Scott,
As a followup to the blading question, in terms of both guys taking punishment, what would you say is the most brutal match you have ever seen? In that regard I would disqualify the Mankind/Undertaker HITC match because while Foley took a scary shitkicking, The Undertaker hardly got hurt at all. Your thoughts?
Mike
Mike
William Regal v. Fit Finlay from WCW. Most notably that crazy stiff match at Uncensored 96 and then the wacky brawl on Nitro, but they beat the fucking fuck out of each other in those matches.
Nasty Boys vs. Cactus Jack/Maxx Payne at Superbrawl was 12 minutes of insanity, including a table suplex and a SICK shovel shot to the head. Just listen to Heenan during it; it's like he realized at that moment that wrestling as he knew it was dead.
ReplyDeleteGoing into Mankind/Taker, Taker was already on either a broken or severely sprained ankle, so if he didn't get "hurt" that might have been by design.
ReplyDeleteBenoit vs. Regal from one of the Pillman Memorial shows. Benoit was chopping Regal across the forehead and bridge of the nose and they were just headbutting the hell out of each other.
ReplyDeleteI'd also nominate the Vader/Cactus Jack match that Cactus won by countout to set up the powerbomb on the concrete angle. Mick gave Vader free reign to hit him in the face to get some blood from his nose and those were some brutal shots.
Funk vs Sabu at Born to be Wired.
ReplyDeleteSamoa Joe vs. Low Ki at the first Glory By Honor. They murderized each other.
ReplyDeleteI gotta say Mick vs. Rock I Quit Match was pretty brutal.
ReplyDeleteI'll never forget Sabu ripping his arm open on the wire and taping it up in the middle of taking a neckbreaker.
ReplyDeleteThe matches between the Undertaker and Giant Gonzalez were brutal too. Oh, wait, the writer probably had a different meaning for brutal.
ReplyDeleteThat shot of Foley rolling off the stretcher after getting thrown off the cage and running back to the Cell while laughing maniacally is one of my favourites ever.
ReplyDeleteThat match was at Slamboree, not Superbrawl although I think the first match the two teams had was on Superbrawl.
ReplyDeleteKevin Steen vs El Generico ladder match at PWG Steen Wolf. Just saw this recently and my god, do they beat the piss out of each other. Between the powerbombs on the apron and the turnbuckle brainbuster, this thing is just incredibly violent.
ReplyDeleteAlways thought the Ken Shamrock / Vader match was brutal - I read somewhere that Vader couldn't walk for week from all the kicks Shamrock laid in.
ReplyDeleteI find the Piper-Valentine Dog Collar match to be pretty tough to watch. They straight up beat the piss out of each other.
ReplyDeleteI think it was a broken ankle (watch the way taker stumbles after he drops down from the roof. Not a comfortable landing for him)
ReplyDeleteTaker carrying an injury was part of the reason behind Mick taking so many crazy bumps - Taker wasn't really in a position to work much of a normal match
Don't know if its even really in the running for most brutal ever but Lesnar Vs Cena is certainly the only occasion I can think of where the face of the WWE has been legitimately roughed up.
ReplyDeleteThose elbow shots that opened up his head had me wincing
Actually it was at Spring Stampede '94. Slamboree was Nastys vs Cactus/Kevin Sullivan. Superbrawl was a regular tag match with Nastys vs Cactus/Payne
ReplyDeleteIn addition to the Taker vs. Mankind match from KOTR 98, other picks for the most brutal matches I've ever seen are Rock vs. Mankind from the 99 Royal Rumble (I Quit) and Tully Blanchard vs. Magnum TA (the I Quit cage match from 85).
ReplyDeleteActually, those elbows aren't too painful. They're an MMA tactic to open up an opponent and make them bleed for the sake of the judges. I watched an interview with George St. Pierre and he talked about how the elbows are actually quick glancing blows that result in cuts that look worse than they are.
ReplyDeleteI doubt they tickle, though. 8 )
Yeah, but he's asking about a match where BOTH guys take punishement.
ReplyDeleteCactus Vs Funk in the finals of the IWA 1995 King of Deathmatch tourney is insane.
ReplyDeleteIt's the superbrawl one that I'm speaking of. Just non-stop violence
ReplyDeleteVader/Hansen was a stiff brutal match, but Regal/Finlay is up there as well.
ReplyDeleteYeah, Piper's ear looks like it's gonna fall off. That match still stands up well today
ReplyDeleteI think a chair shard to the head is a great finishing move. WHAT A MANEUVER!
ReplyDeleteAs someone who watched Taker/Mankind HIAC as it happened....that one. HHH/Foley at the 2000 Rumble is up there too. Mick Foley is nucking futs.
ReplyDeleteOddly enough, apparently Piper had a pre-existing ear condition and they booked the match around it to justify his hearing loss, rather than the previously accepted idea that the match caused the troubles. Just shows what an effective job announcers used to do in making people believe the storylines.
ReplyDeleteAnytime someone's EYE pops out of their head, its brutal.
ReplyDeleteNo mention of Muta/Hase, the match that CREATED THE MUTA SCALE!!!
ReplyDeleteAgain, if we are talking punishment to BOTH guys UT vs Mankind doesn't really work, the other pick is great though
ReplyDeleteAny time Steen and Generico meet brutality is in store...assuming the end of GBH XI was setting up Final Battle, ROH has got a hell of a main event for December
ReplyDeleteHe worked that match with a BROKEN FREAKING ANKLE. I can forgive him for that.
ReplyDeleteTHIS. Their rematches were insane too.
ReplyDeleteThe Stampede match had the more definitive bumps. By all rights, Mick Foley should have been f'n BRAIN DEAD after Saggs threw him off the elevated ramp right non his head.
ReplyDeleteI would also honorably mention the series of matches between Mike Awesome and Masato Tanaka both in Japan and ECW. They KILLED each other.
ReplyDeleteWatching it now. First time I've seen it. Brutal stuff.
ReplyDeleteWell, Masato killed Awesome...
ReplyDeleteUT-Brock from HIAC was pretty brutal.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure if that was the match the quote comes from, but Arn Anderson had a GREAT response to one of Mick's ramp to ground SPLATS! (paraphrasing, also OOC for Arn):
ReplyDelete"If I do that to a guy, and he gets up that quickly, I'm headed the other way."
I remember that BJ Whitmer/Jimmy Jacobs cage match that blew off their feud being pretty nuts.
ReplyDeleteAwesome killed Awesome.
ReplyDeleteThere's gotta be some Briscoe Brothers matches that fit this in some way shape or form, just can't place em.
ReplyDeleteAnd Samoa Joe vs Kenta Kobashi was pretty awesomely brutal.
Deathmatch stuff excluded, the most brutal match I've ever seen is Aja Kong vs. Yumiko Hotta, 1/24/94. It makes Regal/Finlay look like a pillow fight.
ReplyDeleteinteresting. I know on the Piper DVD he blamed the match, but we all know wrestlers, particularly from that generation, are often less than truthful and still like to work the fans, even from the comfort of an interview chair.
ReplyDeleteIs it fucked up that I read that in Vince McMahon's voice?
ReplyDeleteStan Hansen vs Toshiaki Kawada was always harsh. In particular the championship carnival bout from 1992. Kawada kicks the back of Hansen's head early on and it sets the tone for the rest of the match.
ReplyDeleteWell true. Not only in tying the (literal) knot but his in-ring decisions.
ReplyDeleteI do wonder if Tanaka feels bad about giving Awesome so many chair shot though. I mean, it isn't your fault, but at some level, you gotta think that if you went lighter on that one shot, or if you had vetoed some of those bumps.
Magnum TA-Tully Blanchard from Starrcade '85. Bob Caudle's screaming reaction at the piece of wood going into Tully's eye marks the height of my wrestling fandom and the greatest wrestling finish ever. Watching Magnum stalk Tully after the match with that shard of wood before throwing his head down and walking out with *his* belt cures Low Testosterone in adult males.
ReplyDeleteThis is true. Lesnar landed the slashes but not for all of them. He landed a classic Mark Coleman post up elbow (put hand on face, shift hand and drive elbow into target with full bodyweight behind it) on one of those and landed some really really nasty knees to the body also.
ReplyDeleteThat one postup elbow was vicious though. That probably hurt Cena more than everything else in the match combined. I was really surprised he agreed to take that one and it made the whole thing feel more "real" and brutal to me.
I guess it would be disqualified because only one guy is taking the beating, but Angle/Shane from KOTR 2001 I thought I was witnessing a murder. They actually told a pretty ineresting story too so it wasn't just a blood bath. Shane isn't skilled, so even the basic stuff looked like Angle was massacring him, Shane was way out of his league. One of those matches that still makes me cringe every time.
ReplyDeleteKobashi vs Sasaski, aka "The one where they chop each other a thousand times"
ReplyDeleteEdit:My bad,wasn't meant to be a reply.
- someone else was quicker.
ReplyDeleteno matter how often I see it, I still hate the end of the match. as Scott pointed out in his rant, Shane kicking out after being thrown through that glass twice made no sense whatsoever.
ReplyDeleteGenerico hasn't singed with ROH yet. I'm thinking it'll be Steen/Lethal at Final Battle, with Generico returning to interfere. He's still got DGUSA commitments to wrap up.
ReplyDeleteAssuming you're right, do you think they should run Steen vs Generico on the first I-PPV after Final Battle (currently the 11th anniversary show in march) or do they hold off an extra month for Supercard of Honor VII
ReplyDelete