time believing Austin-Zenk for 10 minutes didn't even reach the two star threshold.

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  72. MaffewOfBotchamaniaMay 18, 2014 at 4:23 AM

    Whenever someone is losing an argument with Scott, that is going to get brought up.

    ''No, see your theory is flawed because of the-''
    ''SHUT UP, YOU LOVED AMERICAN IDIOT!''

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  73. Ratings in and of themselves aren't the end all, be all for television networks; you have to be able to bilk those viewers for it to be successful. The WWE is internally profitable as a PG product, but the advertising revenue generated during commercials for the network is artificially low because of the demographics being catered to, comparative to other programming.



    Thus, WWE's value is more in providing an anchor to the Monday night lineup, and hopefully provide a lead-in for people to stick around after the fact, but even this is troublesome because by 11 PM you're entering a less lucrative zone from a marketing standpoint. So really, Raw on USA exists in its own little bubble; a bubble with some value, but not the astronomically high value people make it out to be.

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  74. Every time I see the words "Indian Deathlock", I remember that hilarious time when Triple-H tried to get the move over as a great submission hold. It was just ABSURD, and his poor opponents would have to writhe in agony while Trips did this super slow motion hold.

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  75. Halloween Havoc usually felt like the third or fourth biggest event. It felt like they went Starrcade, Bash at the Beach, SuperBrawl then Halloween Havoc.

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  76. How dare you?! Triple H's Indian Deathlock was magnificent. I think he just picked the wrong era to try and get it over. Everyone else was suplexing the shit out of eachother, and Triple H was laying on the mat in a tangled mess of legs as a transition move.

    ReplyDelete
  77. Tecmo forever. Joe Montana Sports Talk Football was pretty much unplayable.

    ReplyDelete
  78. I've read plenty of times that's how Bischoff considered it.

    ReplyDelete
  79. YankeesHoganTripleHFanMay 18, 2014 at 6:38 AM

    When you think about it Foley rode that gift box all the way to the title. Took 7 years and and a different company but still....

    ReplyDelete
  80. This is much better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSaTO_GqczE

    ReplyDelete
  81. I liked his Indian Deathlock but sleeper holds in the era of rear naked chokes are indefensible.

    ReplyDelete
  82. The Immortal Hoke OganMay 18, 2014 at 7:16 AM

    Thank you. I thought Scott was just kidding at first, but I guess not

    ReplyDelete
  83. I have been reading these WCW recaps lately and quite frankly, as someone who lived through this period and watched a lot of WCW at the time, I really think these are reading like they are being written by somebody who just started watching within the last five years and never really saw ANY original WCW whatsoever.

    You completely seem to disregard the fact that, NASH VS. GOLDBERG was actually a HUGE deal at the time and was being discussed, probably much more so, then the Austin/Taker stuff they were doing in December of 98 in the WWF and was maybe only second to the Foley title win in terms of what was hot during that period. 6th grade me and my group of wrestling fans, 10 of us total, and every fan we knew, ALL wanted Nash to end Goldberg's streak. Yes, we were marks and sick of the streak, and we LOVED The Wolfpac (lol), but I think we represented the general wrestling fan's sentiments pretty well.

    I'm reading Eric Bischoff's book right now and it's evident that he never thought Starrcade was the biggest show of the year, and for a VERY smart business reason. In Bischoff's opinion, wrestling really is the last thing people, in general, think about with Christmas being so close. Halloween Havoc was always Bischoff's "Grandaddy Of 'Em All". Kids are back in school, weather is changing, people are inside watching TV more, and people have less options to spend their money on.

    i like the idea of doing these and I think you do a really good job of recapping these. I love reading them. I just tend to disagree with a lot of what is written, but please, keep producing them because I am still a big fan.

    ReplyDelete
  84. They were looking forward to finding out how much the wrestlers weigh.

    ReplyDelete
  85. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:23 AM

    The right feud would have put them on. They reminded me of a younger Nasty Boys.

    ReplyDelete
  86. Long ago, Mr. Perfect beat some random jobber during the break... the show came back to Perfect in the aisle, headed to the back with his music playing.


    Other than that, I can't think of any other time that was done.

    ReplyDelete
  87. Time Of Your Life blows, but it wasn't from American Idiot.
    The song American Idiot itself got overplayed to death, but that's not exactly Green Day's fault.
    I'm not onboard with Scott calling the album the best thing ever or anything, but I do feel it gets treated unfairly sometimes. It had a few songs that got played to death, but it some really awesome songs that weren't (Jesus of Suburbia, Holiday, St. Jimmy).

    ReplyDelete
  88. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:27 AM

    Marry: Kourtney
    Fuck: J Wow
    Kill: Snookie

    ReplyDelete
  89. Yep, within a six-month span. Rare company he finds himself in, with pinfall victories on television over BOTH Flair and Hogan.


    (I do wonder who else could claim that "honor" now.)

    ReplyDelete
  90. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:29 AM

    Marry: Harley (she's loyal)
    Fuck: Catwoman
    Kill: Ivy

    ReplyDelete
  91. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:29 AM

    I'd fuck her before Lita.

    ReplyDelete
  92. I played STO about a year ago, and it was quite solid. But since they completely screwed around with the GUI, I haven't been comfortable with it.

    ReplyDelete
  93. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:32 AM

    I want Marquez to fight Thurman or drop to 140 and go for a title there before he wasts time with a Pacquiao fight. He was 11 last night so he can make that weight.

    Alvarado should move up to 147 or 154. He couldn't make the weight last night.

    ReplyDelete
  94. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:33 AM

    You could never cheat on Emma and Jean because they'd know.

    ReplyDelete
  95. Man Tom Jane in Boogie Nights. "We want what's in the goddamn safe in the master bedroom in the motherfuckin goddamn floor safe! "

    ReplyDelete
  96. I could see Bruno going 60+ (and boring a crowd to sleep)... but Gorilla?


    Dear god, that poor crowd.

    ReplyDelete
  97. NFL 2k5 seems to be football's No Mercy.

    ReplyDelete
  98. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:36 AM

    Alvarado will be a gateway fighter that may luck out and win a belt here and there.

    ReplyDelete
  99. Some trashy women's group beat them to it, IIRC.

    ReplyDelete
  100. As Abeyance said, 365/2 on 1.5 is only the cutscenes. You'd have to get a DS to actually PLAY the game.

    ReplyDelete
  101. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 7:47 AM

    Marry: Martha
    Fuck: Julie
    Kill: Diana

    ReplyDelete
  102. agreed, they were so few matches announced for this card bc Goldberg v Nash was HUGE at this time. Nash was white hot after the whole Wolfpac ordeal, and Goldberg was Goldberg. Too bad tht had to fuck it up with the finger poke later, but this match was the selling point where a great undercard really wasnt needed.

    ReplyDelete
  103. Brat was hot for like 3 years


    McLyte, FTW

    ReplyDelete
  104. MFK

    CultStatus
    CultStatus
    CultStatus

    ReplyDelete
  105. Try adding some PN News to any tagline and it's hilarious.

    What about me?! What about Raven!?! YO BABY YO BABY YO!!

    ReplyDelete
  106. You mean Nexus guys beating on local jobbers.

    ReplyDelete
  107. This was one of the first WCW shows I watched live and it sucked compared to wwf at the time

    ReplyDelete
  108. When you feed THE BOD TOP 20 you're giving them the wildlife equivalent of junk food. Instead of eating a wide range of natural foods, members of THE BOD TOP 20 depend on processed seeds, bread and other foods that are not part of their natural diet. This can make THE BOD TOP 20 very sick.

    Members of THE BOD TOP 20 that expect to be fed by people can become aggressive, harassing people for food when they are hungry.

    Once THE BOD TOP 20 you're feeding knows that you are a reliable source of food,
    they may converge on your home or campsite, potentially disrupting their migratory patterns and displacing other species. If members of THE BOD TOP 20 flock to be near you, their newfound population density may encourage the spread of communicable diseases between them.

    They may also lose their ability to forage for natural foods.

    Think twice before you feed THE BOD TOP 20 - a moment's pleasure for you may
    lead to THE BOD TOP 20 becoming addicted to junk food.

    ReplyDelete
  109. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 8:07 AM

    That was when he was in his "Wannabe Flair" stage, capped off with the match he wore the purple tights and white boots.

    ReplyDelete
  110. This is one of the shows that no matter how awful it is, I absolutely love (Survivor Series 1990 being the other prime example). At the first house show I ever went to as a 5 year old at Boston Garden, my dad and I found a VHS tape containing this show and SummerSlam 1991, I have probably watched this show more than anyone else ever has due to that.

    ReplyDelete
  111. Heenan had JUST had neck surgery to deal with his chronic neck problems, and had basically told EVERYONE to leave him alone that night. Either Pillman was trying to rib Heenan, or he had missed the message somehow.


    Funniest part: Heenan apologies to Bischoff afterward, and all Bischoff says is "What are you apologizing for?" So either Bischoff didn't see it, or he liked it. Go figure.

    ReplyDelete
  112. He wasn't that much shorter than Benoit, maybe a couple inches.

    ReplyDelete
  113. YankeesHoganTripleHFanMay 18, 2014 at 8:14 AM

    "Hey Scotty J!!!"

    ReplyDelete
  114. YankeesHoganTripleHFanMay 18, 2014 at 8:15 AM

    Meh I prefer..."I like women with small hands...It makes my dick look bigger"

    ReplyDelete
  115. ... Cult is JHID?


    :o

    ReplyDelete
  116. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 8:18 AM

    I have no idea what you're talking about but it was funny, so thumbs up!

    ReplyDelete
  117. YankeesHoganTripleHFanMay 18, 2014 at 8:18 AM

    For me it's Summer Slam 90....I wanted Hulk to get well SO BADLY. (The Harts regaining the title also ruled)

    ReplyDelete
  118. When did Elway switch teams? I know he was originally drafted by the Colts, but he never played for them. What Eli did in 2004 was done by John 21 years earlier.

    ReplyDelete
  119. ... and I just needed to scroll down.

    ReplyDelete
  120. It's a decent little show.

    Old school, it'll rarely blow you awag but is a pleasant hour

    ReplyDelete
  121. You know, in all seriousness, Eric Bischoff went from low-level announcer to running the entire company in a matter of a few years. To do that in a big corporation such as Turner is actually quite impressive.

    ReplyDelete
  122. ... because they can?

    ReplyDelete
  123. That would have to be the case, it's not like there's TONS of recaps on stuff that old, and out of all that was filmed back then, I bet less than 5% still exists in some form.


    (The only tapes were the TV station's... and there are too many sad stories of such tapes being reused for other programming.)

    ReplyDelete
  124. Styles is NJPW, as are the Young Bucks. This was a cross-promotional show.

    ReplyDelete
  125. That has been my response to my sister and aunt for the last decade. Shuts them the fuck up in an instant.

    ReplyDelete
  126. Same here. I'll look up the others real quick...


    Fuck Asa, Kill Jamie.

    ReplyDelete
  127. Yeah, I'd go this way also.

    ReplyDelete
  128. I'm 50/50 on Charlotte and Bailey there. Could easily go either way.

    ReplyDelete
  129. Hell no. Between the BJ and being stuck in that job, I'd blow my brains out in less than a year.

    ReplyDelete
  130. F: McGuirk, she looked quite nice back then.
    M: Marissa, just to get half of Shane's money. ;)
    K: Wyand, she's worthless in every possible way.

    ReplyDelete
  131. Out of those three:


    M Jasmine
    F Cinderella
    K Snow, for the same reason Jef mentioned below. I don't want exhumed eighths.

    ReplyDelete
  132. M: Velma
    F: Judy
    K: Olive (This was true BEFORE Claire Lynch.)

    ReplyDelete
  133. I guess. I don't think anyone expected a ***** classic or anything, though. Even with Nash going over, they could have done a millions different interesting things going forward. Sadly, they decided to go an alternate route.

    ReplyDelete
  134. M: Zelda: You know she's still a virgin.
    F: Samus: Once the Metroids arrive, there goes the neighborhood
    K: Peach: Jesus, who HASN'T banged her by now?

    ReplyDelete
  135. Rampage and Tito were "part" of Aces and Eights, Mo just showed up to mess with Roode, IIRC.

    ReplyDelete
  136. "Who buys books in paper format anymore?"


    Me. And my copy of Wrestling's Made Men sitting here next to me proves that. (It came in FAST, the others are likely coming in middle/late next week.)

    ReplyDelete
  137. Maybe "payoff" wasn't the proper word, but the FOLLOW-UP has been truly awful - Bryan gets "demoted" to feuding with Stephanie and running away from Kane, while Trips moves on to bigger and better things.

    ReplyDelete
  138. He only ran away from Kane that one time to protect his wife. Every other time he stood up to him and even beat him clean at ER. Which he also main evented over Hunter btw. And what's wrong with having another hot program to take place that's not involving the title? Isn't that what everyone was complaining about?

    ReplyDelete
  139. I read all 5 A Song of Ice and Fire novels in paper format and to be honest I'm glad I did. All my Tolkein stuff is paper as well. Everything else I read digitally though. In fact I just got the first 3 Dresden Files books for 2 bucks each on Amazon yesterday so I can finally check that series out.

    ReplyDelete
  140. That whole scene was fucking incredible.

    ReplyDelete
  141. TBS was mostly built on the Atlanta Braves and pro wrestling. As long as he was in charge, WCW was basically guaranteed.


    The one time Turner execs considered shunting WCW off (early 90's IIRC), Turner walked into the meeting, said WCW isn't going anywhere, and that was that. Once he merged/sold out to AOL/TW... then the landscape became much more hostile for WCW.

    ReplyDelete
  142. To be fair, NO ONE (at until Austin) drew like Hogan did. . .

    ReplyDelete
  143. Yea, that Xmas thing is interesting. It was a HUGE business period during the territory days but has somehow evolved into a business lull for wrestling.

    ReplyDelete
  144. Paper books are better, in my opinion, but I do like downloading Scott's books from Amazon and Thomas Hall's reviews are good downloadable books too. And inexpensive.

    ReplyDelete
  145. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 9:32 AM

    I sense a common theme with this.

    *Googles Lisa Ann*

    ..ah:

    http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/1814197/massive-facials-2-sc1-lisa-ann-new.gif

    ReplyDelete
  146. Seems like every Starrcade after 1996 was pure butt.

    ReplyDelete
  147. Why didn't they just book Goldberg defending against Hogan or hold off on Goldberg's title victory until Starrcade and have him beat Hogan?

    ReplyDelete
  148. Are you calling Hoss/Lorenz out?

    ReplyDelete
  149. The first Montana was okay, and basically became Madden on the early systems once it was slowed down.


    Montana II forward did have their... quirks. Fake Punts with the Lions in Montana II was SO BROKEN, it was funny.

    ReplyDelete
  150. Bischoff was all about television. (And in fact he was called into a Time Warner meeting in August 1998 where they told him that WCW isn't a pro wrestling company, it's a television company).


    The mentality (and not just with Goldberg's title victory) was that PPV would be a limited viewership, but tv would bring in maximum viewers to see a big event, and of course it was about Nitro beating RAW.


    I also believe that Nash going over at Starrcade helped business, the January 4 Nitro was good for business(as ratings and buyrates increased in the immediate aftermath of January 4 1999). It all went shitshaped when Hogan dropped the belt out of nowhere to Flair, then Flair almost immediately dropped it to DDP, and Hogan turned face.


    In fact, the moment that fans turned to RAW on January 4 1999 was NOT when Tony Shiavone made fun of Foley. It was when DDP came out for a match. Likewise, Nitro's ratings and WCW PPV buyrates remained very strong through Hogan's early 1999 reign. it was when DDP won the World Title at Spring Stampede that the bottom started to fall out.

    ReplyDelete
  151. Well originally Starrcade was during Thanksgiving.

    ReplyDelete
  152. I know. The Xmas trend isn't exclusively about Starrcade. Completely independent

    ReplyDelete
  153. It's still an interesting debate to have, should Nash have ended Goldberg's streak, all these years later. Of course I don't think how awful the aftermath was is really up for debate.

    ReplyDelete
  154. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 9:47 AM

    TGGI

    ReplyDelete
  155. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 9:48 AM

    "F: 1994

    OHHHHHHHHHHH YEAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!!

    DID IT!"



    FTFY

    ReplyDelete
  156. Nash/Goldberg was THE biggest match they could have put on at the time with Hogan on sabbatical. Nash was over HUGE. It was a HUGE match. Anything else is complete revisionist "Nash backlash" history

    ReplyDelete
  157. It may have been a hot angle but it made their world title look like a joke. And I know the whole "it's just a prop" argument but look at the whole Daniel Bryan saga. The whole emotional crux of the story was him getting screwed out of it CONSTANTLY by a higher authority who thought they knew better than the fans. And when he finally wins it at the biggest show of the year it's one of the most satisfying wrestling moments in YEARS.

    ReplyDelete
  158. Ah, the Indian deathlock. As Scott has noted, the only non-shitty version is Muta's bridging one; even still, it's kinda funny watching Mike Graham thinking "Alright, THIS is gonna pop the crowd!"...and then he probably blamed the match on Ricky afterwards.

    ReplyDelete
  159. I scarcely see how that's relevant. The long term plan was for the nWo to screw Goldberg out of the title, put it back on Hollywood, and gloat. The first few PPVs of 199 would be Goldberg-Hall, Goldberg-Luger, Goldberg-Bigelow and Goldberg-Nash, ultimately leading to Hogan-Goldberg 2 on PPV for the World Title. Where it all went wrong was the belt quickly being moved to first Flair, and then Page, Hogan turning face, and Goldberg's charge through the nWo suddenly turning into him spearing Bret "metal plate" Hart right before Owen died and Bret left. Fans weren't pissed off that Hogan and Nash screwed Goldberg for the belt. We were pissed off that there was never a proper Hogan-Goldberg payoff.

    ReplyDelete
  160. I choose to believe that there wasn't an actual discussion about changing Nash from Oz to Vegas. I like to imagine that gimmicks in WCW were determined by spinning a big roulette wheel; the kind normally reserved for picking Halloween Havoc main event match-types. I can just picture it being assembled by Dusty Rhodes in a fit of madness one day and the company buying it for a ridiculous amount of money (because WCW). Had Nash's spin gone just a little bit differently he would have been Arachnaman, or a new member of the Freebirds, or Harriet Tubman.

    ReplyDelete
  161. That's why I hate the finger poke of doom killed wcw argument. In theory, it's a good plan. Give Goldberg a huge heel stable to run through I'm order to get to Hogan. Can't help it that Goldberg went and punched a window and was shelved for months and fucked up the entire angle

    ReplyDelete
  162. Preach it man. History has been rewritten to blame the fingerpoke but they were fine for good while after that.

    ReplyDelete
  163. ... and that wheel was repurposed by the WWF years later for RAW Roulette.

    ReplyDelete
  164. The opening video is all about Goldberg vs. Nash, even though it's arguably not even the main event.


    Uh?

    ReplyDelete
  165. Goldberg punched a window in 2000. Not 1999

    ReplyDelete
  166. You're right. Refresh my memory why the angle fell apart then. I remember bad luck with injuries

    ReplyDelete
  167. Just checking in this thread to see if people have tried to rebook WCW after the fingerpoke of doom for 17,186th time. And, yes, they did.

    I'm just going to have to trust those who say Nash was a big deal at the time because, like a lot of others, I had almost completely stopped watching WCW by this time. When your booking makes less sense than Russo's on the other channel, you're in trouble. I always thought it was too little, too late with Nash in WCW. He would've been much better served if the Wolfpack fought the Hollywood group in the Spring of that year. Him not kicking Hogan's ass just seemed so much of a letdown from 97-99. To me, Nash seemed to get big pops, but nothing like the emotional or orgasmic ones you'd get for the Austin-Rock-Foley trio.

    ReplyDelete
  168. Goldberg messing up his arm is revisionist history from Nash when he tries to explain why the angle failed.

    ReplyDelete
  169. that he was booking by that time period

    ReplyDelete
  170. I liked that Montana game, but better than Madden?

    ReplyDelete
  171. Probably describes his first time with steph after being with chyna too.

    ReplyDelete
  172. There is no argument. Goldberg v. Nash was the main event. It was a huge deal at the time

    ReplyDelete
  173. Most casual observers and WWF fans could see WCW getting desperate to the point of embarrassment in late 1998. They were booking week-to-week and it was killing them. They already felt like a sinking ship. So, it wasn't after the poke...it was before. It was turning Bret, letting Warrior get too much time, squashing Wrath, the public storyline weirdness with Hall, etc.



    I remember family members falling asleep during Starrcade 98. It wasn't nearly as huge as your revised revisionist slant is making it out to be.

    ReplyDelete
  174. It fell apart because, and this is not unsurprising for WCW, they changed direction several times over the next few months.


    Had they stuck the course and built to Hogan-Goldberg 2 for the World Title on PPV, it would have been huge.


    Again, the problem wasn't January 4 1999. That did great business, and built up anticipation from the fans. The problem was that there was never a proper payoff.

    ReplyDelete
  175. Umm, no. It was the biggest match wcw could put on at the time. I don't know how that's even debatable.

    Everything I've written about it has been within context relative to wcw.

    ReplyDelete
  176. It outsold WM for that year

    ReplyDelete
  177. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 12:06 PM

    Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  178. Jef Vinson (Homewreckers Inc™)May 18, 2014 at 12:07 PM

    Feel that thing above your head? That is called the glass ceiling. Once you get into the Top 5 we will work on getting you there.

    ReplyDelete
  179. TUF as a format can't be counted on to drive ratings. Fox isn't promoting it now, never really seemed to know how to promote it and the constant switching of time slots and formats has damaged the brand to this point. Even if the upcoming strawweight season is for something tangible it doesn't mean anyone will watch. Given that it's a women's division it means that ratings will somehow tank even further.

    UFC's amount of product isn't an issue if the injury bug hadn't bitten. The UFC's PPV business model has traditionally been built around a big 3, big 4 or big 5 (1st big 4 of their early PPV era was Hughes, Franklin, Liddell, Couture. Supplanted by Hughes, GSP, Penn, Liddell, Couture. Later Silva, GSP, Lesnar). They have a pretty decent drawing group right now in Rousey, Jones, Cain.

    If you have 4 horses, you can ride them twice a year. That gets you 8 PPV cards. You stack the remaining 4-6 PPV cards with lesser weight champions and contender fights and you put non-drawing champions/non-drawing contenders, up-and-coming action fighters on free TV. The business model works.

    The problem is just that the UFC's horses have had all kinds of injuries. GSP took his ball and went home. Cain is out for awhile. Jones is delivering as expected and his next fight will be a super-fight. Silva's star was extinguished and it's unclear as to whether Weidman can be a star.

    They have enough talent to fill their cards, they just need their talent to show up for work.

    ReplyDelete
  180. Please do, it sums up the BoD nicely.

    ReplyDelete
  181. AverageJoeEverymanMay 18, 2014 at 1:36 PM

    Also 1 * 2 * 3 = 6

    ReplyDelete
  182. Marry: Pam
    Fuck: Elaine
    Kill: Dee

    ReplyDelete

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