Hey Scott,
Why all the changes to the main event of Survivor Series '93? Why not put Undertaker and Crush in from the beginning?
Thanks for the twitter follow,
Jim
Why all the changes to the main event of Survivor Series '93? Why not put Undertaker and Crush in from the beginning?
Thanks for the twitter follow,
Jim
Yeah, no problem...grumble grumble.
I have no earthly idea why they messed around with the main event so much that year, although I think they had a rough idea of trying to shake things up for fans or something stupid like that. I might dig through the WON from that period and see if Dave has any insight on it.
(Time passes)
So I checked, and 1993 Dave is, to the say the least, somewhat preoccupied with the Jerry Lawler rape accusations and the steroid indictments, and doesn't have anything to say about the weird substitutions other than noting them week to week. He does note that the 93 Series did the lowest buyrate in WWF history to that point, with 185,000 buys domestic, which today would have Vince McMahon doing cartwheels of joy. Times change indeed.
Heenan made that show bearable.
ReplyDeleteThey're telling stories!
ReplyDeleteBut seriously, maybe they were just telling a story? Tatanka's supposed to be on the team, he has his undefeated streak broken by Borga, which puts heat on Borga/Luger and opens up a spot to introduce Undertaker. Although I would have replaced Rick Steiner because I hate him.
I think yoy answered your oen question with the statement "why not put undertaker vs CRUSH..." Dont think Crush main eventing anything was the best call
ReplyDeleteI now have a mental image of Vince attempting to do a cartwheel only to tear several muscles in the process!
ReplyDeleteOn a slightly more serious note; Does anyone know if this was around the time Jerry Jarrett was supposedly placed to takeover booking if Vince was indicted on the federal charges? I only ask because after having a quick browse of the results it sounds like the sort of booking you feel quite Memphis-style what with HBK teaming up with a bunch of masked jobbers, the different gimmicks in the Doink match, the Roll n Roll Express going up against a Cornette managed team and the general weird booking,
LEGIT TOPIC:
ReplyDeleteIS 1993 THE WORST YEAR THE WWE HAS EVER HAD?
Not even close. Overall, WWF was often bland, but Raw was quite good for much of the year. There have been plenty of worse years since 2001.
ReplyDeleteIf you mean as far as losing money/having bad things happen backstage, it's a pretty strong combo. Although I'd have to say Benoit makes 2007 the undeniable winner.
Although I get your overall point, HBK (who had been ligit suspended for the previous 2 months) teamed up with the masked knights because he was a late replacement for Lawler, who had been charged with statutory rape about 2 weeks before the Survivor Series. That was more just plain old desperation than Memphis-style booking.
ReplyDeleteCornette was still promoting, booking, and performing in Smoky Mountain and running himself ragged doing so. As far as the WWF he basically only worked TV and PPVs. No way would he have time to serve on the WWF committee as well, though I assume he had some control over the Bodies/R'nR feud.
ReplyDeleteIts up there. Its subjective but Its one of my least favorite years ever.
ReplyDeleteI would say '94 and '95 were worse. '94 is when business really went into the tank and they were running Raw out of high school gyms and basically never venturing out of New England to tape TV. Vince was gone for much of the year, and that REALLY showed.
ReplyDeleteI agree that 93 is not the worst. I honestly point to 2009 or 2010. While we had some good ppv's and matches, the TV was highly unwatchable. RAW was 2 hours of unbearable guest hosts and jerking John Cena off, while SD was verbally being treated as the number 2 show and was boring as shit.
ReplyDeleteTaking Rick out of that match makes about as much sense as having just one Quebecer, wait..
ReplyDeleteThat's how I always perceived it--the swaps were simply booked that way.
ReplyDeleteTatanka wasn't exactly Goldberg, but he'd been undefeated for just shy of 2 years, and it was a fairly big deal for him to go down.
Vince wouldn't be doing cartwheels, he can't be seen as an amateur by stealing an NXTer's gimmick.
ReplyDeleteBringing in anonymous guys under various short-term masked gimmicks is pure Memphis.
ReplyDeleteI think you're underestimating Crush by a fair bit. The guy was incredibly over back in 1993 and could have been legit over as a top face or heel. I always thought heel Crush was money and for whatever reason they had him spinning his wheels after the Savage feud when he and Yoko could've run roughshod for a year as the tag champs.
ReplyDeleteYou might be right, I was young at the time so my recollection of him may be off. I just remember not finding him interesting or liking him at all.
ReplyDeleteMr. Perfect out - replaced with Randy Savage.
ReplyDeleteJerry Lawler out - replaced with Shawn Michaels. Which, when you see him paired with the three Knights, makes absolutely no sense.
There were supposed to be four Doinks. I assume that around this time Matt Bourne was out as Doink. They slapped face paint on The Bushwhackers and MOM. Was the original idea to be Matt Bourne and three other guys?
Tatanka out - storyline made sense, as Yokozuna and Ludvig Borga put him out. Undertaker replacing him was probably the idea the whole time. Quebecer Pierre out - replaced with Crush. Wasn't Pierre legit hurt?
Really, this show just sucked anyway. 1993 started bad, had a decent middle with the 1-2-3 kid story, then got worse again.
Why not just add the Undertaker and Crush and make it 5 on 5?
ReplyDeleteYou win.
ReplyDeleteThat was what I was trying to put across, although I forgot Shawn had been suspended months prior. I probably should have referred to the originally scheduled match with Jerry Lawler teaming with masked guys against the Harts.
ReplyDeleteHeenan made most of the '90s bearable.
ReplyDelete1995
ReplyDeleteSmackdown was solid from WrestleMania-the fall. Jericho, Punk, Mysterio, Morrison, Hardy, and others were tearing it up.
ReplyDelete...and something more companies should do. Is having Tyson Kidd job in two minutes somehow better than having The Canadian Kid do it? At least the latter doesn't taint a potentially useful talent.
ReplyDelete1993, 1995, 2003 are my personal choices.
ReplyDelete*Slow clap*
ReplyDeleteNot even close. RAW was LIKE A BOSS for most of the year and didn't suck until well into 1994.
ReplyDelete1993 sucked. I don't care what anybody says, Yokozuna was a terrible WWF Champion. His matches were boring beyond belief.
ReplyDelete2003 could have been okay if Triple H wasn't on Raw 95% of the time.
Aren't WWE doing that already with Tyson Kidd with the Los Locales team? But I do agree that having guys in masks doing competitive jobs isn't a bad thing and also would be a good use to let NXT stars have a chance to gain more experience before they get a proper call up. In fact give Tyson Kidd a push as Nattie's douchebag husband and have Ricardo Rodriguez team up with a different NXT rookie under a mask every week with the running gag that one of the Los Locale's appearance changes each week, with for example Sami Zayn one week and then Mason Ryan the next.
ReplyDeleteFor 2003, I wouldn't have minded HHH being on top if the match ups were different. Booker T and Triple H probably could have put on an entertaining 2 month feud that would be fondly remembered except the build and result alienated people. I thought their WM match was good and I thought potential was there for a better rematch. Steiner-Trips and Nash-Trips were bad. Goldberg-Trips had an ok build at least.
ReplyDeletePlus, SmackDown was dominated by Vince, Hulk, Stephanie and Sable. They had a pretty good roster at the time. Brock, Benoit, Rhyno, Eddie, an improving Cena, Undertaker, Angle and cruiserweights. SmackDown in 2003 should have been better. Raw's roster was weak in 03 so I get why the show suffered. SD shouldn't have had that problem.
I'd go with 1995. Off the top of my head I can't think of any positives outside of Shawn and Bret matches.
ReplyDelete"Yeah, no problem...grumble grumble."
ReplyDeleteTotally off-topic, but anyone remember the original Zelda for the NES, where there'd be those guys in the dungeons that would say Grumble... Grumble... and you'd have to give them that food shit so they'd let you pass? Man, that pissed me off as kid, having to leave the fucking dungeon to go spend fucking rupees on the fucking food. How the hell did I even play video games before gamefaqs.com existed?
You're back!
ReplyDeleteYeah, the summer of 2009 Smackdown reminded me a lot of the Smackdown six glory days with all of those guys putting on fun matches every week.
ReplyDeleteThat would be great. "Los Local Dos sure has put on a lot of weight, hasn't he?"
ReplyDeleteTell me about it- I would ALWAYS get stuck on stupid shit like that, and then end up never playing the rented game again.
ReplyDeleteYeah, Yoko matches ALWAYS sucked. I was astounded to hear some people on the blog praising him as a "good worker" recently.
ReplyDeleteFuck, I really want to see that Los Locales gimmick. Why can't WWE creative have that creativity?
ReplyDeleteThe question wasn't about having a singles match between the two of them. They were late additions to the American team vs. evil foreigner team main event. Taker replaced Tatanka, Crush replaced one of the Rougeaus.
ReplyDeleteI have a soft spot for WWF '93 because that's when I started paying attention, along with a fondness for this show. It makes no sense because it was a pretty lackluster year.
ReplyDelete2002-2004 were a blur of suckitude.
ReplyDeleteI'd rather sit through the 1993 product than the shit that currently sits on USA and PPV.
ReplyDeleteCrush did the "trying to slam Yoko hurt my back" thing so he could get off the juice, got the big heel push coming back and then got arrested for buying more steroids.
ReplyDeleteHe just wasn't dependable.
I don't know how close to Survivor Series everything with Lawler went down, but they really couldn't use him for one night before taking him off TV until things cleared up? The PPV was sold on having two main event level matches, and with little notice, they took out the main reason one match takes place, and replace him with Shawn Michaels, who immediately ruins the story of the match by actually starting it and not hiding in the corner until he's the last one left, like Lawler was probably meant to do.
ReplyDeleteI think 1995 is as low as it gets. That was the year I kinda stopped watching. As noted elsewhere, you had the Dungeon of Doom idiocy in WCW, and up north, not only did you have Diesel, but you had KING FREAKING MABEL in the main event. You had Mabel, you had Sid, and meanwhile Bret was wrestling pirates and dentists. Terrible on all counts.
ReplyDeleteHere's how I remember '94: First, I think of Bret on top with the belt, having great matches with Owen and then Backlund, not to mention that 1-2-3 Kid match on Raw. Then, I think about the Wrestlemania X ladder match, and the generally good Kliq stuff that was happening around this time. THEN I get to the Million Dollar Corporation, which was decent for where it was on the card. The more I think about it, yes, I get to multiple Undertakers, midget clowns and bad Jerry Lawler matches, but the guys on top stick with me more.
ReplyDelete'95 is just about irredeemable.
Ya know, I really miss the disparate "Survivor Series" teams we used to get around that time - things like IRS teaming with Adam Bomb, or the Undertaker teaming with Henry Godwinn. It was fun to see how those different characters would interact.
ReplyDeleteI really want to see another team like that - Goldust, Bray, Fandango, and Sandow, for instance. Or Brock and 3MB, with Brock just demolishing his own team for the hell of it.
Maybe not financially, but 2012 and 2013 have got to be way up (down?) there in terms of quality. A quick recap:
ReplyDelete2012 - The Cena/Kane feud, Zach Ryder's further embarrassment, Punk being turned into another Cena-clone; the weak writing going into Rock/Cena, Bryan getting squashed at "WM", "CM Drunk", Cody getting de-pushed, John Laurinaitis, John Laurinaitis headlining a PPV, the never-ending Sheamus/ADR feud, Sheamus becoming another Cena-clone, Cena winning "MITB", Brock and Trips arguing over legal matters, Punk channeling Snidely Whiplash, "Raw" goes to three hours, Miz's hair-brained face-turn, ADR's out-of-the-blue face-turn, the ever-changing "Team Punk vs. Team Foley" match, and the continued mishandling of Ziggler.
2013 - Cena wins the "Rumble", Punk's title-reign is squashed by Rock, Rock sucking wind, Swagger getting a main-event push, "Rematch-O-Mania", a THIRD Brock/Trips match, MORE mishandling of Ziggler, Curtis Axel, Orton winning the "MITB", the absolute BOTCHING of Bryan's elevation via "abeyance", the "Wyatt Family" having zero direction, and "Raw" STILL being three hours.
Good things during that time? Brock's return and match with Cena, the "Extreme Rules 2012" PPV as a whole, the Punk/Bryan (Punk/Bryan/Kane/AJ) feud, "Team Hell No", "The Shield", Ziggler's MITB cash-in, Cena's matches with Punk and Bryan, some semblance of an idea that Punk and Bryan are being positioned as top faces, and... well, pretty much everything else was somewhere between average and terrible.
True enough. But booking and cartoon nonsense aside, 1995 featured a surprising amount of great matches. You had Michaels-Jarrett ,Hart-Lafitte and Hart-Bulldog on various IYH, Michaels-Ramon at Summerslam and Hart-Diesel at Survivor Series.
ReplyDeleteDefinitely. That was a great swan song (as far as ppvs) for him in the WWF. I have great nostalgia for this whole show.
ReplyDelete