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Excuses

Hi Scott,

I'm not sure where I heard about this, whether it was an article or a podcast, but I remember John Cena saying about getting negative reactions during his matches being a GOOD thing. One example was when he and Orton battled it out for the WWE WHC and the crowd sh*t all over it and started the 'Daniel Bryan' chants. He says that any reaction during a match is a good thing as it shows that the fans are 'into' it. I have to disagree.

For me, babyfaces should be cheered and heels should be booed - simple as that. It seemed as though Cena was trying to excuse not getting the right reactions. I know there are a million and one rants/articles/debates about the Cena character etc but surely if he (or any babyface) is getting negative reaction then they're not doing their job as a babyface (other than him being stale as hell)?

And yes, he IS a babyface; I know there are those that say he is a face to children etc etc, and a heel to older males, but that's crap - he doesn't cheat, he always does the noble thing, he always panders to the audience: none of these things/traits are heel-like. Despite those that boo, he is presented as a babyface.

What is your take on babyfaces getting the 'wrong' reactions (and heels getting positive reactions when, surely, their job is to be hated?!)? Are WWE just assuming that we will cheer and boo for who we're meant to?

Keep up the good work on the blog!

​Clearly they should turn Cena heel and it would fix everything.  

The problem with Cena is more that his material is just so bad.  If he wasn't booked to win EVERY match or be incredibly protected in his losses, or even show a bit of vulnerability sometimes, people would be more inclined to actually cheer him.  But when he shakes off every setback and makes poopy jokes the day after a supposed career-defining loss, he's just not likable.  But yes, WWE just assumes we will cheer and boo who they tell us to, which is why the Daniel Bryan thing was such a fight on both sides.  ​

Comments

  1. ...cenawinslol.

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  2. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 10:10 AM

    All money to be in the bank, and not on the table.

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  3. I'm expecting the briefcase match to be better than the title match, but the booking in the title match to have a better direction.

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  4. We were also "supposed" to cheer for Rocky Maivia and boo Stone Cold Steve Austin. However, we didn't, and it changed the course of wrestling forever. This whole "you're supposed to cheer for faces and boo heels" is the newest pretentious wrestling elitist outlook. It's hilarious.

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  5. I'm expecting to be the best PPV on June 29th 2014.

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  6. Cena
    Rollins
    Usos
    Paige
    Rusev
    Rhodes Brothers
    Summer Rae....?

    BANK on it.

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  7. Something tells me that reasoning wouldn't fly for guys further down the card.

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  8. Wyatts over Usos. Otherwise, yes.

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  9. Wrestling fans determine who the faces and heels are and WWE forgot that.

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  10. That's the one I'm most iffy on but I don't see Rowan/Harper going over on a PPV and not Bray.

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  11. WWE always puts on solid wrestling shows. They are like junk food. Short term pleasures with no long-term reedeming value. People will say this show was great and then three weeks later we will be asking what happened on this show.

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  12. Every PPV from Night of Champions 2013 to Royal Rumble 2014 would like to have a long talk with you.

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  13. "Despite those that boo, he is presented as a babyface."

    And they've known for about eight years now that presenting him as such is precisely what makes him a heel to such a large percentage of us, so yes, there is something to the belief that he's a heel to those who want him to be one.

    Cena is, quite obviously in my opinion, right. It doesn't matter if they cheer Cena or if they get behind his opponent. All that matters is the fans make an emotional investment in the match. Regardless of how he's presented, getting huge face pops hasn't been Cena's end game in a long time.

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  14. Cena has some of the best matches but the character is beyond stale. I'm not saying turn him heel, but make him relatable to fans

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  15. Exactly. And while it's obviously never turned Cena full-blown heel, his willingness to play the heel in a neutral, non-crowd pandering style helped launch the megaface runs for Punk, Bryan and RVD. (Obviously not Cena's fault that RVD fucked his run up.)

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  16. I expect that WWE is kind of painted in the corner with the main event and with Brock being the next big challenger. I think the ideal winner to tonight's match would be Bray or Reigns, but it's a waste to give either of them the title just to transition to Brock and I doubt they let Brock end the streak just to lose his follow up match. I'm assuming the year-long story is Brock beating Taker, winning the title and then main eventing next year's Mania.


    Because of that, the only real solution is putting it on Cena to give the most name value in Brock vs Champ match and also put the title on someone who won't be impacted at all by a short title reign.

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  17. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 10:23 AM

    You've just made me look back in the last ten years of my life and I'm quite depressed.

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  18. You didn't like the wrestling on those shows?

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  19. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 10:24 AM

    No idea who is going to win the Title but I assume I'll be disappointed,

    I'm just excited that I'll see two **** matches.

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  20. I think parallax wins for best comment. As for tonight, Cena wins of course.

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  21. I wouldn't say they forgot it just because Cena is nominally still a face. They openly acknowledge how many fans hate him and have done so for years. They've let Cena be the foil for the guy they know we prefer to cheer for many times.

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  22. I liked some matches, but the bad outweighed the good only everyone of those PPVs irrc. I do agree, for the most part, what you're saying though.

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  23. "But yes, WWE just assumes we will cheer and boo who they tell us to"

    I think this is less true than ever, actually.

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  24. I'm not really speaking on the booking which is where I'm guessing you have the issue. The matches themselves are almost always quality.

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  25. Plus the idiots refused to believe Bryan was the hottest wrestler on the roster. Hell the fans made them change storylines because of it.

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  26. I wouldn't say he played the heel in those fueds, but he didn't play the face.. if that makes any sense. I do think he has some heelish qualities, though. Whether it's intentional or not, that smirk he makes before the 5 knuckle shuffle as the crowd boos him is enough to make you want to slap that shit eating grin off his face.

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  27. Yeah, but cheering for Daniel Bryan during a Cena/Orton match is not the fans investing in THAT match; it's the fans actively rejecting it.

    Cena needs to settle into the "Babe Ruth of wrestling" role that Vince offered Hogan and Bret in the 90s. Being a big draw but in the mid-card and out of the way is the next big thing. I really feel like that process has started, and if Bryan weren't injured and there were literally any other options, Cena wouldn't be getting the belt today.

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  28. Poor Big E about to job again.

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  29. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 10:33 AM

    I'd like Cena to win the title just because he can drop it back to Brock without losing any cred. Anyone that wins their first title tonight only to get smoked by Brock in a month will be damaged goods unless they really have a strong and compelling plan in place for them.


    Plus it would tie in to the earlier Cena/Lesnar match and set up the eventual rubber match.


    Best choice all around says I.

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  30. Knuckleberry PinnJune 29, 2014 at 10:35 AM

    One thing (of many) that sets ppvs of today apart from ppvs of years ago is just how overproduced things are. When things are calculated to a tee, you lose the "Raw" (heh) feeling that often makes a show great.

    I bet tonight for the MITB and title ladder matches we will see ladders decorate the aisle, ladders plastered on the same HD set that they use for every ppv, and some of the most contrived spots you'll see all year.

    You'll probably hear Michael Cole say "wait, Sheamus is back up! The 6'5, 260 pounder who has never won a MITB match before makes his way back into the ring!"

    You'll hear that Justin announcer (and it's telling that I don't know his last name off hand) yell "SSSSJJJJJJJEEAANNN CEEEEEEEEEEEENA!"

    And you know what, everything being micro-managed will almost guarantee the ppv won't be bad. TLC this past December was the first ppv in ages that I thought wasn't great, and even then it was ok.

    But, we won't get an over the top pay per view without letting things happen organically. We got MITB 2011 as the last time the company strayed from it's comfort zone in the slightest, and look how great that turned out to be.

    Sometimes, you just need a boring old survivor series '02 set for a cozy feel, you need to let a ladder leg bend and let the wrestlers figure out how to deal with it, you need cheesy swinging hooks because, dammit, the show is called BACKLASH.

    So, my expectation is a good ppv, but not a memorable one.

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  31. Yeah. They should just have him wrestle Swagger on RAW every week in place of the weekly comedy skits. I don't like either guy but when they wrestle each other, they have some good chemistry. That EC opener was the tiiiits.

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  32. The Bryan chants during Cena/Orton were bad- well, I thought it was hilarious- but that's the exception with Cena. I can't think of another example of the crowd hijacking a Cena match like that.

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  33. Exactly, he plays heel by the absence of any face tropes/mannerisms/etc.

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  34. I do admire how well Cena has coped with being on top for so long, many people have gone wayward through injuries, mental fatigue or succumbing in other ways to what must be an immense pressure.

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  35. Bullshit. Austin was treated as a face once they finally came around to the idea that he was the guy. It wasn't through his actions directly, but rather, it was how his opponents acted. Austin was a face because Vince and Shane and Undertaker were that much worse than Austin. The WWF most certainly presented Austin as a face, they just did it in post-modern '90s anti-hero aesthetics.

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  36. Yeah, to me, Wyatts capture all the gold in front of a northeast crowd would be a winner. But you know Brock's waiting to take the title in a month, eh.

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  37. I'm expecting a 3000+ comment thread.

    I'll be watching CFL.

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  38. Well, Rhodes Family were a diamond in the roughage during most of that time period. In fact, they stole nearly every show. They had an awesome, awesome match with the Shield at Battleground. An awesome three-way between the Usos and Shield at Hell in the Cell. Their traditional Survivor Series match stole that show. And their 4-way match stole TLC.


    The only other match that stood out to be from that time was Wyatt vs. Bryan at the Royal. Really awesome, hot opener. I found every Bryan/Orton match to be solid but disappointing on PPV. I liked both their Raw matches a lot better.

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  39. I think is gonna be a solid show due the ladder matches.I had Barrett to win the briefcase as Ambrose would take Seth out in the match.


    The WWE title ladder is really simple.CENA WINS LOL


    THEN
    NOW
    FOREVER!

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  40. Porn Peddlin' Jef VinsonJune 29, 2014 at 10:44 AM

    Heel Big E + Mark Henry + heel Cameron = Black Power.


    You're welcome.

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  41. I would love for either that to happen, with Bryan getting his return match at Royal Rumble to avenge his Royal Rumble loss from one year prior and Brock winning the Rumble to set up WM or Reigns to win and reverse that setup, Brock winning at the Rumble and Bryan winning the Rumble.

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  42. solid but disappointing on PPV


    this about sums up most of their shows.

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  43. I think the briefcase match is set up for an Ambrose vs Rollins finish with Rollins winning, but I hope they let Ambrose win it. I think he is ready to explode as a main player with his insane character and letting him threaten every match with possible Ambrose anarchy would be a ton of fun.

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  44. I will not be forgetting WMXXX any year soon.

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  45. Dig all of that, sure.

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  46. They get it right every now and again.

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  47. People were chanting "Daniel Bryan" because THEY WANTED TO SEE DANIEL BRYAN and not the 12th Cena vs. Orton PPV match.

    I think any other explanation is denial.

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  48. Well, that only accounts for about 75% of your life the last ten years. I'm sure you cured cancer or something with the other 25%.

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  49. ripping on Cena winning isn't even fun anymore. That's about as stale as the rest of the show.

    The thread last night had a lot of hate for Brock winning. We don't want to admit it but they have us conditioned a certain way now. If they break script we think something is wrong. I don't think the majority of us could handle them throwing out the script and going all Russo on us.

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  50. I am unwavering in my belief that Cena desperately needs a heel turn. He should've been turned heel years ago when got poor reactions against Edge.

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  51. Proof that WWE is so far off the pulse of it's fans rested in the Batista situation. They expected the fans to cheer him from the Rumble all the way through Wrestlemania, and that lasted 11 seconds past the initial "Welcome back pop". So then they throw Bryan in the main event acting like they just gave the IWC a pity fuck of a lifetime.


    Meanwhile, they continue to bury guys the fans want to see for a million stupid reasons, and instead we get hilarious coffee jokes filling up a 3 hour RAW based on something that happened in a Wednesday meeting. Genius.

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  52. Cena winning is definitely the right choice,love or hate him,he is always a credible champion.

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  53. It's the right choice and the best choice which sums up the problems with the company.

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  54. I think he means that WWE went with the crowd in the case of Austin and Rock. WWE has been fighting the fans about Cena for years.

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  55. The two MITB Ladder matches will be great, everything else will probably range from decent to forgettable.

    Predicted Winners:
    Cena - Makes the most sense, business wise and to get to Brock's Summerslam title match.

    Rollins - Before BNB's injury, I would have gone for Barrett, but I don't know if he's even in the match now.

    Usos - Don't see the Wyatts winning yet.

    Paige - Given time, her and Naomi could put on a good match, as long as there's not too much Cameron drama on the outside.

    Rusev - duh.

    Goldust and Stardust (The DustBusters? nah.) - double duh.

    Summer Rae - I guess. This is just Smackdown-level filler, here.

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  56. If they wanna drop to Brock at SS,it will bring a problem.How many is he gonna appear to defend it.

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  57. If the Wyatt's lose their heat is gone.

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  58. Yep. Go ask Luger about "yet."

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  59. I'm expecting a thousand quick camera cuts during the ladder matches, leading to seizures and a more intense dislike of Kevin Dunn.

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  60. Why Vince keeps this idiot?

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  61. Not at all. Those guys don't need the belts. I think they'll win tonight, but I don't think they lose their heat if they lose. They'll be over for a while longer.


    If anything, it helps the Usos look like world beaters.

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  62. Post-WM13, yes. Anything before that PPV and Steve Austin was presented as a heel who did heelish things, yet the fans loved him for it. Brutally destroying an old school veteran with bruised ribs, poking fun at his alcoholism and religious beliefs in the post-match interview to a face pop? Oh yes, that's certainly what they intended to happen.

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  63. Maybe they're going to bring out WWE-brand motion sickness tablets. Would have come in handy during some of those Shield six-man tags last year.

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  64. IF Wade Barrett manages to still be in the Briefcase match, I say he wins it, because I think Triple H is really enamored with the "Bad News" gimmick, and wants to be able to say it to someone when Wade decides to cash in. Rollins is also an acceptable answer for the briefcase, but I think Wade has more upside.


    Cena is the only logical choice for the title, given away completely by the poster fro the SummerSlam with Brock on it. Unless they want to feed someone else entirely to the monster. Still don't see the point of putting the title on Brock now, when he has a limited amount of dates, but whatever.


    I think the Wyatts win the tag straps, and StarDust beats Rybaxel in two fun tag matches.


    Rusev crushes Big E, because the WWE has ADD when it comes to big guys and pushing them.


    I will not be paying attention to any of the divas matches.


    Daniel Bryan addressing the WWE Universe is what I'm most interested in, as I'm afraid he's going to announce that he's being forced to retire due to the injury.


    It's going to be a solid show tonight. Definitely watching, definitely taking part in the open live thread and looking forward to having some fun.

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  65. The Batista situation couldn't be used for a more perfect topic.

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  66. I think Rusev/Big E is gonna end on double count out.I think at SS Big E is gonna beat him.

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  67. The big shows are generally memorable. Royal Rumble and WrestleMania this year - and most years - usually stick with me. And I think Money In The Bank has become one of their "Big" shows (hence the move to June, formerly the home of King of the RIng).


    I imagine we'll have implications from tonight lasting a while.

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  68. Rusev has already destroyed Big E. Honestly, 50-50 booking at this point would make zero sense. I'm hoping, at the very least, that Big E gets to break out of the camel clutch before tapping.

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  69. The reason is simple. 8 year old fans buy 10 times as many tshirts as 20+ year old fans.

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  70. Surely at some point, Swagger and Colter have to confront Rusev and Lana. It's worth trying Swagger as the all-American face, because there's nowhere for him to go as a heel.

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  71. I don't think anyone loses credibility losing to Brock. He's Brock frigging Lesnar! As long as someone stays even the slightest bit competitive with him before eating an F5, they look great.

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  72. Sure, why not? "We the People" is already kind of over. They would have to tone down the illegal immigrant rhetoric and move to more of a "USA - Love it or leave it!" mentality, but it could probably work.

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  73. Like the old Hulk Hogan chewable vitamins? A whole generation of kids unknowingly taking steroids.

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  74. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 11:19 AM

    Yes and no, having a foregone conclusion, lame duck run as your first title reign isn`t a good idea in my opinion. I would hate to see Reigns or Wyatt in that situation.

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  75. And they laugh it off with this annoying, "that silly wwe universe...so unpredictable..." Vibe

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  76. Swagger turns face, faces Rusev at Summerslam. Maybe before the show he gets a red, white and blue bus and he goes travelling across the country.....wait.

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  77. We only have less than a week for the WWE to set up a body slam challenge on the deck of the USS Intrepid! Get on that, Vince! I have the day off, I can go!

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  78. That's why they should give the win to Sheamus. Bonus, a nice and stiff Sheamus-Lesnar match.

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  79. I have a issue about the Ambrose/Seth feud,how are they gonna keep them away until a 1 on 1 match at SS?

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  80. That will be Cena's role.

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  81. So he vacates the US title?

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  82. They aren't. One-on-one match at Battleground that ends... not cleanly and then a rematch with stipulations at the SummerSlam. Then another rematch at Night of Champions, because WWE. And then they fight a few more times before they blow the feud off at Hell in a Cell.

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  83. Dirty_Dave_DelaneyJune 29, 2014 at 11:24 AM

    I never thought I'd be going into a WWE pay-per-view hoping that Cena wins the title since I hate the thought of seeing either Kane or Orton win the belt as I've heard many people speculate about. The part that worries me the most from what I've read online is the rumour that WWE want to swerve the fans due to that Summerslam poster being leaked revealing the main event of Lesnar/Cena II. That's just completely retarded on their part because their response to this really should be looking into preventing information from leaking out online as opposed to changing the finish to the main event.


    I'm also worried about the former members of the Shield and how their pushes go since it's been one moment Ambrose and Reigns are cutting killer promos against Rollins and then the next Reigns has seemingly forgotten about Rollins and is busy spiking the Authority's coffee instead! WTF? I have a feeling it's Ambrose that's going to end up more over and I fear that Reigns might start getting some backlash from the fans.

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  84. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 11:25 AM

    Yeah, no complaints about that either.

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  85. I guess. I, like the WWE, don't really give a shit about the US Title.

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  86. I was at the show.. greatest shit of all my life.

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  87. Oh, and obvious prediction: 'hometown boy' John Cena gets the crap booed out of him as usual.

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  88. They won't. They don't know how to milk shit.

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  89. He gets a "mixed reaction" according to Cole.

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  90. WWE's product has essentially become the Movie of the Week as opposed to the Must See TV it was a long time ago. Essentially, if you happen to catch one, good for you and you probably enjoyed yourself well enough for a while. If you didn't, oh well, you didn't miss anything important.

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  91. "Nobody gets a reaction lahk John Cena, Maggle! Some are cheerin', some are booin', but they're all makin' noise! Ha ha! I love it!"

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  92. My lasting image of Cena is seeing him smirk like a jackass after he lost "the biggest match of his life" to The Rock at WM28.

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  93. He did and essentially blamed his opponents for not doing a good enough job. If they were, they'd be getting the chants instead of Cena.

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  94. Cena is too young and talented to be relegated to that role at the moment. He should be in more non-title feuds like with Wyatt just to give everyone a break, but he hasn't hit the twilight of his in-ring career.

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  95. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 11:46 AM

    This Battleground PPV sounds like a giant waste of time.

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  96. They don't care, they already got your money.

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  97. According to you know who, Bryan probably wont be in the title picture anytime soon

    http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/news/327287/Backstage-Details-On-How-Daniel-Bryan-Is-Being-Viewed-&-Whether-He-Is-Still-Considered-A-Main-Eventer.htm

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  98. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 11:50 AM

    I'm dreading a 3000 comment thread.

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  99. I am expecting mediocrity and expecting to be surprised by the work rate like I was last month.

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  100. He also blamed the writers for not building any new stars. Coincidentally, these are the same stars that he buries and leaves for dead in a ditch.

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  101. I think the matches will be good but besides Reigns and maybe Cesaro, the Boston crowd is not going to really cheer for anyone else so the match could be cold.

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  102. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 11:53 AM

    This sounds like a "we know nothing but were still going to write something" article.

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  103. Why do you always say "the Summerslam"?

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  104. WWE foolishly tried to cool down their two most popular wrestlers -- CM Punk and Daniel Bryan -- in December/January in order to give Batista the spotlight as the returning conquering hero. They were stuck in nothing feuds, and all that did was make the fans cheer for Punk and Bryan harder and boo Batista when it became clear WWE didn't give a shit that they wanted to see Punk and Bryan.

    The fact that it was so obviously telegraphed that Batista was going to win the Rumble and win the belt at Mania when fans wanted to see Bryan or Punk in that role just added to it. Plus, he came out looking like a douchebag in his first appearance and then hugged mega-heel Triple H was just icing on the cake.

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  105. I seriously had no idea any of those non ladder matches were things that are happening.

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  106. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 11:54 AM

    Are you going to the show tonight?

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  107. I'm not. I couldnt find anyone to go with. There is a group of people I vaguely stay in touch with from high school that are going and if I reached out earlier, I could have gone with them but the tickets are not cheap and I can watch at home and be comfortable.

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  108. CM Punk got bigger reactions in his feud with Curtis Axel than Batista did for winning the Rumble. Their denial was just too stronk.

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  109. What are you trying to say, they have done a shit job at building up this show?

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  110. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 11:57 AM

    Bummer. Honestly though, unless you have great seats, I feel like watching the show at home is a better situation.

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  111. I think he lobbies for the complete opposite of that and is as touchy about being protected than Vince is.

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  112. Man all the silly ethnic stuff they tacked onto Rock's character. They get a little better generation by generation but the Usos dancing like tribal savages is still cringeworthy.

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  113. I'm pretty sure Cena is going to win, however, I would have not problem if they gave the title to someone we weren't expecting to get it, then have Cena take the belt bald at Battleground.

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  114. Agree. Why pay $80 to have to watch on the jumbotron when you can sit in comfort in home watching on the network.


    If it was a really hot show, which this isn't, I would have considered it more.

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  115. RVD "fucked his run up" by smoking pot..what did they expect? That's like criticizing water for being too wet.

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  116. Heh. Yesterday I read that they see Bryan as a big star, and putting him on the pre-show is a way of getting people to watch it, and today it's 'no big star would be put on a pre-show panel'.

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  117. If they give to Cesaro/Bray that made him lose to Cena it would make them lose their heat.Reigns is not ready yet,ADR/Sheamus/Orton are lame.

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  118. It's 411,they are usually like that.

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  119. 2012 was the height of ridiculousness with Cena; makes a bajillion dollars main eventing over the title match with a returning movie star and beats the returning former legit UFC heavyweight champion in a No Holds Barred match? Pretty good "Worst year of your life" - oh, and he divorces pre-fame wife to start fucking lots of divas. Sounds like a pretty good "Worst Year of Your Life" to me.

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  120. Maybe they could give the titles to one of those 3 lame ducks so they can defend it once at the lame duck PPV.

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  121. Which is all the more ridiculous. WWE is the only entertainment brand/company that I can think of that will take a hot property and decide to bury it instead of exploiting it.

    Bryan doesn't even get good merch in order to exploit his popularity.

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  122. Should we break it up into 3 separate threads for each hour like Mania?

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  123. Money in The Bank 2015: in 3D!

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  124. 2000 of them will be from Abeyance.

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  125. Yes... though in fairness I have "missed" most of the last 2 RAWs

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  126. Book it. Of course it's WWE so they will be doing comedy skits with Rusev by the end of the year.

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  127. It is. As bad as the commentary is it is often very difficult to follow along without it.

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  128. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 12:11 PM

    I kinda buy that. I see it more as keeping him out there than as burying him.

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  129. And WWE shows are WAY overpriced in my estimation.

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  130. I do have the "YES!" Che style t-shirt. WWE's t- shirts annoy the piss out of me though since they are really small fitting, you'd think with the fat slob wrestling fan stereotype they'd go a little larger; and the next size up is a garbage bag on me. First shirt I bought since the Edge: Sex and Violence shirt from 2006 which I had the exact same problem with. Also it was like 35 dollars shipped which is crazy.

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  131. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 12:12 PM

    Bret Hart homage?

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  132. I wish they had been steroids... maybe I would have broken 5'4"

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  133. No. You should just comment less.

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  134. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 12:13 PM

    Maybe you should just get your own thread.

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  135. Damn you, your response was funnier than mine!

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  136. Cena is right though. Chanting anything means the fans are into it. That's why Lesnar-Goldberg is remembered as such a success.

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  137. I'm still not sure why they jobbed Lesnar with both on their way out. i would have jobbed Goldberg since Lesnar was obviously the more valuable one to bring back down the line.

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  138. "I'm pretty sure Cena is going to win..." going out on a limb there?

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  139. Mister_E_SeesTheLineInTheSandJune 29, 2014 at 12:15 PM

    I have my moments.

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  140. He should have been booked to lose against Brock, win MiTB but then lose the title match, lose the Big Johnny feud, keep everything in the fall and January.

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  141. Oh i also forgot about another thing I am expecting...


    Cena
    Wins
    LOL!

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  142. I predict Dolph Ziggler does some crazy spot off the ladder and gets another concussion.

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  143. They are building depth to his character. He's not just a badass; he's a badass with pranks!

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  144. They have done a shit job at building up the show

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  145. Doing the MITB cash in at Raw 1000 was dumb. They should have used it at Night of Champions to help put the Cena/Punk match over the top.

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  146. Whipping up the BoD WarGames right now. It will be posted at 6:05

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  147. Rusev is being built as a heel for Cena. Cena will be defending America.

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  148. I think it was because they called an audible, the match was planned to go for like 20 some minutes, but the crowd kept crapping on it. Could also be because Bill was a face, so they would try to make it somewhat of a happy ending.

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  149. I legit don't think I could tell you who was in which ladder match... I think I will take a swing at it now...


    Championship:
    Reigns
    Cena
    Del Rio
    Kane
    Orton... that's all I know


    Briefcase
    Kofi
    Swagger
    Rollins
    Ambrose
    Sheamus?
    Barrett... is that it?

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  150. Vince needs to watch his own damn promo from 1997 making fun of good guys and bad guys.

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  151. I don't think their face/heel affiliation mattered at all to the NYC crowd. In deep WWE territory I would not go with the WCW guy; I think both were heels to the crowd and Goldberg probably the bigger one.

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  152. Roman Reigns forgetting about Seth Rollins and no longer interacting with Dean Ambrose is very similar to the way the Authority forgot Daniel Bryan existed after he won the title and he was sent off to feud with a heatless Kane.


    Dumb decision after dumb decision nowadays from those creative geniuses.

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  153. I find it funny that even when Cena was in his title match at SummerSlam, because of HHH Lesnar, Punk still wasn't in the main event.

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  154. MikeyMike, King of ClevelandJune 29, 2014 at 12:19 PM

    Sitting around smart wrestling fans is also pretty unbearable when going.

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  155. It's my tribute to Bret Hart.

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  156. I... don't get that vibe with the Uso's at all. It's a tribal dance, they don't act like savages or anything.

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  157. Do you do it with tears in your eyes?

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  158. I think they expected him to at least not fuck up so badly when they gave him two top titles.

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  159. Brock could have been the bigger heel of the night, Goldberg leaving was at least known ahead of time, Brock's was basically at the last minute.

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  160. I mean...why are they doing a tribal dance? It's not their "heritage" - they are from San Francisco.

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  161. I don't expect any Shield members to win their matches.


    I expect Harper/Rowan to win but Paige to retain.


    I expect the Rusev segment to be a bathroom break.


    I expect Cesaro and ZAPPATOO to win their matches.

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  162. Sheamus and Cesaro are in the Championship Match

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  163. Fair enough but I still don't get a savage vibe from it. I just consider it a unique entrance and them trying to get the crowd rilled up, which is part of your job as a wrestler.

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  164. Every time I say it, someone tells me it was the greatest Bret Hart homage they've ever seen, with tears in their eyes.

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  165. Fuck then who am i missing from the briefcase match?

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  166. It was a 14 minute match smack dab in the middle of the show, i can't imagine it was planned to go on much longer.


    The odds of them changing the finish mid-match are absurdly small.

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  167. Wyatt is in the championship match too


    RVD and Ziggler are in the briefcase match

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  168. I don't think they planned on there being that much stalling or lolly gagging with them getting 15 minutes on the biggest show of the year either.

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  169. That was a rather pathetic display on my part

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  170. I expect Swagger to injure someone else in the briefcase match.

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  171. Championship:
    Cena, Wyatt, Reigns, Cesaro, Kane, Del RIo, Orton, Sheamus.


    Briefcase:
    Rollins, Ambrose, Barrett, Kofi, RVD, Ziggler and Swagger

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  172. Not if it comes in the form of a DQ.

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  173. HHH vs. Lesnar wasn't a big enough match to deserve the main event, Punk vs. Lesnar was - and of course the former got the main event and the latter didn't, for obvious reasons.


    I had to look up the show on Wikipedia to find CM Punk d. John Cena and The Big Show. Okay then...I remembered nothing about that card.

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  174. If it was booked the way you listed it I don't think it would have made a difference

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  175. Cena is 37, the exact same age Hogan was when he was asked to pass the torch the first time to Warrior, and the same age Bret was when he was asked to step aside for Diesel.


    And Cena has also been a main eventer for twice as long as either Bret or Hogan was, a stat that's probably more important.

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  176. Well look at you mister "I know all the people in both matches"


    Perhaps the apprentice is trying to overtake the teacher?

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  177. Orrrrr... I know how to use the Inter-World-Wide-Weberverse to look up the answer.

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  178. It's not being defended now. Bryan had what...two title matches. They don't seem to be missing it.

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  179. The fact that fans started booing the "new" and more corporate Cena character in the summer of 2005 and IT IS STILL GOING shows what is wrong with this company.

    ReplyDelete
  180. That wasn't the point of the exercise!

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  181. Lets not go too crazy now. Bret was main event in the WWF for 5.5 years so that's fair but Hulk Hogan was on top for his entire 10 year run.


    John Cena hits his 10 year on top run come Mania XXXI.

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  182. Probably should have just lied.

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  183. There is a PPV tonight? Well I gots nothing else to do and I have the WWE Network, so I'll be watching. Hoping for the start of the ex-Shield domination of the uppercard ranks. So Rollins all the way for the title with his first feud against Ambrose. LETS GO

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  184. Exactly. :: Sigh :: you have SO MUCH to learn still.

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  185. Rollins is in the briefcase match, not the title match

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  186. I'm saying Vince told Hogan after six years on top it was time to step aside for the Warrior.


    Cena is going on 8-9 years at the tippy-top guy.

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  187. I haven't watched Raw in two weeks! Let me live out my fantasies damnit!

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  188. You'll get Cena,deal with it.

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  189. Making people cry last night didn't help my cause?

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  190. Give us a reason to care. That's what the most effective heels and faces have in common.


    Cena's won everything everywhere--there's nothing left for him to strive for, no mountains to climb, no monsters left for him to vanquish. He's never really in danger. There's no tension to any of his matches or feuds.


    If Lesnar'd gone over in 2012, they could've run with a Rocky III story (Cena meets the unstoppable grinning monster, gets steamrolled, doubts himself, has to dig deeper than ever to overcome), but, well, you know...

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  191. Know-It-All Mr. Smarty Pants!

    ReplyDelete
  192. WWE merchandise markups are insane. That's part of their business model that hasn't changed in two decades. The only things I ever got from them were 2 WrestleMania DVD's that I couldn't find in stores and a Nexus hoodie. However, I bought during some type of "free shipping" period so I avoided parts of that.

    ReplyDelete
  193. The problem is, WWE won't do anything to tweak Cena's character the way they did with Maivia and Austin. Same corny ass material, same lack of vulnerability. Rock (especially after the initial heel turn) and Austin were also allowed to let their personalities show through their characters. I highly doubt the John Cena we see on TV is the real guy.

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  194. And was immediately brought right back to the top...

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  195. That i would agree with, even Larry Zbyszko wouldn't dare pull that shit.

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  196. And both were still main players for several years after. Cena is also a much better athlete/wrestler than Hogan ever was.

    ReplyDelete
  197. I still love the crowd hijacking the final segment of that RAW in Washington pre-TLC. Mark Henry is getting buried for his reaction to that, but you know what, Mark Henry fuckin' rules. CM Punk smiling and shaking his head was another LOL moment of that part of the show.

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  198. Over 8 years since those fans at One Night Stand threw his shirt back at him!


    8 FUCKING YEARS!!!

    ReplyDelete

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